The Great Evolution Deception

[KeithD]

One of the reasons I stopped being a mod on this forum was I was sick and tired of all this fighting about religion, and here you are all, at it again.

:Erm: It a discussion between people of differing beliefs, not fighting, that is a different meaning altogether. And as long as no one directly slates another it is fine and healthy to talk about things like this on a free democratic forum, it certainly wouldn't be allowed in China, N Korea, Iran, etc

Piamed, most children are brainwashed with religion in this country from the day they learn to listen, you can't even go to a primary school that isn't in some way related to religion. I know been through, had it shoved down my throat, was baptised without my permission, basically forced into confimation by my peers, and all that is nothing short of mental child abuse.

[John Chingford]

John,

Thankyou for noticing my signature.
I originally had it as "One Life, Live It", but I noticed so many quotes from the bible in many other's signatures, I thought it would be good to get a little balance into the general flavour of this forum.
Thanks once again for reading my comments.

No problem! My answers are written because I respect you enough to take what you say seriously. I have no problem with your signature. I also think debate is healthy if spoken calmy and pleasantly

[David House]

Hang on, you are contradicting yourself...

You say you "tolerate" them, but if "they" try to explain what "they" believe you proceed to rubbish them.

You can't have it both ways.

I have only ever felt the need to respond to statements I believe are incorrect. I would much prefer not to have to do so, because those statements were not made in the first place. I "tolerate" the believers but only when they keep their beliefs to themselves. I think anyone can believe, and do, whatever they wish to provided it does not impact upon others in any way at all. It is when those beliefs are aired as justifications for taking a particular course that I find objectionable. I don't feel there is any contradiction in that position. I repeat what I said before. Beliefs are personal and should be kept that way. If we all followed that, as a golden rule, the whole world would be a better place in my opinion.

[aromulus]

Hi Aromulus. Let me first say that I think this website is absolutely amazing for information, debate etc. I LOVE IT!!!!!! As you are the boss, I must respect YOUR wishes.

Yep, the website is a creation of Win2Win and it is superb!:xxgrinning--00xx3:
No, I am not the boss, only a cog in the machinery.:NoNo:


Actually, I have been trying to bring the topic to an end myself, but every time I try, someone raises a question or statement (put in my direction). Is it not fair that I respond to it?
You could always ignore it.....:rolleyes:


Or is this website changing direction to a tolerant site only for non christians to say whatever they want but christians cannot? Is that not discrimination against quite a high number of people on this website? However, if you do not want me to say anymore on this thread I will stop now. But if I am criticised further - especially when someone says "see. John cannot answer that" it will be hard for me not to respond.

As a self professed Christian you can rise above that.... :D


Respect to you. I do understand what you are trying to do ie keep it all friendly. I accept that and agree with you. Everything I say, I say in a friendly way. If angry people respond badly - maybe the issue is inside them, not the fault of the topic

It doesn't matter where you are in the world, religious debate and topics tend to cause strife, unless you are in a dedicated forum, which this one, clearly, is not.:NoNo:

[aposhark]

:Erm: It a discussion between people of differing beliefs, not fighting, that is a different meaning altogether. And as long as no one directly slates another it is fine and healthy to talk about things like this on a free democratic forum, it certainly wouldn't be allowed in China, N Korea, Iran, etc

Piamed, most children are brainwashed with religion in this country from the day they learn to listen, you can't even go to a primary school that isn't in some way related to religion. I know been through, had it shoved down my throat, was baptised without my permission, basically forced into confimation by my peers, and all that is nothing short of mental child abuse.

I would give you a little "rep" for this but looks like you're not short on this score.......

[Piamed]

:Erm: It a discussion between people of differing beliefs, not fighting, that is a different meaning altogether. And as long as no one directly slates another it is fine and healthy to talk about things like this on a free democratic forum, it certainly wouldn't be allowed in China, N Korea, Iran, etc

Piamed, most children are brainwashed with religion in this country from the day they learn to listen, you can't even go to a primary school that isn't in some way related to religion. I know been through, had it shoved down my throat, was baptised without my permission, basically forced into confimation by my peers, and all that is nothing short of mental child abuse.

Hey boss, you had to pull me out of retirement!!! I would say that children being introduced to a religion early on in schools has going on for a long time. Having said that, PC and a lack of religious tolerance is meaning that it is no longer fashionabe to do so in many circles. Much of the rituals, etc we went through in school as we were coming up, was done out of tradition and did not really teach us much about the faith anyhow. To that extent I suppose it was systematic brainwashing which is definitely not a good thing. Although, it never led me to knowing God at all.

I'm not a snitch you understand, but I do believe some direct slating did occur. Obviously, I won't reveal his/her name but suffice to say this particular individual has been referred to by a plethora of terms. No, No! I won't say who it is ...ok, alright, it's .........!

[David House]

Same with me; i only ever seem to suffer in the UK. I guess the grass and tree pollen is uniquely British :)


I appreciate your observations but would say that there were at least two sets of beliefs introduced David. Please note that when population growth and poverty are discussed, it is quite common for a non-believer to introduce the notion that the blame sould be variously apportioned upon the Church, Catholicism, religion, etc. The believers summarily responded with their own view.

There are several fora where non-believers can discuss to their hearts content. Also, referring to high morals in this context is a tad facetious don't you think!

Let's be equitable. That is my final contribution.

I think there is a big difference in discussing the impact of Churches upon people and, for instance, their attitude to contraception, abortion and poverty and an individuals personal belief. The first is largely a political, social and economic debate whilst the second is..........personal. I have no problem in someone who has a set of values derived from a strong religious belief debating the first with me, provided they don't fall back upon the "God says so" argument. Just as an aside, I have recently been banned from an American right wing, religious based forum which encouraged "lively debate" and which was centred around a "pro-life" theme because I refused to accept "moderator correction". In other words I refused to accept their pre-determined, blinkered viewpoint and they ran out of effective arguments.

[Piamed]

I think there is a big difference in discussing the impact of Churches upon people and, for instance, their attitude to contraception, abortion and poverty and an individuals personal belief. The first is largely a political, social and economic debate whilst the second is..........personal. I have no problem in someone who has a set of values derived from a strong religious belief debating the first with me, provided they don't fall back upon the "God says so" argument. Just as an aside, I have recently been banned from an American right wing, religious based forum which encouraged "lively debate" and which was centred around a "pro-life" theme because I refused to accept "moderator correction". In other words I refused to accept their pre-determined, blinkered viewpoint and they ran out of effective arguments.:Erm:

[Mrs.JMajor]

Had enough now
What seem to be most inportant to them in this forum is being re-united with their husbands/fiancees. bringing up kids, finding and keeping jobs, visa processes, sending money to their loved ones at home, asking for advice on a wide variety of day to day issues, recipe swapping, photo swapping, making chika-chika, tampo,

Sorry, but this is what I believe guys:xxgrinning--00xx3:I dont even bother to read the longgggggggggggggggg post:doh:NoNo:

[aposhark]

.......Aposhark, you have shown again how bigoted and ignorant you are by rubbishing other peoples beliefs......

It looks like it was a good idea for you to forget moderator status, that wasn't very moderate in my book......

I would however, like to compliment aromulus with his moderator hat on.
It cannot be easy to moderate two groups of distinct and differing beliefs.
"Well done, son" :-)

[ukgangster]

It looks like it was a good idea for you to forget moderator status, that wasn't very moderate in my book......


No problem, if you found my post offensive, all you need to do is to report it :xxgrinning--00xx3:

As a ordinary member I'm allowed to say what I like within reason and within forum rules, and if you can't accept that, not my problem. Like I said, you can always report my post if you find it offensive.

[aposhark]

No problem, if you found my post offensive, all you need to do is to report it :xxgrinning--00xx3:

As a ordinary member I'm allowed to say what I like within reason and within forum rules, and if you can't accept that, not my problem. Like I said, you can always report my post if you find it offensive.

I thought I did :-)

[bornatbirth]

And the wind-up merchant......:Erm:

Please keep off the grass.:xxgrinning--00xx3:

who me?? :D

doesnt look like i need to wind anyone up in this thread!,there doing a good job by myselfs? :NoNo:

it seems strange that we cant have a civil debate involving religion but what seems stranger ??? we cant even mention god in this forum!

[KeithD]

we cant even mention god in this forum!
You just did!! :Erm: ...and if you relpy, my guess is the bolt of lightning missed you :rolleyes:

As for evolution....the church used to burn people alive for questioning the FACT that everything revolved around the Earth. Yep, they definitely got that FACT correct :doh

You can tell that it is not correct with a simple experiment using marbles. Move them with with what you see, Earth, Sun, Venus, Jupiter, Saturn & Venus, and you see for yourself over a number of days they all move around the Sun.

[Mrs.JMajor]

doesnt look like i need to wind anyone up in this thread!,there doing a good job by myselfs? :NoNo:
it seems strange that we cant have a civil debate involving religion but what seems stranger ??? we cant even mention god in this forum!

Go go go bornabirth :icon_lol:

[nparvus1202]

To all Christians here, I would like to say that not all can be answered by the Bible as it was not written in detail. Science is important to explain a lot of things. If Bible was in detail, we might have 1000+ volumes. A lot of things were still not clear to people before. Like virus or bacteria, if God said "Don't do this as you will get bacteria and virus" And people will ask, Virus? bacteria? What is it Lord? So we must rely on science and time.

As for the dinosaurs, if you read Gen 1:1 it says " In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth." Gen 1:2 "And the earth was without form, and void..." . Now if you examine carefully, how on earth that a newly created world is already without form and void? So in theory, Gen 1:1 and Gen 1:2 is divided by time could be millions or billions of time to make earth formless and void. And dinosaurs could have lived before Gen 1:2.

Now for the Big Bang theory. As in Gen 1:1, God might have created the planets and suns way way way too Big! And since God cannot undo what he has done, he made this big big big creations to collide which scientists now called the big bang theory and created billions of stars and planets inside many galaxies now that supports both the bible and the theory.

Now if you believe in God, you should also believe that God is a scientist, a doctor, a mathematician or else the universe is now dead. There is no deception, God just let the people learn and discover things overtime.

[aromulus]

who me?? :D
!

If the cap fits...............:D


Go go go bornabirth :icon_lol:

More like "drownedatbirth"..........:omg:

[KeithD]

....God just let the people learn and discover things overtime.
Like how to get rid of ants with petrol :D

[aposhark]

"God" (Aposhark's italics inserted) just let the people learn and discover things overtime.

As long as it was time and a half :-)

[nparvus1202]

Like how to get rid of ants with petrol :D

Yep, that's one. And if you light it up, what will happen. Good or bad, we learn from it.
In this debate I believe more in the study of science. Whatever is written in the Bible, whether it is real or not is not complete. Bible proponents think that the Bible is complete and they could challenge science, no you can't.

Also do people wonder why everything in the universe is oval, round or spherical? No cube planets or rectangular sun or square orbits. I don't know. I will take my time and a half overtime now.