Help - illegitimate child born before 2006

[paulw]

Hi, I'm new here and already the forum has been useful - thanks to all. My problem has been discussed in various threads, but mine is a particular twist. My daughter was born in 2005, she lives in Philippines with her mum. I am a full British national, already married (divorce not possible for now for various reasons), living and working in UK, though we manage to meet up regularly through the year. I support mum and daughter financially and we want British citizenhsip for her. She missed the new 2006 rules by a year and so we have a problem. The guidance on the Home Office web site implies that citizenship is normally provided if certain criteria are satisfied - which they are. However, the UK Boarder Control people have told me that in fact the application would almost certainly be turned down because we are not married and there is no evidence to suggest that she will live here in the future - which of course she can not so easily unless she is a citizen. This was shock. Has anyone else been here before and tried to apply in any case? Any ideas? I don't see why they should be so inconsiderate given that if she was born a year later she would have automatic citizenship. Thanks for any feedback and advice. Paul

[ginapeterb]

Hello Paul,

Sorry to hear of your dilemma, yes as you know after 2006, children born to UK Fathers of Filipino mothers, regardless of marriage, do have the right to claim and be Registered as British Citizens, sadly, its the old story, your daughter was born in 2005, and therefore has missed the boat by 1 year, tragic, but UK Border will tell you that the application would fail, since in there eyes, your daughter has not met the rules.

Its also now a matter of residency, if your daughter is unlikely to live with you in UK, then I suppose it would be hard to consider that citizenship is appropriate, it really is a matter for the Home Secretary to determine.

This to me is clearly one of not meeting the rules, rather than taking a sensible approach, you know what UK Border is like, and Naturalization and Immigration service, if it doesn't meet the rules its not valid.

Suggest you contact your MP that might help your situation, explain your case, and the circumstances, I personally have no experience of this, but felt compelled to offer you some support, it does stink as now unmarried British fathers to the Mother of the child can automatically have their child registered.

This legislation was passed to bring Fathers rights in UK, where the child was illegitimate the same rights as Women from UK.

Sorry I cannot be of further help, but wish you the best in your quest.

[paulw]

Thanks for that Pete - it really does stink and the web site is misleading. Citizenship in my view is not solely about residency. British citizenship is a valuable status to have whilst travelling or living abroad, so it doesn't seem right, particluarly as the 2006 law sees to acknowledge. I shall contact my MP though and see what help I can get.

[stretch33]

Hi Paul, I know i am in similar situation...... My son was born in June 06 just a couple of weeks before the change in July 06.....since then we have had a daughter (born Dec 08) so she qualifies for Brit passport) At least l'm not married over here so thats one less complication than you have. My fiance and l have been together for 4 years now and reckon we will get hitched up later this year or early next.......Have to decide to wait to apply for birth registration / british citizenship till after that or do it now. Would be interested to know how you get on .......maybe we can offer support to each other. Of course any other advice from members appreciated.
Cheers Phil

[Jenky]

Hi Paul W

My daughter was born in Phil in 2003 and my name is on her Filipio BC as her dad. At that time myself and her mother were not married. So at that time she did not qualify automatically for British Citizenship much to my suprise! So when I next visited the Phil I paid my application fee and together with her mum (as you have to both be there to sign various papers) we applied for her to be registered as a British Citizen under section 3(1) of the British Nationality Act of 1981 which is given at the "Home Secretaries descretion".

The form that you have to fill in was available on their website so I printed it out and just answered the questions along the line of that I wanted my daughter to have the same opportunities that I had as a child etc etc, and gave it back to the embassy. A few months later we received a letter saying she was granted British citizenship. And we got her British passport with no trouble. As it turned out our subsequent marriage made it all unnecessary but thats another story! So my advice to you is that if your name is on her NSO Filipino birth certificate as her father and that the mother / father relationship on it says "not married" as ours did then go ahead and just apply. I was quoted £2000 from a so called immigration specialist to assist me. I decided that I had nothing to lose by just doing it myself. At least if I failed they would have to tell me why! you might just be suprised at the result.

[paulw]

Hi Jenky

Thanks so much for your story - makes me much more hopeful! We will do that. Can I ask you a few questions? Did you declare any intention that your daughter would likely come to live with you in the UK or that you would be getting arried? Were you married to anyone in the UK or elsewhere at the tiee? Finally, how long did you have to stay in the Philippines for the application and where was the correspondence sent to? Thanks so much.

Paul

[paulw]

Happy to keep in touch on this one. I have been encouraged by Jenky's post. We will apply in the Philippines at the UK embassy.

[gm47]

Anyone know...can you register the birth here in the UK for citizenship (Birth not until April) ? how long do you have to do it ? I guess name on B.C wouldn't be enough... do you need a DNA test ??

any advice welcomed.

[Jenky]

Hi Paul.

To answer your questions. I did not declare an intention that my daughter would or would not definetly be coming to live with me in the UK because honestly at the time I did not know. So I did not commit to any definite answers on the application form. All that I said was that I wanted her to be able to have the same opportunities that I had when I was a child etc etc.

At that time I was still single but I had no plan to marry my wife. If we had a plan to marry then there would have been no need to apply because after our marriage she would become legitimate. So the authorities must assume I suppose that the mother and father will not be likely to be getting married any time soon or why else would they be spending money now on an application when a subsequent marriage between them would make it all unnecessary!

At that time the required application form was available as a download via a link on the British Embassy Manila website. And we made our application there. I just went to the consular section with my then girlfriend, because you both had to sign paternity forms in front of a witness. I paid the application fee in cash and submitted all of the required paperwork. It all took less than 30 minutes to do. If I remember correctly we applied in August 2004and we both received a seperate letter from the Home Office in December 2004 telling us that she has been registered as a British Citizen and can one of us go and pick up her certificate from the embassy in Manila.

Of course our two situations may be different and I cant guarantee that if you applied then you will be successfull. But my mind set at the time was that I was the father of a girl with a claim to British citizenship and I felt it was my responsibility to apply for it on her behalf even if I was refused. The questions are hard to answer on the application forms because nobody knows what will happen to you, your daughter or her mother in the future. The only fact is that you will have paid the application fee and together with her mother you have gone to the embassy in Manila and made an application on your daughters behalf. That shows commitment to her future wherever it lies. So go ahead and apply. You cant complain to your MP until you get turned down!

[paulw]

Jenky - thanks so much for this. It gives us so much hope and we will definitely apply in Manila. I just can't understand why I received such negative/pessimistic (though sympathetic) feedback from the UK authorities by phone. Paul

[Jenky]

Good luck Paul and let me know how you get on.

My gut feeling is that you will be ok so long as the paperwork is 100% in order especially regarding your daughters Filipino NSO birth cerificate (ie your name on it as the father and relationship "not married")
As you know if your daughter was born now then there would be no problem. Your problem is that like my daughter she was born before the rules got changed. but they changed it for a reason of sexual equality. So my guess is that they will not give you a hard time so long as the paperwork is in order.

Just do not commit yourself to definite yes or no answers on the application form unless you feel it will help your case. because a no in the wrong place will not look good.

[Jenky]

Hi Paul I just looked at the form that I filled in called MN1. It has changed a lot since I filled it in. But If you look at the top of page 8 in the link of "guidance notes" which specifically refer to applications under section 3(1) it says that we would "NORMALLY" register if...etc....etc........So from the information that you have given in your previous posts it looks to me that registration for your daughter is as near as damn automatic. The worst thing they can ask you to do is to take a DNA test. So just go to the embassy in Manila along with your Brit-Fil daughter and her mum! and you should be ok.

[paulw]

Well - that's interesting that you have noticed soe changes. As you say, since the legisaltion has changed to support dad's rights, you would think that they would take a flexible and positive approach - as with you. And the word 'Normally' seems to imply a good chance, as you say. Which is why, when I talked to the UK officials about this soe weeks ago, I was shocked at their negative tone and response that it is most unlikely that we would be successful. However, maybe they thought that I would be applying here in UK. It seems that in your case the mum applied, with your endorsement - is that right?

[Jenky]

Hi Paul. Like you I live in the UK and my understanding of the application process at the time indicated to me that it would be necessary for BOTH of us to be present when the application was made. Because part of the process involved us BOTH signing a form in front of a witness (embassy official) swearing that we were the real parents of our daughter and that my then girlfriend had no objections to her being registered as a UK citizen. So what I am saying is that we applied in Manila, in person, together. In an earlier post you said that you went to the Fil often. So hopefully this should not be a problem to you.

In fact even though it was not necessary we also took our daughter with us. I just thought that it would help our application if they could see her! Just a suggestion but you should consider taking your daughter with you also because maybe then they will be less inclined to give you a hard time (such as DNA test etc) if they are able to see all three of you in front of them.

I have recently been to the new Embassy in Manila to get my CNI and it is much improved from the old one. That was like Fort Knox to get into especially if you had a bag or mobile with you! But the new one is much better. Just present your photo ID and you can leave your bag and mobile etc inside a secure locker before you enter.