A Surreal Future Awaits - a bit of stress

[HopeUK]

Hi Peeps!

You know, it’s almost as though my joining this forum has acted as a catalyst for turmoil in my relationship. Now I seem to be seeking some sense of perspective..

My gf was supposed to be getting in touch for a Facebook chat this weekend for, amongst other things, whatever it is that she has wanted to speak so importantly about. She emailed me to let me know that she couldn’t chat as arranged as she had errands to run (which I’m thinking are related to the end of this rainbow..) but said she’d get in touch ”tomorrow”. Come “tomorrow” I waited patiently for her, but with no show I thought to text her to let her know I was online (9am here, 5pm there) and hoping to hear from her soon! She got in touch a couple of hours later with a text reply saying that her parents are having a financial problem and she’s afraid she won’t be able to take her IELT (which if I recall rightly is coming up in March) - she wanted to cry. She said she wished I was there to comfort her and didn’t know where to turn for help or what was she going to do. I tried to encourage her to come online but she said that she couldn’t presently get online to talk and she was restless.. but she’d be coming on line in the morning (7am there, 11pm here) and if I was available we could perhaps talk, and that she misses me. I told her I’d be here for the chat, that I missed her too and not to worry, with reassurance that things will work out xxx.

At around this point I began to hear the bell-ringing of many a laboured and destroyed soul.. but I have to say my own personal judgment (impartial in this situation I hasten to add) thinks this still genuine. Her mom was in hospital recently which may explain their difficulties, and I don’t know anything of her parent’s working circumstances. She has never raised money issues before. Playing devil’s advocate for a moment , if this whole relationship WERE a scam it is a most patient and elaborate one. I would have thought that there are more than enough dating sites from which to choose to perform such duplicitous practices, and with far greater odds of success.

Bear with me in this next bit..

I think in my mind I have chosen to try and help her if the situation doesn’t resolve itself between now and April. Approaching this clinically, I would want to ask whether her exam can wait a bit longer (if there is a money issue then I don’t think there’d be much choice in the situation anyway?). It is true that I cannot afford to help her at the moment but I may be able to by the time we get together – from looking I’m guessing it would typically be costing around £100? If when we get together all is “good/real”, real problems are still there, and there really is a genuine love to nurture, then I will be more than happy to help out, as surely as though we were together as bf/gf here in the UK.

So, I appear to have a solution to my problem.. Why post all this? Assuming I have struck a good balance between compassion and wisdom, what I am seeking from other seasoned members here is some independent reassurance that I am not being overly suspicious, harsh or cruel. Any mortal man (or woman) will appreciate that the last thing I wish to do is hurt her – the Buddhist part of me wouldn’t want to hurt her even if she were ‘scamming’ – god knows unless she were really immoral there would be real reasons for her resorting to such desperate measures. What I’m afraid of here is whether my conclusions and chosen actions are equally as good? Do you believe she would understand my caution should she choose to openly ask me for help rather than just hinting the possibility, as it perhaps felt she was doing? I don’t wish to suggest openly to her that she might be pulling a scam - doing so might well cause irreparable damage by a possible misunderstood moment, but after all we haven’t met yet have we..!? Still, her Facebook account, friends, emails, chats and behaviour seem so real and genuine I feel really bad for not accepting her more at her word, or reading her text simply as a girl who is sad at facing the prospect of not being able to take her IELT, and in need of real help. I feel as though my self-preservation might inadvertently really be me using, and by mis-action, hurting her to protect myself.

Help..

[South-east boy]

I don't blame you for thinking this as with the stores that we hear, it's only natural to wonder if a similar thing is starting to happen. With Suzie the girl that I was in contact with, she had mentioned things like he had bad wisdom toothache, but couldn't afford to get it looked at, she needed a fancy dress for her works Xmas do, but couldn't afford a new one and that they had money worries after her Dad had died. Like you, I wasn't sure if she was hinting at me sending money or not, but after what I have read hear and many other places, I wasn't going to send her money before seeing her.

I did however send her & her family a large parcel for Xmas & her Birthday in December which did cost me a lot. Then after Xmas she went quiet and it eventually turned out that a Danish guy had gone to see her, stayed with her and she said that she is in love with him, has found the love of her life and will be getting married soon! So all the thought, effort and money (about £420 with the courier, customs & VAT and item value-I had no idea that I had sent so much or that the courier, customs & VAT would be so much) was completely wasted and I was left quite hurt.

Just because you didn't meet on a dating site, does not mean that she hasn't been on them or that she isn't thinking like some Filipinos that all people in the west are loaded as we earn so much more. Yes, we earn lots more, but the cost of living is a lot higher too.

If I was you, I'd let things run, see what she says, be cautious, don't send any money until after you see her and see that she is genuine/the right girl for you. Some guys on hear have offered money to their girl and they have refused to accept any, even though they might really need it. That's when you know that she is not after your money and the type of girl that you want. :xxgrinning--00xx3: She might never ask and you could be worrying over nothing as well of course.

If you wish to read them, these are my threads about sending the parcel: http://filipinaroses.com/showthread.php?t=20825 and when I was worrying when I hadn't heard from her & what happened: http://filipinaroses.com/showthread.php?t=21444 (sorry that that thread is very long!). After her being a bit quiet and reasons not to speak, with what happened to me, I'd be a bit worried, but of course it could all be genuine- it's one of the problems/worries with LDR's!

[joebloggs]

seeing you haven't met yet, and even if you had met her there is a possibility that you could be scammed, so you should be cautious when you're asked for money:NoNo:

avoiding you for what ever reason could be a warning sign, thou maybe she doesn't have the money to go online ? helping to pay her moms hospital bill ?

yes ielts is expensive, probably the same price as the uk, over £100, which for many filipinos is 2wks pay.


you should go and see her asap, or help her this once and ask for a copy of the ielts cert, if she doesn't give it you, or ask for more cash :cwm23:

[joebloggs]

I did however send her & her family a large parcel for Xmas & her Birthday in December which did cost me a lot. Then after Xmas she went quiet and it eventually turned out that a Danish guy had gone to see her, stayed with her and she said that she is in love with him, has found the love of her life and will be getting married soon! So all the thought, effort and money (about £420 with the courier, customs & VAT and item value) was completely wasted and I was left quite hurt.

Some guts on hear have offered money to their girl and they have refused to accept any, even though they might really need it. That's when you know that she is not after your money and the type of girl that you want. :xxgrinning--00xx3:

the Danish guy went to see her and south-east boy you didn't :NoNo: when you start a relationship you really have to go and see them asap, i was lucky, my misses told me if i didn't come by such a date dont come at all, dates pasted a few times and warnings if i didnt come dont come at all, and for what ever reason i couldn't/didn't go ( i went to see her nearly 2yrs after first chatting to her :NoNo:).. delays and distance will only cause problems, so go and see her asap. that way you have a better idea where you both stand :rolleyes:

i'm one of them guys who offered my misses alot of money without ever meeting her first (enough to pay her uni fees at medical school for a yr) she wouldn't take it, but after realising she would have to drop out of uni for a yr, she accepted the money, but then i got a letter off her mom telling me kindly to :censored: :icon_lol: and she would get her thru uni at any cost, anyway it took me weeks to persuade her mom to take the money from me, :Rasp: but true :icon_lol: things were never easy,she had to stay in the phils 2yrs after we married until she finished med school. but hey married 7yrs and still together :rolleyes:

[pennybarry]

My niece paid arount 8,600 pesos for her IELTS. I sent her money and she said she passed and I can check her rating at British Council website in Manila. I said no need for me to check as long as you have no boyfriend. :)

You can check the IELTS schedule here.
http://www.britishcouncil.org/nov09-mar10_test_dates.pdf
Ask her what date she is going to take her exam. They need to pay month before they take their exam.

[triple5]

It's always about the money :doh Chances are she's not a scammer, but like a lot of filipinas she may be thinking she's hit the jackpot with you and she's expecting you to start coughing up now.

Like Joe, I sent money (wasnt a great ammount) before we met in person, but I was certain it was for a good cause and I could afford it. It worried me at the time I may have opened a can of worms and there'd be all sorts of requests coming. Luckily, so far none. That's the risk you take, if you start sending money it may start costing a fortune as other sob stories start flooding in.

Tell her your struggling to save for the flight over there and would rather save your money to visit her. Ask what would she rather have - you or the money :icon_lol:

[South-east boy]

the Danish guy went to see her and south-east boy you didn't :NoNo: when you start a relationship you really have to go and see them asap, i was lucky, my misses told me if i didn't come by such a date dont come at all, dates pasted a few times and warnings if i didnt come dont come at all, and for what ever reason i couldn't/didn't go ( i went to see her nearly 2yrs after first chatting to her :NoNo:).. delays and distance will only cause problems, so go and see her asap. that way you have a better idea where you both stand :rolleyes:

As I have said before, she never asked, she was sometimes busy so couldn't send emails or be on the phone etc, she said that she wasn't on dating sites, never said that she was desperate to get married and I never lied to her about my financial situation, so I thought that she was ok with how things were. How was I to know? I also thought I'd need to stay in a hotel, so would need even more money, so I thought that the trip was even further away. The Danish guy stayed with her and her family. If she had given me the time that your lady did I would have seen her if things were going well between us (I was planning to this year), but she only gave me a few months before she went for the Danish stranger. She also never said to me when I said about the presents and asked for make-up "don't spend it on presents, spend it on coming to see me". If she had said these things and also found more time to contact me (it's a bit hard when you send emails and texts, but don't get many replies), then I could have done it and felt more inclined to, although money would have been tight. You hear of lots of couples however busy they are making time so they can chat by going to bed later or earlier etc and I just didn't get a strong enough feeling from her to make me see her. I'm not going to fly half way around the world and spend that money unless they feel strong enough for me and I with them.

If it was true and that she hadn't seen or had contact with the Danish guy beforehand, then this is the 2nd time that she has/is getting engaged at the first time of meeting someone that she has had no prior contact with. How can you know a prior total stranger well enough to get married after just a few fays of seeing them? Anyone can easily put on a false front for a few days, you need time to really know each other-some time in person, but also by email and phone as if they are genuine, you do get to know someone that way too.

[HopeUK]

Thanks for your thoughts on the matter friends!

My main worry is just feeling bad in the face of what in all likelihood does feel like a genuine situation - I expect later down the line I'd be thanking my conscience for being cautious if it does all go t%ts up, but for the moment I'm going with something like your line on this I think SouthEastBoy. Wait and see. I take your point that Facebook isn't "immune" or that she doesn't have a possible impression of westerners as more wealthy, but she is aware that it has been a fiscal stretch for me to visit her, so she must surely be at least slightly aware that I'm likely not loaded (and also perhaps sees that my heart is therefore genuine, and seeking the "real thing" - I've told her already that I'm not after a "disrespectful holiday fling" - none of this aspect could have been made clearer to her).

Joe, point taken on visiting ASAP. I felt like this when we stated a mutual interest in getting together - I fully expected it to be more like October 2010 or even April 2011 before we could make it happen but I made every effort to make it as early as I could, and I'm going on first week of April - as sure a sign of intent and genuine commitment from me towards the friendship as I could muster, beyond mere words (more advice from the forum which I took to heart, about cultural matters of talk being considered cheap and Filipino's appreciating actions to back words up). I have to take her word for it, but when we were discussing our relationship status in a past email she told me that she had been "boyfriend"-less for three years to date and that she was waiting for the right person. She is also aware from my words that she is the only woman I am courting (this is true, incidentally). As I say, the plan is to get together with her to provide a way for us both to prove our relationship in what I like to call the "real world".

For me here, today, it's all about me trying to be comfortable with my own stance in the face of questions, which she maybe can't provide a good enough answer to without body language and eye contact to back it up. She shouldn't have any doubts as to my own integrity - I've expressed both undying respect and a willingness to meet her parents.

I reiterate again that she hasn't actually asked for anything - it's just me "seeing" a perceived implication, and she hasn't had a "shopping list" of things she would like in any past conversation either.

[South-east boy]

It's always about the money :doh Chances are she's not a scammer, but like a lot of filipinas she may be thinking she's hit the jackpot with you and she's expecting you to start coughing up now.

Tell her your struggling to save for the flight over there and would rather save your money to visit her. Ask what would she rather have - you or the money :icon_lol:

Good point! :xxgrinning--00xx3: This is what I should have said and done, then if what happened, happened (and I hadn't booked the flight yet, but was still saving for the trip), then I could have spent it/had it ready to see someone else who really did want me.

[HopeUK]

Penny, thanks for the test dates site - if nothing else, that will be helpful for helping her reschedule the test if all is okay and I go ahead and help out. :)

[HopeUK]

In the interests of getting to see her ASAP I have already made the committment to the holiday - Don't get me wrong, I'll still feel hung, drawn and quartered if it all goes pear-shaped but I can console myself with my first ever solo holiday, a bit of an adventure and (assuming it goes okay) the personal confidence I need to know that I can go anywhere and really do it, with only funds stopping me!

Still, with all this, do you think my waiting until we meet before helping (assuming she's still in need by then) is a reasonable compromise between potentially putting her through difficult anxiety and being on the safe side for myself?

[joebloggs]

I reiterate again that she hasn't actually asked for anything - it's just me "seeing" a perceived implication, and she hasn't had a "shopping list" of things she would like in any past conversation either.

maybe she's waiting to see if you offer to help ?

i'm just warning you, not to make the mistakes i made, thinking she will wait forever for you to come and see her :NoNo: she may well think you're never going to come and see her, and so she'll move on to the next guy, who does go and see her..

south east boy, but you spent £400+ sending her stuff, you could have bought an air-ticket for nearly that.. but many of us have done the same :doh

yes most are not scammers, but money is a problem to many Filipinos, and she could be telling the truth about the elits and her parents finances, so she could tell a white lie to get money from you to help her parents, or even be pressured by them to see if she can get money from you, but you know i would give her the benefit of the doubt unless you have evidence of her scamming..

i could have accused my misses many times thru the years , but each time i gave her the benefit of the doubt and said nothing, and as far as i can tell, she always told the truth. :rolleyes:

[triple5]

Whereabouts is she and how long you going for? I always go with the intention of having a great holiday regardless of how things pan out with the lady in question. You just never know, as cool as things may seem online or on the phone theres no substitute for face to face chat. Your doing the right thing getting out there asap :xxgrinning--00xx3: Sooner you really start getting to know each other the better. Problem is when you do start getting close it's time to come home again :doh

[joebloggs]

Still, with all this, do you think my waiting until we meet before helping (assuming she's still in need by then) is a reasonable compromise between potentially putting her through difficult anxiety and being on the safe side for myself?

it depends also what she thinks :D
she needs alot of time to prepare for the exam, its not easy for some filipinos to pass first time, and i think she needs a average of 6 or 7 for a nurse to pass.
and some struggle of the speech side of the test.

if it doesn't work out with you and your gal, you can still have a great time, move on and go and meet other filipino ladies :rolleyes:

[HopeUK]

hmm..

Joe - I am actually going and she does know I'm on my way - arriving there April 2nd. I quote myself in a different context from earler, to say that unless she is "really immoral" there hopefully isn't anyone for her to move on to..

Triple5 - She's based in Manila, family in Legazpi City, and I'm visiting her ostensibly for two weeks (I might have plumped for Feb but we would have only had the one week if I had, so April felt like a compromise for the better!)

[HopeUK]

The coming home part is something I've been getting counselling for from another friend who is married to a Japanese lady and has walked a similar path.. He told me about his being "distraught" - it's an irony that I'm committed to a path of significant pain either way..

[South-east boy]

south east boy, but you spent £400+ sending her stuff, you could have bought an air-ticket for nearly that.. but many of us have done the same :doh


Oh yes, I know, I even said that to her and it's what I find so frustrating. :doh As I bought the bits now and again, I didn't notice how much I had spent until I had to add up the value for the courier company/customs/VAT people, the courier came to more than I thought and I didn't know about the customs/VAT charge of £82 which I had to pay as Suzie couldn't. I think I must have spent over £600 on her what with phonecards, text loads, extra mobile phone etc, etc. She did ok as she got a guy and all the gifts from me, where I ended with nothing and the thought that all the effort/the thought etc seemed to mean nothing to her. :cwm24:

[joebloggs]

hey don't blame yourself it's easily done, I've sent my misses alot more than that b4 i met her :NoNo:

as for the vat/customs last jan we sent 2 large boxes to the phils, and didn't get asked to pay vat/custom :Erm:


there are many decent beautiful filipinas out there, I've met many of them, you just need to find one of your own

don't give up :rolleyes:

[Sim11UK]

In the interests of getting to see her ASAP I have already made the committment to the holiday - Don't get me wrong, I'll still feel hung, drawn and quartered if it all goes pear-shaped but I can console myself with my first ever solo holiday, a bit of an adventure and (assuming it goes okay) the personal confidence I need to know that I can go anywhere and really do it, with only funds stopping me!

Still, with all this, do you think my waiting until we meet before helping (assuming she's still in need by then) is a reasonable compromise between potentially putting her through difficult anxiety and being on the safe side for myself?

I think your above paragraph, is the best way, to conduct your relationship. Seems to me to be the sensible route, to take, regarding money.

It's good you've got your trip booked, we all face the uncertainty, of how we will get on in person.
Another thing often overlooked, is how we actually react to being in the Philippines. For some people, for whatever reason, it may just not be for them. Getting over there earlyish, can help to iron a lot of these problems out & help to build the basis of a good relationship. :)

[HopeUK]

Exactly Sim11UK - though reconsidering the situation it may be that I'm making a very "western" mountain out of a molehill - on the optimistic side it's not inconceivable that it may be that she is feeling a little Filipino pride with the financial problems and wanting to tell me about it but without asking.. She might already be worrying about how I will perceive her talking about it, afraid that I'm going to run, fearing her to be pulling a scam!??

I have been quite conscious of the fact that to get together ASAP is a very good way of starting off - it shows a positive committment to the friendship, let's her know that I am prepared to put what is necessary into the two of us and, as you say, clears matters up from the outset. A good relationship is where it's at! I could write a whole lot more and expand this topic beyond all recognition with the philisophical chat I've been having with a real world friend this evening (might start a new thread on the matter if it comes to a conclusion!) - As an aside I was reading your escapades with the Filipina/boyfriend/overbearing family/arranged marriage worry before this thread started.. I haven't finished reading it yet, so forgive me if it is harmfully irrelevant to bring it up but it just goes to show that it is universally so easy to pick up a stick and beat yourself with it in error (or not beat yourself when you should!).. LDR's eh?

[Sim11UK]

As an aside I was reading your escapades with the Filipina/boyfriend/overbearing family/arranged marriage worry before this thread started.. I haven't finished reading it yet, so forgive me if it is harmfully irrelevant to bring it up but it just goes to show that it is universally so easy to pick up a stick and beat yourself with it in error (or not beat yourself when you should!).. LDR's eh?

It's all relevant these LDR's can be so hard, as you are starting to find out for yourself. Unfortunately, it's all part of it. I wouldn't think there is anyone here, who could say it was all plain sailing & an easy ride.

[HopeUK]

This is true - but as I have just been discussing in my "real world" conversation, one of the matters which has arisen has been how more "mature" you might consider LDR's to be. There is the downside, the doubt, the frustrations, the misunderstandings, (the latter two points particularly relevant to cross-cultural LDR's), but the upside is that it forces communication to a point where even if it isn't initially amazingly deep, it will still likely reveal more about each person than a typical chat in a club or bar, and that's just before the new "couple" instantly throw themselves at each other in the name of sexual fulfilment! LDR's force the pace to be a little slower to say the least.. and to me that's a GOOD thing. I'm not afraid to look to myself (peel back the layers as Peter Gabriel once implied), and realise that the reason I am fretting so much over my relationship with my filipina is because the pace has forced me to look deeper and try harder - I always have been a deep person and never a one night stand kind of guy anyway (that eastern side to me which I mentioned in my introduction I suspect..) but other past relationships have all been noticeably quicker paced than the present one,which is my first cross-cultural dating experience. In spite of the up's and down's I have to admit, at the core I have never felt anything as amazing.

[HopeUK]

JacksonAlan.. an interesting dilemma indeed - I can only think from ALL OF THIS, that perhaps the best method of approaching all these concerns may be to simply try and focus the heart of the discussions we have with our prospective partners above money somehow. It seems that we ALL share these money worries - Filipino concepts of western wages, and the reality that it is all actually relative, are pointed out time and again across numerous forums - and there ARE real money worries where the Philippines are concerned, it's true.. but surely the prime reason for us being here is love - the only, true motivator. Both Filipino and western people each have their own issues - but for money to become empowered enough to break up a fledgling relationship is plain wrong. I suppose both parties have a responsibility to ensure that money doesn't become the "dutch elm disease" of the sprouting relationship, any more than you might say tolerate the drunk at the bar repeatedly trying to pull your girlfriend, in front of your own face. As always it seems to be a matter of good communication - how that matter is brought up and talked about from a distance without either party getting upset.. that's the real trick I suspect. Discuss..

[joebloggs]

I've followed this thread with interest and I'm not about to offer more advice, rather to add my own story, because I'm in the situation of having paid my girlfriend's nursing study fees and subsistence for several months since we "met" online. She hopes to graduate in nursing this April, but she's cost me so much that I now can't afford to fly out for the graduation. Apparently the graduation ceremony itself is to cost 10,000 pesos, in addition to the monthly fee of 4000 pesos, then the licensure examination will cost 15,000 pesos. Several people (on the forum and outside) have warned about the perils of sending money to someone I have yet to meet, and raised the possibility that she is a scammer, although I have no proof of this.

i've been in the same situation Alan, but i asked her for receipts, my misses was only starting her second year at med school so your lucky that your g/f finishes in April :D, i had to support my misses for the next 5yrs after that :doh, yes those fees and more are probably right for a nurse..

:yikes:the 15,000php for the license exam must be wrong, i think my misses paid only a few 100php !!!.

[joebloggs]

:doh:yikes: Alan

i think the graduation ceremony (which i went to) my misses paid about 1,000php for each person attending, the prc exam fee as i've said, my misses thinks she paid only a few 100php, the 4,000php fee could be right..


get the receipts Alan :Erm:

[Arthur Little]

[I][SIZE="3"]Several people (on the forum and outside) have warned about the perils of sending money to someone I have yet to meet, and raised the possibility that she is a scammer, although I have no proof of this.

I really HATE asking this Alan ... but have you any proof she's NOT [a scammer]? :cwm24:

[triple5]

but she's cost me so much that I now can't afford to fly out for the graduation.


It's been money that I could afford

Same as Arthur, don't really like to ask, but it seems you have some issues there with what you're paying out. You know you can pull the plug at any time, whether you can afford it or not.

Apologies to HopeUK, hope it doesn't seem like your thread's getting derailed here.

[joebloggs]

Sorry Joe, I had just replied to your earlier post. The 4,000 php is every month, the 10,000 is for the venue, "dress/toga" (the words she used), and "other graduation needs" ; over and above food (4000php), travelling, apartment rent(5000php), water, electricity, internet access, of about 18000php. As I said, that might not be outrageous for a romantic relationship in the UK, but for someone I have yet to meet ...:doh

well the figures my misses gave me are from 5yrs ago, so it will be a bit more than the ones i've stated. but i wouldn't have thought much more..

yes 4,000 a month fees could be right, as we paid 3,000+ for my misses cousin,

10,000php just for then venue ? like i said my wife paid no where near that.

tarveling,rent,water,elecy,inet = 18k ?


my misses has just found her PRC exam fee, in 2005 the fee was 600php, the registration fee was 600php and a yearly fee of 450php

you know the pass rate for nursing board exam is about 40% !.

ask for receipts if your suspicious Alan.

having said that PRC registration is only about 600php, unlike the £415 it is for the gmc :NoNo:, i'm off to the gmc in Manchester to give them my wifes intern-ship cert, cgs cert, its been one hell of a long journey Alan, so be prepared for a possible bumpy ride :NoNo:

[Sim11UK]

Sorry Joe, I had just replied to your earlier post. The 4,000 php is every month, the 10,000 is for the venue, "dress/toga" (the words she used), and "other graduation needs" ; over and above food (4000php), travelling, apartment rent(5000php), water, electricity, internet access, of about 18000php. As I said, that might not be outrageous for a romantic relationship in the UK, but for someone I have yet to meet ...:doh

Alan this is quite troubling to read?
You've sort of got yourself into a mess, you should never have got into.
I'm not sure of some of the above figures, travelling electricity etc.? Do you mean every month???

Once you start giving, it becomes impossible to stop, which in turn becomes a vicious circle, as you now struggle, to afford a trip out there.

You don't owe anybody anything, at least until you have met.

[justchecking]

I'm slightly unclear, but 18000php living costs plus fees - I lived in the philippines with my husband and daughter and usually had one or two family members to feed at least twice a day, and my monthly living costs (no internet though) were around 18-20php - this may not seem outrageous by your standards, but its pretty good living for a single person in the philippines

[joebloggs]

Once you start giving, it becomes impossible to stop, which in turn becomes a vicious circle, as you now struggle, to afford a trip out there.

You don't owe anybody anything, at least until you have met.

wise words there :rolleyes:

though i've been there and done the same thing, and like i said b4, we've been married more than 7yrs...


so ask for receipts and go and see her asap, that way you'll have a better idea Alan where you really stand.

[HopeUK]

"Wise words indeed, and thanks for all the advice on this thread, which I'm sorry to have "hijacked" "

That's okay man.. :) lol

For all those who have helped (including yourself Alan!) many thanks. The situation is ongong as I write. I won't slavishly bore you with the details as they are at the moment but we appear to be having more communication difficulties:


- a broken promise from Saturday of talking again online on Sunday

- A slightly innacurate "will be online to chat at about 7am her time" text which would have been at 4am local time rather than 11pm local time, as she'd said

- Her quick wall chat with a friend in Facebook at 4am, and not a single word back to my heartfelt message of support in her inbox, after all that fretting yesterday (yes, its possible she missed it, but not likely as she has said in the past that she hangs on my every message)


I have decided to let the ball lie in her court for a bit and see what happens..

[South-east boy]

Sorry to hear about more little hassles. Am a bit confused about what you said about the times & chatting!

I have to say that is one thing that bugs me is when you see that they have been online on wherever it is but not replied to you. Of course like you said it might have been possible that she missed it or didn't have time to reply, but personally I'd prefer a short message just lettting me know. Maybe on Facebook it's worth writing a little message on her wall saying that you have sent her a message to her in-box, then she won't be able to miss it.

These latest little hassle are all part of the problems that you get with LDR's and while I always start off trusting someone (as I don't think it's a good start if you don't), after what's happened before (& being lied to when they were meant to be strong catholic Christians, so I thought more honest) I'll be more cautious until they have proved to me that they are honest and true to their word.

Like you say, wait on her and see if she can keep a bit more to what she says & if she can't then to let you know, so you don't worry.

[HopeUK]

Hi SEB,

Let me clear up the time thing.. sorry. She'd added on the end of her "IELT problems" email that she would be online at 7am her time and perhaps we could talk then if I was still up (her 7am would be my 11pm GMT last night). I stayed up until 1:30 GMT (which would have been 9:30am her time) - from the Facebook timing on her "friend chat" which said "2 hours ago" when I looked at 6:00am my time this morning, that would have made her online activity to have been between about 3am and 4am, which would finally have been between 11am and 12 noon her time. You know how tricky the timing can be with these things.

As we seem to have agreed there man, because of the inherent comms difficulties we're having all I can really do now is wait and see if it sorts itself out.. or if there's a big string along happening - I do hope not because up to now she has seemed okay. Let's just hope it's me looking with "western eyes" and a lack of sleep..

[HopeUK]

The main source of stress for me in all this is that since she went to her mom's the personal emailing seems to have stopped. She has in the past gone a week or so and apologised before answering and conversing once more, but for about the past month all she's done email-wise is apologise and say that she will get to writing replies. We have text chatted but I kinda miss those emails to excitedly read you know? The Facebook wall note is an idea.. I just didn't think to do that - me eye usually goes to the inbox.. my fault perhaps with that one..

[triple5]

My last time in Phils I was chatting with a few expats who had been out there for years and there biggest gripe about filipinos was "breaking promises" and "poor time keeping". I wouldn't fret too much at the moment. Maybe she's playing hard to get until she sees some dollar :D

[triple5]

The main source of stress for me in all this is that since she went to her mom's the personal emailing she has stopped emailing me with any replies/conversations. She has in the past gone a week or so and apologied before answering and conversing once more, but for about the past month all she's done email-wise is apologise and say that she will get to writing replies.

tbh, that's not a good sign. Both SEB and I have been in the position where they vanished for a week, and it ultimately spelled bad news. hope its not the same in your case.

[HopeUK]

I know about the timekeeping thing in the Filipino culture - to be honest I'd rather us be a bit less anal than we are, rather than having us expect to change their ways.. it's just another cultural thing! - and this is coming from someone who is legendarily punctual and on the ball! :) BUT, as for money as I say (and I said this to her in last nights email, although I paraphrase here..), I would help at the moment if I could but the holiday has wiped me out. If the relationship proves itself when we meet I will be more willing to help her, and will likely be able to by then. I'm just averse to giving a relatively large sum of money out to a stranger - and with the best of my heart and all the will in the world, she really is still that stranger (more so if she isn't going to take the time to nurture our friendship). That sounds harsher than I mean it to. She has had a lot on her plate lately with her mom being rushed into hospital with blood pressure problems, but it has felt like a bit of a one-way street of late in spite of the fact that she may very well have been having difficulties "internet"ing in the province. She is back in Manila now though, thus my thoughts of "wait and see".

[Bluebirdjones]

Also .... ask her if she knows where Copenhagen is ...
... or if she's learning Danish.

Both of these are bad signs too !

[triple5]

I'm just averse to giving a relatively large sum of money out to a stranger - and with the best of my heart and all the will in the world, she really is still that stranger (more so if she isn't going to take the time to nurture our friendship).

Stick to ya guns :xxgrinning--00xx3:

[HopeUK]

I suppose there might also be a possibility that I email TOO much..? lol

[HopeUK]

Yeah, cheers Triple5.. To be honest she does keep putting that she misses me and asks if I miss her into her texts when we have tried and failed.. the heart isn't really missing I suppose but it just feels like there coule be more "flesh on the bones".. I'll stick to my guns and see what happens.. Keep ya posted - thanks for the thoughts again guys/gals..

I don't think she's danish..

[HopeUK]

No probs Alan - hope the style comes together (for us all!!) :)

[South-east boy]

I do know that over there they have more Internet down times and black outs than we have here, so it could possibly be that. I guess it's not cheap for her to text you, so if you got the other mobile phone which is unlocked, then the smart or globe roaming sim card, then it would only be the 1pesos for her to text you. So then, although she might not have time to write a decent email or to chat on Facebook/Yahoo etc, she can't say that she doesn't have time to text you or that she doesn't have enough money to either as 1pesos os very cheap. I feel that if you did this, and she still is quiet, then there is a high chance something else going on and it doesn't bode well.

[HopeUK]

Yeah SEB I can appreciate the internet downtime - when we've chatted on Facebook she's logged off and changed cafe's before now, due to connectivity problems. As I say, we've had Chikka, which personally I think has been "variable" in performance but she has been using that - it was her suggestion to sign up to it actually because it reduced her texts to something silly like 1.50PHP, as you similarly noted. I told her about your suggestion with the roaming OFW's choice of contact in a recent email (thanks again for that - I've sourced play.com as a good site for unlocked sim-free phones!) and if ultimately all is okay between us I will be doing this - Chikka relays the network of the other person in the settings, so I perhaps inadvertently know which network she's on.. no probs. We'll just see what comes out in the wash. As an aside, if anyone has any personal ideas/recommendations on what a single guy can legitimately do to pass the time in Manila (without getting his passport confiscated) I'd appreciate some suggestions just in case.. lol. Joking aside though, thanks again and I'll keep in touch as and when things go up or downhill :)

[IainBusby]

Yeah SEB I can appreciate the internet downtime - when we've chatted on Facebook she's logged off and changed cafe's before now, due to connectivity problems. As I say, we've had Chikka, which personally I think has been "variable" in performance but she has been using that - it was her suggestion to sign up to it actually because it reduced her texts to something silly like 1.50PHP, as you similarly noted. I told her about your suggestion with the roaming OFW's choice of contact ina recent email (thanks again for that - I've sourced play.com as a good sight for unlocked sim-free phones!) and if ultimately all is okay between us I will be doing this - Chikka relays the network of the other person in the settings, so I perhaps inadvertently know which network she's on.. no probs. We'll just see what comes out in the wash. As an aside, if anyone has any personal ideas/recommendations on what a single guy can legitimately do to pass the time in Manila (without getting his passport confiscated) I'd appreciate some suggestions just in case.. lol. Joking aside though, thanks again and I'll keep in touch as and when things go up or downhill :)

I can't believe you have never seen this girl on a webcam, all of the web cafes in Phils have webcams and finding an single/available girl in Phils who doesn't have at least one yahoo messenger ID would be quite rare, especially in Manila, the suburbs of Manila, or any big city in city in Phils.

Yahoo messenger is the normal communication method used by Filipina's and westerners to conduct an LDR and it's hardly rocket science. I personally couldn't see myself conducting an LDR by text and email, they are just extras. From the first time I met my wife online, we chatted on messenger almost every day, usually for an hour or two at a time.

IMHO when a Filipina decides that she has found the right man, she'll move heaven and earth to get to that web cafe. More than once I can remember my wife eventually coming online distressed and in tears because there had been a brownout and she thought I might have given up waiting for her gone to bed already.

Take my advice, get yourself a yahoo ID and a webcam, invest some time in making it all work properly and then you will be able to chat properly with her, see her reaction to what you say and she will see how you react to what she says... Texting and email is far too abstract and unreal to conduct a successful LDR in my opinion.

[HopeUK]

Hi Iain,

I have seen this girl on webcam my friend - we did do a yahoo messenger connection and I saw her clear as day - for some unknown reason I couldn't do anything to get my webcam to connect at her end (I am an IT tech as it happens, and there was nothing I could do to remedy the situation). The guy presumably running the place at the other end did appear to have a poke about but it didn't happen, so we continued as we did and haven't really had an opportunity to mess about since - all that happened just prior to her having to disappear to the province to help her mom. As contact has been a litle spurious since then I suppose we haven't really had a chance or thought on to try again. I agree that it would be the best way of doing it but as she is reliant on cafe's for our contact it has I suppose been easier (not to mention tricky because of the sporadic contact) to not try again and just concentrate on that which has worked reliably for us thus far. I agree that perhaps we should have a go again (I had thought that recently), if we can get some regular contact going again now she's back in Manila. To be honest man, it wouldn't surprise me to find that they have a better than average quality of public connection provision over there than we do here, knowing the priorities we seem to have in the UK when it comes to good broadband (lol).

[IainBusby]

Hi Iain,

I have seen this girl on webcam my friend - we did do a yahoo messenger connection and I saw her clear as day - for some unknown reason I couldn't do anything to get my webcam to connect at her end (I am an IT tech as it happens, and there was nothing I could do to remedy the situation). The guy presumably running the place at the other end did appear to have a poke about but it didn't happen, so we continued as we did and haven't really had an opportunity to mess about since - all that happened just prior to her having to disappear to the province to help her mom. As contact has been a litle spurious since then I suppose we haven't really had a chance or thought on to try again. I agree that it would be the best way of doing it but as she is reliant on cafe's for our contact it has I suppose been easier (not to mention tricky because of the sporadic contact) to not try again and just concentrate on that which has worked reliably for us thus far. I agree that perhaps we should have a go again (I had thought that recently), if we can get some regular contact going again now she's back in Manila. To be honest man, it wouldn't surprise me to find that they have a better than average quality of public connection provision over there than we do here, knowing the priorities we seem to have in the UK when it comes to good broadband (lol).

I chatted to lots of different ladies before I found my (now) wife and decided she was the one for me and although there were bandwidth problems with webcams from time to time, on the whole it seemed to work most of the time. What seems a bit strange to me with regard to your lady friend is her (what seems to me from what you have said) lack of enthusiasm. I just couldn't imagine my wife, or many of the other girls I chatted to for that matter, being online and posting messages to someone else and not communicating with me.

[triple5]

all that happened just prior to her having to disappear to the province to help her mom.

that's what my first filipina gf used as an excuse when she was actually getting married :yikes: Iain's right in what he says about the communication, not taking the time to reply to your message but others does seem a little strange if she's supposedly keen on you :Erm:

[joebloggs]

Wise words indeed, and thanks for all the advice on this thread, which I'm sorry to have "hijacked":ARsurrender: It also explains why on other threads I've had difficulty "lightening up" recently:doh Yes, the figures are monthly (school fee = 4000php, apartment rent=5000php, electricity 2000php, water 700php, internet access 2000php, school "fare and food" 4000php, totalling 17700php. None of this is receipted. In the near future, the graduation cost and licensure examination ...:NoNo:
I'm aware of the low pass rate and on the Nursing thread have posted details about registration requirements for nurses wishing to work in the UK; even if they graduate they need to work a full year in Philippine hospital(s) first.
I've enjoyed learning from, and contributing to, the forum:), and been reluctant until now to share my situation here. However, I've already said others have privately voiced their concerns:yikes: By nature I'm compassionate:)
But you have all helped me decide : the vicious circle of giving more and more HAS to end, and I owe nothing more to someone I haven't met:NoNo: I really DO want to re visit the Philippines after many years' absence (President Marcos has long since gone:BouncyHappy:) and it's suddenly become affordable :)




Alan, as i've said b4 i've done the same thing as you..

how did your g/f survive before she met you online Alan ?

why does she need you to pay for most if not all her bills now ?

take it one step at a time, your g/f has not even graduated yet, and will probably need time to revise for the PRC exam ( in nov?) like i said that should only cost 600php? so keep hold of your money until she really needs it.

it's always possible you're being scammed, more likely your being 'used' a bit ( as i think my misses did to me :D) your g/f has gone from relying on someone else (parents???) or had to work to get herself thru uni, and now you've come along and everything is paid for her :D (i'm sure you've told her you use to be a doc and well she thinks your :REGamblMoney01HL1:)

like everyone else has said, go and met the lady asap.

also be careful, don't accuse her of anything( not without evidence), a few times, i could have, nearly did accuse the misses of taking the :piss2:, but i didn't and when i finally met her, and years later, I know i was never scammed by her, but maybe 'used' a bit :D

goodluck. and go and see her :xxgrinning--00xx3:

[HopeUK]

Triple, Iain.. thanks for cheering me up guys!! lol.. I know what you saying - perhaps I'm just trying to find a little faith in the situation. It did wind me up somewhat this morning to find that she had come online later than she said she was going to, and hadn't left any kind of message, although in fairness it was more of a statement email passing my thoughts and moral support on to her regarding her recent problems, and didn't have any direct question as such except, ironically, a wish for her to keep in touch.. lol. Also I was looking at it on the back of four hours sleep. Her 'other conversations' were actually a couple of wall posts rather than full on email ramblings, so I guess any of us can jump in a Facebook moment and do that.

From the outset this whole friendship was formed on a random shout out and she has seemed as keen as mustard in our conversations that we get together, with fun emails about our daily lives and finding out about each other - the thrust and parry of very mild innuendo.. She was textually 'bouncing off the walls' when I told her I was on my way in April, sooner than either of us expected (I know you didn't mean it to imply relevance here, but this doesn't sound like a woman who is imminently marrying.. lol). I have made her "thump" as she has put it on more than one occasion, with words of romance and little real life connections. It doesn't seem possible that it's all been in my head - to read back the emails we have sent, they don't seem like the ravings of someone who is having a practical joke on a 'dumbass westerner'. We've struggled through the problems of getting online whilst she's been tending to her family matters at home, chatted through Facebook and made what I felt was a firm commitment (backed up by real actions) to get together. We've exchanged phone numbers and have talked to each other to keep in touch when it became really difficult to get it together - I guess I'm a little hesitant to call her, discretion being the better part of valour at the moment, because I might come across as a little confrontational in my tired state - something to be avoided with Filipina relations I suspect. I just don't wanna give up on her spontaneously because it may just happen to be that she really IS engrossed in trying to sort her bits out - she has after all just returned back to her home in Manila after a month away and now seems faced with an insurmountable problem of paying her IELT exam. Unless the last four months HAVE all been make believe?! Okay, I grant that fact that this morning has dented things a little, maybe mostly because I was hoping for some kind of response to my desire and inability to help her out financially - whether it be a plea or a sudden rush to deny any implications of seeking financial help in her message. On the other hand..

Might she feel that she is now trapped in an embarrassing situation regarding her exam and/or likely having doubts as to how to handle the problem?

Maybe she is questioning her faith in me as well, since I was forced by my honesty to admit that I couldn't help her in her moment of need due to me having exhausted my resources on getting to actually be with her?

Maybe she's trying to decide if I'm BEING honest when push comes to shove?

Perhaps she's a little pi**ed that I wasn't online or unable to help? (this one isn't quite her jovial and bouncy self though)

Maybe she simply overslept and made a quick best of a down situation?!!

That's a lot of maybe's and possibly's and I could probably go on. The relevant bit of her actual message read "but il b online tomorow morning around 7am. If youre available at that hour,my time. Perhaps we could talk. Imizu gav". Now, it reads like she was going on anyway and we just missed each other, yet again..

Time I suspect will tell. I've always stressed that we should be able to manage so long as we keep being honest and open when we do talk. I suppose I'm just not yet ready to believe that she is heartless enough to cast off, and to not even be able to say to me as a friend "I'm sorry but I can't meet up with you in April because...". Maybe (for me this time) it's me who's tired and struggling through the closing eight weeks or so just wishing it would come sooner.. Maybe I'm just tired? This last week has been pretty shocking, even by my standards.

[Sim11UK]

Just phone her tomorrow...you'll drive yourself crazy at this rate.:Cuckoo:

The boss sells phonecards, see above, or use 'Phone cheap' 0871 343 0009 9p a minute, to her mobile.

You wont have much of that hair left soon, if you don't. :yikes:

[triple5]

Just phone her tomorrow...you'll drive yourself crazy at this rate.:Cuckoo:

The boss sells phonecards, see above, or use 'Phone cheap' 0871 343 0009 9p a minute, to her mobile.

You wont have much of that hair left soon, if you don't. :yikes:

Hope Keith's paying you a commission sim :rolleyes:

[Sim11UK]

Hope Keith's paying you a commission sim :rolleyes:

I'm expecting a cheque anyday now, or maybe through paypal. :REGamblMoney01HL1: :BouncyHappy:

[sars_notd_virus]

I think your above paragraph, is the best way, to conduct your relationship. Seems to me to be the sensible route, to take, regarding money.

It's good you've got your trip booked, we all face the uncertainty, of how we will get on in person.
Another thing often overlooked, is how we actually react to being in the Philippines. For some people, for whatever reason, it may just not be for them. Getting over there earlyish, can help to iron a lot of these problems out & help to build the basis of a good relationship.

Meet ur girl in real...




'''DON'T BE SERIOUS....BE SINCERE'''

[HopeUK]

Hey Sim11, thank you for worrying about my hair mate.. it's all quite intact (runs strong in the family you know.. :) ).. a little silver here and there, but that's pretty normal too I assure you. Cheers too to Sars for your words.. It seemed appropriate to grab the bull by the horns where meeting in the flesh is concerned – as you say so much can remain unquantifiable without that personal touch – and at a natural point (scam or not) the chit-chat did reach a nexus. In the end it’s also the only true way to get a peek at the end of the rainbow, isn’t it?!

Just as faith was being tested, she dropped me her addresses for Manila and Lagazpi yesterday - ASIS (Assuming She Isn't Scamming - I decided to create an acronym just for this post). I’d suggested in a past email that being able to write a real letter to her would be a wonderful way to nearly touch for real. Ironically, it was a missing piece I was mulling over yesterday, as it happens. Cheers for the phone tip too - I usually call her through "Planet Numbers" or "Just Call" depending upon who's working best at the time.. :xxgrinning--00xx3:

Okay, whilst enjoying a particularly relaxing bath last night I tried to take all points in this whole situation and bring them together into a plan, which involves me both helping her and not helping her at the same time - affording me the chance to offer a genuine friend help in her hour of need whilst simultaneously keeping a possible scam at arm’s length. In view of her ‘difficulties’ I looked to the British Council site for information on the IELT exams, timetables and costs and have offered a cautious olive branch - I have suggested that as the timing of the exam is compromised by her "situation" anyway, that she should see it as a fateful opportunity rather than a nightmare. She has me visiting her in a few weeks time, so if it isn’t crucial that she passes BY March, why not delay the exam and avail herself of both the opportunity for further study, and a chance to learn from a real Englishman, possibly gaining extra valuable experience in use and pronunciation to nudge her score up a point or two? I admitted in my last email, which was basically one of moral support, that I couldn't help her right now (true) but in the interest of moving the whole problem forwards (thereby avoiding hair loss, Sim) I have since proposed that I may be able to “assist” her in a couple of months, ie. by April, ostensibly when we get together (also true) - not "pay for it in full", even though I will in all probability be able to - another possible sweetener to the olive branch which I could consider granting to her as a nice surprise if all IS beyond doubt and above board, family intervention notwithstanding (read on for this bit!). I figured by saying “assist” this would serve multiple strands of argument; as a genuine statement to the effect that I am not a bottomless well of money to be plundered/dipped into, whilst also helping keep her Filipina pride intact and give her a real chance (ASIS).

Like many who have been here before me, I'm trying to find a 'fine' balance in response to a difficult situation, where the honest Filipinas are trapped and the scammers walk - where the most successful place to pull a scam seems to be that grey area, where the honest situation and a downright bare-faced lie can become blurred, and consequently difficult or impossible to distil – in turn, the place where keen sense and faith play their part. Again, like most of us, it is with best intentions, and some of that faith, that I choose to do all this and it should grant me valuable time and real face to face experience to help better ascertain her motives, whilst at the same time appearing minimally mistrusting and non-aggressive toward her, should she be in genuine need of help in a bad time - something which to be fair a lot of Filipino's have experience of.

She has since replied overnight, with understandable happiness and gratitude (a possible scam alert I know, I’m not looking with tinted specs), but on balance she has quoted all facts as they are presented (the costs, exam details and her expected pass requirements) and is happy for me to “assist” - she didn’t say “pay for”, as a possible prompt. She has said that she can’t ask her friends as they too are on tight budgets (could go both ways in the argument but at least from her friends’ sides I would imagine this is likely), but I anticipate the possibility of having her parents at least attempt to meet me half way - my next suggestion. She is their daughter after all - and the outcome of this line will have its share of balances and judgments to be made too.

Being something of a Buddhist and looking at the overall pitfalls and potential promise, as well as the numerous accounts of both joy and woe (to quote a previous posted reply in here) I would consider £115 to be a relatively small price to pay (some accounts of HEAVY losses in this forum!) for the possibility of what so many of you can testify to as being one of the best things to ever happen. In all likelihood I have some karma to pay back anyhow. Maybe now is simply the nexus at which I cough up. I hope this goes some way to satisfying both supporters and detractors in my ongoing adventure.

[joebloggs]

I’d suggested in a past email that being able to write a real letter to her would be a wonderful way to nearly touch for real.

Being something of a Buddhist .

if your relationship does go further, snail mail makes excellent evidence when applying for a visa :rolleyes:

i thought you might be a buddhist or something similar, you think toooo much :crazy:

:D (coming from a veggy of nearly 30yrs :Rasp:)

and your post are sooo long , i've only got 30mins for my lunch break :doh

but good luck :xxgrinning--00xx3:

[HopeUK]

Yeah thanks for the vote of confidence Joe - Buddhist by nature I would say, not actual practising except for the beliefs in compassion, tolerance and patience (sometimes.. lol). Sorry about the length of these posts.. a lot to think about!

[arkwright]

I've tried to read all the posts so I apologise for repetition.
Why haven't you come here? If you search for a cheap flight, The Philippines is not an expensive ( but inconvenient ) destination.

If you come here go to the internet cafe's and see the girl's chatting on line to numerous "boyfriends". As a foreigner they don't want to speak to me, and I'm sitting next to them, Why? draw your own conclusions.

Would you give a stranger money on the street in your town? If the answer is no, then YOU have to come here and see for yr self

My g/f's family doesn't trust me as all englishmen are vampires (think peter cushing, hammer house of horrors 1970's) but I'm here having paid for the last year of my g/f degree and now paying for her brother education (1 more to come) and it's been worth every peso..

[pennybarry]

Yeah thanks for the vote of confidence Joe - Buddhist by nature I would say, not actual practising except for the beliefs in compassion, tolerance and patience (sometimes.. lol). Sorry about the length of these posts.. a lot to think about!

To be honest, I don't understand girlfriends who asking money especially if you have not yet met personally.
If I met my BF personally and he talks too much about money although I don't even asked,
I'll give him my huge NO to a relationship. Goodbye british!:D:76:

Just give her your big NO if you think and talk a lot. IHMO.

[HopeUK]

Hi Peeps!

Everyone seems to be under the impression that she has literally said 'give me money!!'. She texted me with her situation but didn't explicity ask for anything - merely stated that "she was sad because.." and didn't know what to do or where to turn. In response I have chosen to give a helping hand to a potential girlfriend. I know (and others have told me) that it also sounds like an implicit or empathetic attempt to provoke the knee-jerk response "That's okay, I'll give you what you need!" - I grant that is quite possibly the case, but I don't know that for sure yet. I can assure all those concerned that I am entering this situation with an open mind and (more importantly to me personally) an open heart - I don't feel like I'm being condemned to an endless and inescapable financial drain by this venture. If it were to get out of hand, then yes that would be the end of the matter - lesson learned, case closed, move on. I think by not being afraid to invest some heart and soul in the situation it would truly prove her to be an immoral person not worthy of attention if that 'invested emotion' were betrayed for a quick 8000PHP, and consequently I would have no problems emotionally separating myself from her. At this point I'm not giving anything 'real' away except for my advice, moral support and understanding. I have offered the possibility of "assistance", giving us a way forwards (in all fairness what kind of an impression would it make to say a straight "no" to a potential girlfriend if this is genuine? that would bring the issue to a dead stop without anything learned or understood on either side). I have also enquired as to what her parent's financial problems actually are and have suggested a joint effort, should their sense of "amor proprio" given them cause for embarrassment.

For all the scam situations out there I'm sure many people will testify to their having experienced genuine situations as well, where they have helped their friends and loved ones in time of need. I was under the impression that helpfulness, politeness and cooperation were even considered valuable character traits within Filipino culture? There's nothing wrong with being on guard but I also cannot see any reason to blindly assume the worst without some measure of reason when nothing has explicity "changed hands". Or am I wrong? To my mind, automatic assumptions without all the facts is in itself immoral, and something of a slippery slope in many ways. The simple facts of this friendship/romance are of a man and a woman who have met on the net, invested enough conversation to make a connection, and after her acceptance of my request of right to court her, have forged a plan to get together to see if there is more.

[justchecking]

Hi HopeUK, It sounds to me from your last post that you are now very clear in your mind as to what has already happened in terms of creating a potential relationship, and are realistically aware of the two-sided coin of scam/genuine need - you have decided that it needs to be given a chance - so go give it a chance and dont dwell too hard on the 'what ifs' - after all 'what if you never gave yourself a chance to find out for sure'.

I nearly let rational thought and practical problems stand in the way of my heart - its never going to be plain sailing in a relationship of severely unequitable finances, there's different paths for dealing with this for us all - i think you have chosen your first steps, so start enjoying planning for your trip with your 'eyes wide open'....

[HopeUK]

Thank you 'justchecking'! Do I take it by the line "I nearly let rational thought and practical problems stand in the way of my heart" implies you ARE in a happy situation?

[Dedworth]

I'm afraid I can't offer any comment or advice HopeUK other than to wish you good luck but in a voyeuristic kind of way I look forward to further instalments :)

[HopeUK]

Thanks Dedworth!! If you do have any points to raise, please feel free! I welcome any input, and I'll add any worthy installments as I go.. Feel free to indulge your voyeuristic tendencies! :)

[aromulus]

i

:D (coming from a veggy of nearly 30yrs :Rasp:)



it shows.....:omg:

:doh

[HopeUK]

Hey Peeps,

Just thought to post a little now the deadline is nearly upon us.. For Dedworth - sorry there's been nothing new to report friend (haha!). The Trip to Acuatico Beach Resort is organised (for one night, may extend to two if they aren't too busy, and its as good as it looks), the hotel stay in Manila is sorted and my girl's IELT exam is underway this week. She'll get her results whilst I'm still over there so that will either make for a cheerful or disappointing end to the holiday (hopefully the former!!).

So, come what may, the holiday begins from next Thursday.. via Amsterdam (as all travellers to the East will have been to at some point, I'm sure :icon_lol:). She'll be meeting me at NAIA and its onwards to "the undiscovered country" from there..

Wish us luck!? :heartshape1:

[Arthur Little]

Hey Peeps,

Just thought to post a little now the deadline is nearly upon us.. For Dedworth - sorry there's been nothing new to report friend (haha!). The Trip to Acuatico Beach Resort is organised (for one night, may extend to two if they aren't too busy, and its as good as it looks), the hotel stay in Manila is sorted and my girl's IELT exam is underway this week. She'll get her results whilst I'm still over there so that will either make for a cheerful or disappointing end to the holiday (hopefully the former!!).

So, come what may, the holiday begins from next Thursday.. via Amsterdam (as all travellers to the East will have been to at some point, I'm sure :icon_lol:). She'll be meeting me at NAIA and its onwards to "the undiscovered country" from there..

Wish us luck!? :heartshape1:

:) Nice to see you back online, Gav ... and all of us wish you bon voyage on your BIG adventure! :xxgrinning--00xx3: Good Luck also, to your girlfriend with her IELTS exam. :icon_win:

[Notavirusalso]

Cool..Have a great time Hope....

[Dedworth]

Hey Peeps,

Just thought to post a little now the deadline is nearly upon us.. For Dedworth - sorry there's been nothing new to report friend (haha!). The Trip to Acuatico Beach Resort is organised (for one night, may extend to two if they aren't too busy, and its as good as it looks), the hotel stay in Manila is sorted and my girl's IELT exam is underway this week. She'll get her results whilst I'm still over there so that will either make for a cheerful or disappointing end to the holiday (hopefully the former!!).

So, come what may, the holiday begins from next Thursday.. via Amsterdam (as all travellers to the East will have been to at some point, I'm sure :icon_lol:). She'll be meeting me at NAIA and its onwards to "the undiscovered country" from there..

Wish us luck!? :heartshape1:

Good luck, have a great time and enjoy it :xxgrinning--00xx3:

[aposhark]

Hey Peeps,

Just thought to post a little now the deadline is nearly upon us.. For Dedworth - sorry there's been nothing new to report friend (haha!). The Trip to Acuatico Beach Resort is organised (for one night, may extend to two if they aren't too busy, and its as good as it looks), the hotel stay in Manila is sorted and my girl's IELT exam is underway this week. She'll get her results whilst I'm still over there so that will either make for a cheerful or disappointing end to the holiday (hopefully the former!!).

So, come what may, the holiday begins from next Thursday.. via Amsterdam (as all travellers to the East will have been to at some point, I'm sure :icon_lol:). She'll be meeting me at NAIA and its onwards to "the undiscovered country" from there..

Wish us luck!? :heartshape1:

Have a great time over there, I am sure you will have fun :xxgrinning--00xx3:

[liane]

Enjoy your time and Good luck :xxgrinning--00xx3:

[Florge]

April? wow... right in the middle of the scorching summer sun in the Philippines... hehehe... have fun..

My 2 pence worth: do not send money for as long as you can... if she's working, she can feed herself... else, the sending would be an precedent of many more... unless you got loads of cash to spare, then do so. .. and some my way... LOL

[HopeUK]

Hi Peeps,

In spite of my journey across to meet with my girlfriend, she seems to have disappeared from communication. The last call I made was on Saturday - it was cut off and I couldn't get back to her. It's been 72 hours - no effort has been made on her end to get in touch with me.. no facebook.. no email, no messenger.. no text.. Is any of this normal? Can anyone give me one good reason why I shouldn't pull the plug on this whole damn thing?!!

[triple5]

3 days? It's hardly very long. I wouldn't panic just yet.

[South-east boy]

3 days? It's hardly very long. I wouldn't panic just yet.

While it is a little worrying, Like Triple5 says, I wouldn't pannic just yet. If there are internet problems that accounts for most of the possible ways of contact not being available. Quite often I've thought the worst only for there to be a decent explanation.

[Dedworth]

I hope HopeUK that you are still travelling Thursday

[keithAngel]

Hi Peeps,

In spite of my journey across to meet with my girlfriend, she seems to have disappeared from communication. The last call I made was on Saturday - it was cut off and I couldn't get back to her. It's been 72 hours - no effort has been made on her end to get in touch with me.. no facebook.. no email, no messenger.. no text.. Is any of this normal? Can anyone give me one good reason why I shouldn't pull the plug on this whole damn thing?!!

I dont have all the details but you did actually meet? im in country i will ask the boss to forward my email and hence mobile if you want to talk its not unheard of for the bottle to go

[South-east boy]

I hope HopeUK that you are still travelling Thursday

Yeah, hope you heard from her and everything is back on track? Have a great time over there and let us know when you can how everyting went.

[South-east boy]

I dont have all the details but you did actually meet? im in country i will ask the boss to forward my email and hence mobile if you want to talk its not unheard of for the bottle to go

He is due to fly out today Keith. Like I just mentioned I hope everything is now ok for him.

[keithAngel]

ok it came up in the chat last night no-one was sure

[HopeUK]

Well, so much for that - we met for a whole two hours.. She went to grab her bits from home as she'd just got back from Legaspi and then she calls to tell me her dad wants her to come home to meet up with a visiting aunt.

I'm on my way home as fast as I can sort anything out - I do not wish to stop here one minute longer - all the purpose has gone

Thanks for all your support anyhow guys.. I have to be magnanimous about that

:Brick:

Peace!

[Sim11UK]

HopeUK I'm sorry things haven't worked out...can't remember, are you in Manila?

Take a flight to Bohol (panglao island) or Boracay, such a shame to come straight home. Really, you could have a great time...There is so much to explore.

Don't let this unfortunate incident, ruin your enjoyment of the Philippines. :)


Come on folks! give him some more help & encouragement.

[sars_notd_virus]

Hi HopeUK!!! forget about the girl u've been with for 2hrs:angry:
Go and Enjoy your stay in the beautiful Islands of the Philippines!!!..:):xxgrinning--00xx3:
We can never can tell??:Erm:who knows,u might meet someone who is worthy of your trip in the ph..its summer here and everyone is out and about..(including real people with good heart:heartshape1:)
Goodluck!!

[keithAngel]

hop over to cebu hope plenty of hope here the boss has my mobile

[Steve.r]

Hope, I am sorry to hear that. But, as your username states, stay hopeful that you can enjoy the rest of your holiday. There is so much to see, you will enjoy just being there. You will find lots of happy smiling faces wherever you look, why not try to strike conversation with a 'real' girl and see where it goes, don't be down on the whole place because this one girl played you.

Keep in touch and let us know where you end up, it could be the start of something far better for you. :)

[triple5]

NOOO! Don't come back :NoNo: Go and enjoy yourself:xxgrinning--00xx3: Plenty to do, and easy enough to meet other girls :heartshape1:

Was there just no chemistry there when you met? Could be all sorts of reasons why she couldn't stick around. Maybe has strict parents. Who knows.

Good luck pal :xxgrinning--00xx3:

[Ladybug_sim]

Well, so much for that - we met for a whole two hours.. She went to grab her bits from home as she'd just got back from Legaspi and then she calls to tell me her dad wants her to come home to meet up with a visiting aunt.

I'm on my way home as fast as I can sort anything out - I do not wish to stop here one minute longer - all the purpose has gone

Thanks for all your support anyhow guys.. I have to be magnanimous about that

:Brick:

Peace!

Hi! HopeUK, we feel sorry for the things happen. Sometimes we never expect but at least you know who she is now in person... just leave it for an experience for the woman once you love... move on and think that she is not worthy to be with you...it is not the end for the road of love... I know it is too frustrating but since you are here now in Philippines you need to explore your self and have a big chance to know some people even women too... enjoy your vacation here not focus your self with her as what she done to you it is her big lost to her self not yours... If you have change just have a flight to be here in Cagayan de Oro we can meet you at Lumbia Airport and tour you some good places here or met my friend too as she is interested to find the man who will love her but for now you need just to meet her first so if you know each other well time to go with your life for that things. Don't make any rush you need to enjoy your life on your vacation... we have lots of members here offering too or have an open arms for you here in the Philippines... even here in Mindanao.

Just keep in touch .. we will not lost you here anytime you need help... always do hope someday you will find the best woman in your life coz you are still young at your ages too many women will adore and love you just keep things be ok and be happy ...

All the best for you
Ladybug and SimUk

[Doc Alan]

Come on folks! give him some more help & encouragement.


Here's my full support, Hope :xxgrinning--00xx3:
I'm off to the beautiful Philippines in less than 5 weeks and I will NOT be coming home early, whatever happens !

[liane]

Sorry to hear about it. Just try to enjoy your stay in the Philippines even without her. She isn't worthy of your time. Maybe during your stay you will meet someone and that would be the start of something new :)
Keep hoping for the best :xxgrinning--00xx3:

[Ladybug_sim]

Here's my full support, Hope :xxgrinning--00xx3:
I'm off to the beautiful Philippines in less than 5 weeks and I will NOT be coming home early, whatever happens !

Good to hear Doc Alan, we will looking forward that things for you soon.. :xxgrinning--00xx3: always be positive and hope HopeUK be ok to his travel here too... wish he will enjoy his life and forget that girl once for his day of vacation :rolleyes: and have some more :heartshape1: to offer once he find the right one again :xxgrinning--00xx3:

[South-east boy]

Sorry to hear what happened Gavin. So were you not going top meet up again? Or did it seem clear that the 2 hours was all that she had time for?

Like the others say, seeming as you are there, make the most of it, try and enjoy yourself and who knows what might happen? Some of the guys on the forum here met their partners whilst out there. Keep it touch and I'm sure that other forum members will try and help you all they can.

[raynaputi]

enjoy the Philippines while you're still here..there are plenty of girls here like what they all said..you'll never know, all these just happened as just a way to meet the right girl ;):xxgrinning--00xx3:

[aromulus]

hop over to cebu hope plenty of hope here the boss has my mobile

And so has half the island..............:D

[keithAngel]

And so has half the island..............:D

:76:

[HopeUK]

Hi Peeps,

Well in spite of your support I'm afraid I plumped to come home. I'm in Schiphol as I type.. I thought about staying but in the end I just couldnt afford to be touring and setting myself up staying different places. My budget had only really allowed for this one stop. Sad I guess, but that's that. Life goes on.. My next bit yet to come is getting home from Manchester - trains stop pathetically early.. may have to crash and get one in morning - all the cheap hotels are booked up of course, so airport lounge for one, methinks.

Did kinda spoil everything though - didn't have the heart to stay.

Thanks everyone anyhow. Lesson learned.

Peace!

[Arthur Little]

:omg: I'm really sorry about the way things turned out for you, mate. What a truly despicable thing for any woman to do! If it's any consolation, something similar happened to ME ... admittedly it was only in Dublin - as opposed to the other side of the globe - but still ... ! Anyway, that's another story ...

[Dedworth]

Very sorry to here all this HopeUK

[keithAngel]

I had hoped you would ring but I understand Bummer man but as you say lesson learned its always good to have a fall back plan and an exit statergy:xxgrinning--00xx3:

[complex]

Hi Gavin, I and my wife have been following your story with interest the last couple of days and we are really sad to hear how it turned out, was hoping you would have stayed in the Philippines like the others were encouraging you to.
I'm a bit confused by what actually happened when you met the girl, can you enlighten us a bit more. 2 hours? how was she with you when you met? Just seems odd why she would bother showing at all if she's scamming you, unless she thought she would get the jackpot then and after meeting you she realised she wouldn't, just doesn't make sense!
Well if you would care to share more about your meeting once you have recovered from your journey I'm sure we would all be interested to here what went down.

Thanks, take care and keep your head up.
Lee & Rose

[Doc Alan]

Thanks everyone anyhow. Lesson learned.

Peace!Thanks for telling us and I respect your decision. But don't be too hard on yourself Gavin. If we're honest ALL of us have made mistakes because our judgement proved wrong. Hindsight is a wonderful thing.

[triple5]

I'm sorry to hear the way things turned out. Shame it went like that. Like Complex said, difficult to understand what went so wrong in those 2 hours :Erm:

Anyway, hope the journey back wasn't too bad. Like you say - life goes on :xxgrinning--00xx3:

[HopeUK]

Hey Peeps!

Hi to Lee and Rose - I had no idea my blog still had such a captive audience! Hahaha! :) Okay, allow me to furnish you, and everyone interested, with a comprehensive diatribe..

My girl had disappeared in the last few days in the build up to the holiday because her mom had fallen ill again in the 11th hour of her IELT exam. As soon as that was done with she'd shot off home again. A day or two before my trip she got in touch to say that she'd been in Legaspi since Monday and she would be coming back to Manila on Friday, when we would meet up. She was really looking forward to our meeting. Fine!! Game on! All smiles again!! :)

So I set off on my trek, which was a very pleasant and interesting (if prolonged) journey. Incidentally, I'd like to take the time for a special mention here for KLM and their staff - the food and general hospitality gets my endorsement hands down, and if possible I'll fly with them again when I travel again. :) Anyway, I digress..

Okay, so I'm in Manila, and rather than feeling bemused I was actually excited. It's hot and she isn't immediately obvious to the naked eye.. There are a lot of people meeting their friends and loved ones - a lot. I sat in the shade, awaiting her arrival after the kind help of an airport attendant who let me use his phone to contact her (my phone decided it wasn't going to play with the local network in spite of assurances that it would - I'll slowly boil those responsible for that when I can be bothered). She'd literally just got back herself and was dropping her stuff off at home. She'd be with me soon. I thanked the attendant with a little gratuity and waited patiently with a bottle of water, feeling more than a little like I was on an auction block as the throngs of filipinas awaiting their friends and loved ones paid my decidedly un-filipino looks more than a cursory glance.. After a while the attendant saw me still waiting and in lieu of my kindness repaid the favour further by contacting her for me again. She was here, she just needed to know where I was exactly. After a few minutes I noticed a man waiving at me. I didn't recognise him at all but I raised my hand to see if he was looking at me. He was - and next to him was the cutely diminutive figure of my girl.

My heart stopped..

:omg:

OHMIGOD, how lovely was she?!! She didn't so much sit under my chin as in my chest - sooo cute and diminutive.

She was a little stand-offish but I figured it was the initial meeting thing. We got underway, chatting as we did - she was even more beautiful in person. We eventually managed to find the hotel, which as always only bears a small resemblance to the photos they display proudly on their website. The room wasn't that great.. I'd not been expecting her to be joining me in the hotel but rather thought that we would be meeting up everyday, so I didn't worry about the room quality as such - it was just a place to put my head. Anyway, I unpacked, freshened up and we sat and had a good chat for a bit, reinforcing our commonalities and exploring more. I gave her a recreation of a present which I'd posted to her in February. The original was lost in the post after she wasn't at home to receive it - in fairness she didn't know it was on it's way. It was a valentines gift of a beautifully presented CD of music which reminded me of her, a personalised card with a fantastic and personal poem in it and a box of gummy bears - her favourites. She'd pleaded with me to remake it and I had. She opened everything but the card, seemed bemused with it, even slightly non-plussed.. hmm.. okay. She didn't have any bags with her so I asked her if she was stopping with me or at home. She said she was stopping here and she was going to grab her bits from home - she'd be back within the hour. She took the hotel phone number and we went downstairs to grab a taxi. She went on her way, and so I took the time to hang out with the security guard and chat a little about the culture, why I was here.. After a bit I thanked the guard for his chat and went back, popped the TV on and had my water as I moved my unpacked items around so she'd have room to put her stuff in too. I began to get a funny feeling, but faith had got me this far.. so I ignored it. The phone rang. Reception said it was my girl calling - she told me she was sorry but her dad had just called and he'd asked her to come home as they'd just had a visit from an Aunt from Chicago (!!!??) and he wanted her to be there to meet her. I said, okay.. what about us? I'd come 7000 miles to be with her for two weeks, we had the beach holiday on Sunday. She said she couldn't really not go and she was sorry but she didn't know when she'd be coming back either. I was stunned.. wtf!?? eh!?? what!!?? I said, okay, is that it then? silence.. She said she was sad and sorry again before putting the phone down.

I sat listening to a dead line. I was numb.. I was in Manila, a singular foreigner in a strange country on my first holiday anywhere by myself, and all my reasons for being there had evaporated. No, worse, I'd just been dumped by a person I'd shared so much with over the last six months. Or had I? I had no idea if she was lying or not.. Had she lost HER bottle?

All I could think was "F%*k"..

I grabbed my water, went to the lobby and sat down to have a drink and try to get to grips with what just happened. Everyone around me (and there wasn't anyone apart from the odd member of staff pottering about) looked very alien to me. It all suddenly felt very wrong. It was hot and all felt really uncomfortable. What had she done? What just happened? I thought I'd really found the one, then this.. A girl came and sat down at the opposite end of the room, with her back to me and lit a cigarette and chilled out. I sat for a while drinking my water, noting a sign saying the pool was closed.. anything more want to kick me in the nuts? Feeling out of place I went back to the room. I looked around at all my packing, neatly stored away. Hmm.. so much for that.. What to do? After an eternity of wondering I pottered down to reception - there were two computers - Internet. I asked about it and the security guard came and logged onto the system for me to use it. I went on Facebook and saw my friends. I felt a little less like curling into a ball and screaming as I saw familiar faces on a PC thousands of miles from home. I let everyone know the situation - they were similarly surprised, as you might imagine.

I decided to go for a walk and clear my mind. I found it an irony that the city which is famed for its congestion and nightmarish driving hazards for all in vehicles or on foot, was empty on Holy Week. It looked like 28 Days Later. Nothing was about. A few people lay in the shade, some others pottered about, some were sat as though awaiting Armageddon.. the odd jeepney passed me by and the odd car turned the odd corner. It became too warm again so I returned to the hotel and went back to the web. She was online in Facebook. Why is she online??? Commenting on friends' photos.. I started a text chat with her and she said she was trying to cheer herself up. I told her how unfair it all seemed and how in spite of the visiting aunt I thought my tiring efforts warranted a little respect (or was he treating me with suspicion?? What is going on?). She said she didn't want to cry again. I said I didn't want to start crying either. If our situation was reversed and she was in the UK with me having to go away, I'd invite her along. That didn't get a response, making me think she had lost her bottle, but if she had I couldnt tease it out of her. WIthout a thread to go on I told her that it seemed as though that was that. After admitting that a lot of it was her fault and she was the one in the wrong here she said I must hate her (making me think all the more that she HAD lost her bottle, and there was NO aunt). I could see no alternative but to draw a line under the whole thing - she seemed reluctant to budge or explain anymore, if there was anymore to explain. Perhaps she was telling the truth. I'd been travelling for nearly 20 hours, how could I tell fact from fiction anymore? i told her I didn't hate her, but I couldn't understand what had happened. She said she had to obey her dad. I replied that if there was no way forwards then that was really that. After some resistance to the idea and wanting to stay friends if we could (but without any tangible way forwards fothcoming) she settled for my wishes. I didn't wish for it at all, but I suppose a bit of me was a little angry. We drew a line under it and over the next few hours into the night I organised a flight back for the next morning.

Nothing made any sense, I didn't have sufficient funds to explore or continue with my holiday, nor truthfully the heart to do it. I wanted to go home. The journey back was similarly entertaining - the immigration guards face was a picture when he moved to stamp my passport and realised I'd only arrived the day before. After two planes, via another pleasant but shorter return to Schiphol, several trains worth of buggering about after finding that there were no more trains from Manchester to Sheffield from either the airport or Manchester Picadilly connections (it was only 10:00pm). I tried a couple of hotels.. all full, too expensive or taking the p*ss with a man in need - oh yes, I was back in Britain.. I made my way to Macclesfield where a good friend (my eastern travel guru, married to a wonderful japanese woman) whom I similary had met on Facebook but never met before now, gave me a roof for the night. They are wonderful people and they made me feel very much at home. I had a shower, chilled with them for a bit before retiring. In the morning we chatted some more, and after giving them a couple of my pasalubong gifts to them for their hugely apopreciated help, my friend gave me a lift back to the train station. After yet more buggering about with a train to Picadilly which stopped at Stockport and turned into a bus, I finally got on a train to Sheffield (which took the scenic route, naturally) and I eventually arrived home.

There you have it. What a bizarre 90 odd hours..

Peace.

[Doc Alan]

A cautionary tale, thanks for taking the time to post it, and I for one would not sit in judgement over how you decided to respond to events:xxgrinning--00xx3:

[South-east boy]

Thanks for taking the time to tell us all that happened. So it seems that you never really did find out the truth of what really did go on? Whether the aunt had visited, whether it was an excuse used by her as she wasn't so keen or even if her Dad had forbade her to meet up with you again? I guess with her having the exam, her mother being ill etc, didn't really help things. Like you say if she was genuinely interested, then I would have thought that she could have invited you/her family invite you or you could have met up with you at some point, unless like I say her father forbade her/wasn't keen on her seeing you again. Do you know how much her family knew about you going to see her?

Before on dates over here, I've got on great with someone before meeting, then some haven't been quite so chatty when meeting and I haven't heard from them again or others have been just the same during meeting as before, but after I've never heard from them again. On the other hand, I've had one say that they loved me before meeting and others have been the same before meeting, during meeting and after meeting. I guess that what is so scarey about going such a long way for a kind of 'date', if it goes wrong such as what happened with you. I don't know what else you could have done to have prevented what happened from happening though. Will you try and get more of an answer out of her as to the really reason? I know you have already tried, but she might feel more able to after time. It won't make any difference, but it's a human feeling to need to know so it can settle your mind. With Suzie just after New Year, when I finally got hold of her again, she kept up with the pretence of that the Danish guy was still going to see her in a few days, but as it didn't totally add up and I wondered if she had been seeing him when I was unable to get hold of her, I asked her again if she had seem him during the time I couldn't get hold of her and then she finally admitted that yes, that was the case.

So what's next for you now?

[aposhark]

Hi Gavin,

Wow that was a very short trip to the Phils :yikes:

I would have stayed and had a look around, I think you would have found more female company there, and a lot more sincere than the one you went to meet.

You had your reasons to leave so fast but a little patience can often reveal unexpected surprises :cwm24:

Best of luck for your future :xxgrinning--00xx3:

[South-east boy]

Personally if I had been her and for whatever reason I wasn't so keen on you after meeting in person or been very shy/lost my bottle with the situation, I would have still seen you as I wouldn't do that to someone who has come so far to see me. I would feel too bad and have too much guilt to do that. If she wasn't so keen on you or was very shy with the situation, if she gave it time with you, she could have felt more comfortable with you and grow to like you more over time -some people never give the other person enough chance! :NoNo: Even if it didn't work out romantically wise you could at least made a good friend which is a better feeling compared to what happened.

Better luck to your future. :xxgrinning--00xx3:

[liane]

Sorry to hear about this. I understand that you weren't interested to stay a bit longer in the Philippines and packed your bags back home as soon as you can.
I hope you'll find someone who will give you importance someday :heartshape1:

[HopeUK]

South-East Boy: Hey bud.. how's it hanging? :) How much did her family know about me? An interesting question there man.. I asked her about a month ago what her friends thought about me and she said she hadn’t talked with them about me because in the past she had done so, revealing perhaps too much and the relationship had gone pear-shaped as a result. With her parents.. Well, knowing something of the culture, when I chose to help her out of her corner with her IELT funding I suggested that to save your parent’s “amor proprio” we could go halves as it were, enabling me to show willing to protect/help their daughter and help them save face, as it was apparently her mother’s illness and the medicines they’d needed to get which had compromised the situation in the first place (this also conveniently enabled me to make the payment less in case of a scam going down.. although I can promise everyone here that I didn’t choose this course of action with that intention at the forefront of my mind!). In response to that she said her parents had agreed. So how much did they know? Did they know anything about me at all? Had she used the money which had been allocated for her IELT toward something else, say a new handbag or some other more genuine and pressing problem, and couldn’t tell her parents.. This may be the case if as you say, her father is a strict SOAB. I had shown willing to meet everyone in her immediate family though – she lives with her elder brother and sister – her younger brother was supposed to be living with them but was still in Legaspi, having not made the move in March as she’d said he was going to (perhaps because of her mom again). I was always expecting her siblings to be with her in case I turned out to be a psychopath (:xxaction-smiley-047), but she obviously felt brave.. or perhaps there is yet another thread from this aspect which I haven’t considered. In any case I again showed willing by taking “pasalubong” for everyone except her parents, as she didn’t think we’d get to meet with them being in Legaspi – but that could have been sorted with a trip to the shops over there under the circumstances – I don’t think they’d have minded really if I wasn’t expecting to meet them, and it’s all about building friendships anyway isn’t it?!
I guess it’s going to be difficult to get any resolution in this as I’ve since deleted her account in my Facebook profile. I’m quite happy to let it remain a mystery because to be honest it’s become too overwhelming to try and fathom it all out, and quite irretrievable anyway. What’s next for me? I dunno, a hefty bill to get paid off by September and a change of raison d’etre for my next holiday which I think is going to be Japan (as it was supposed to be) next year.
I would have thought she would have given it time, and I know I’m the man and she’s the woman but if she’d been visiting me I would NEVER have left her to her own devices in a foreign country, saying “nah sweetheart, you aren’t for me” and shutting the door in her face! We did have the option to be friends but honestly, amidst the chaos in my mind, I couldn’t reconcile the betrayal, not even with my Buddhist reflexes!

Aposhark: I refer you to the issue of not really having the money to venture too far. The whole visit was a bit of a rush to be honest - I just did the best with what I had (and suffered for it too before going). Well, I could have ventured a little perhaps but how or where to stay where I had ventured? That would have been the gnawing expense. As for other women, well it could have happened but I didn’t want other women. I wanted her - plain and simple :bigcry:. This has been a personable affair, but after seeing how truly beautiful she was physically (which often is the aspect which if we’re honest is sometimes the disappointing but largely irrelevant side if it’s a real relationship) I really thought I’d hit the jackpot, as it were..

[Sim11UK]

Hi Hope I understand your reasons for coming back.

Like you say, you were in a strange country, alone, tired from travelling.
I find Manila quite oppressive, it's that syndrome of being lonely, when there are plenty of people around.

On my first trip, I felt I was seeing the real Philippines, when I'd left Manila (which was a few hours after I arrived). Just my personal viewpoint.

Sorry it didn't work out, wish you well in the future. :xxgrinning--00xx3: :)

[South-east boy]

I can't imagine how shocked/bad you must have felt after what happened with that phone call. :NoNo: Seems it could be a good idea to have a back-up emergency plan for anyone going should the worst happen and still being able to make something out of the situation

I didn't realize that she lived with her older brother & sister. I would have thought that her dad and aunt would understand that she couldn't go back as you had arrived to see her or at least had to spend some days with you.

With being friends, I meant that if she wasn't sure of you/the enormity of the situation, if she had spent some time with you even though it might not have worked for you both romantically, at least you might have enjoyed each others company and remained friends. I've had some dates that even though they didn't work out romantically, as we got on well we have remained friends and I'm still in touch with them now. If I were you I wouldn't feel I could be friends after that either, so I get what you mean.

You did mentioned lesson learned, but what could you have done to prevent what happened?

[laurel]

Gav really sorry to hear this.
Putting this down to experience is an understatement!!!
I sincerely wish you all the best, you seem to be handling it incredibly well.
Take care

[HopeUK]

SIM11UK, yeah I get the feeling that AWAY from Manila is the winning ticket. A curious place but as you say, oppressive.

South East, I’m not sure there WAS an aunt to be honest mate. The more I think about it, the more I reckon she just got cold feet or didn't like something but wouldn't say what (can't imagine it though with all the chat we had, although it seems I didn't know her after all, to be sure). I guess there wasn’t anything to do to prevent or anticipate it.. How do you prepare for being dumped without a clear explanation, and as has been said, how can she live with doing that? It’d be “guilt overload” with me if I did that. Just thinking about doing that to her if she’d come over here is an unbearable image and upsets me even after what she did. For me, the lesson learned is to go somewhere for yourself – my original plan when I set out to reach for Japan. I am going to do this next! Plain and simple.. :)

Laurel cheers for that. To be honest there are many positives to take from it.. The safe and secure knowledge that I went out there relatively inexperienced as far as travelling solo was concerned, and came back feeling beaten up but immortal.. hahaha.

[Doc Alan]

I've said very little, Gav, because I'm flying out in exactly 1 month ...and I've read your's and similar recent posts with interest, concern, and caution :doh

[HopeUK]

Alan, I'm sure you'll be okay bud.. I can't imagine this happening again.. On a sliding scale it'd be impossible to anticipate THAT resolution. I'd braced myself for everything from a BIG LOVE to her not turning up at all. This one was just plain odd.. I expected to see Dennis Hopper around the next corner.. For me the only reason I couldn't work a travel back up plan was because all this had been organised and sealed in 4 months - not easy on about 16k a year I can tell you - hahaha.

If you can have a backup plan I concur with the others.. do it. I could have but I weighed up the pro's and con's of the better choice to get to meet her as quickly as possible within reason. It all just buggered up.

[somebody]

Wow a truely Epic thread and one whatever point of a Phill Brit relationship we are at can relate to.

I have to say I did think what happened if no one met me or ... I did make some plans how well they would have worked if these things had happened i dont know.

I can remember back to when my Wife was basically a stranger I knew well when we first met and we both found it very odd to know someone but to find them a person they hardly know..

Its quite creepy to think what if she had cold feet.

The family part can have a big part to play my Wife was happily with me and her Manila Uni Mates were aware of me but one day when in Boracay she got a Mobile call from her Dad. Which was basically saying what the hell are you doing in Boracay (with her mates he thought) now im abroad on A island miles from the airport wondering whats going to happen now.
Luckily she was strongwilled enough to carry on but the family is so powerful in Phill that many of my Wifes mates (two degree holder nurses for example) are still ruled over by their family and have to seek permission for trips out permission for laptop with internet for example in their mid twenties!!

Another thing I have noticed is some families don't like the daughter marrying a westerner because it changes the balance of power.
My Wife is now apart from her automatic respect to her elders finding she still has massive influence over the family simply due to her money. This in some families can cause a lot of problems from what I have seen and heard of.

The other option I can think of is she simply didn't think it would happen it was a nice daydream then it was always months, weeks, days away which to many Phills who seem to live for the day seems like a live time away.

[HopeUK]

Yeah, I guess it could simply boil down to the fact that the reality became something quite different after all the talk on the web. I tend to think of these chit chats and communiques through the web as totally legitimate conversation, but for some I guess it seems like playtime until reality sinks in by some means or other..

The filipino family unit matter is indeed a powerful entity, but to be honest she didn't know that much about me financially except that I managed to help her, but had also drawn a line at getting silly when we decided to go shopping before the beach holiday. I would have thought that the financial side of things would only have been a benefit to them though to be honest if that were the issue, no matter how little I actually earn. Money has never ruled my life anyway, it limits my options but it doesn't rule my head. That really causes trouble if you let it do that. Ask any of the celebs. If it were a matter of power they all should have taken the time to get to know me and not perhaps make assumptions about me or my morals or attitudes. That just stinks to make your mind up about someone before meeting them.. arrogance in its darkest colours.

[somebody]

Yeah, I guess it could simply boil down to the fact that the reality became something quite different after all the talk on the web. I tend to think of these chit chats and communiques through the web as totally legitimate conversation, but for some I guess it seems like playtime until reality sinks in by some means or other..

The filipino family unit matter is indeed a powerful entity, but to be honest she didn't know that much about me financially except that I managed to help her, but had also drawn a line at getting silly when we decided to go shopping before the beach holiday. I would have thought that the financial side of things would only have been a benefit to them though to be honest if that were the issue, no matter how little I actually earn. Money has never ruled my life anyway, it limits my options but it doesn't rule my head. That really causes trouble if you let it do that. Ask any of the celebs. If it were a matter of power they all should have taken the time to get to know me and not perhaps make assumptions about me or my morals or attitudes. That just stinks to make your mind up about someone before meeting them.. arrogance in its darkest colours.

Indeed for many Filipinos the west seems like how they normally see it a film set so it is possible it was some form of online fantasy which she never thought might happen or had not thought though.

Many Phills don't like the family unit split up and would rather avoid the money it seems from examples i Know of.
Some parts of the Wife's family have members all over the world and barely seen one another physically from one year to the next. I can think of families where the husband and wife are in different countries as are all the the siblings are separated by borders. So like you rightly say money is not everything even if it could be very handy..

very true about the thinking you know someone but like your self and someone else mentioned today in a post the person you chat to and the person you meet can be very different to what you imagine.

[keithAngel]

Hope you will probably never know the actual reasons why things went the way they did.

Even had she met you and given you all the time and proximity you might have hoped for outcomes are far from assured.

From my own experiences and on the ground research the received wisdom here in the Phils is you cant beat a good introduction

In the ten days befor coming and since my arrival the uptake on face to face meetings (in a public place Mall etc ) for a chat old fashioned style dating is very low even though initial contact is enthusiastic most of the lady,s dont seem to be able to cope with the fact someone is here on the ground that doesnt mean dates arnt available but working girls also frequent sites so you have to learn to read the responces well

I have the advantage here of previous experience that went pairshaped and some time on my side so patience really can be a virtue plus conections to good advice from expats living here full time and that still doesnt mean not needing to be lucky

Most decent ladies will be shy initialy although I did draw the line at meeting anyone who wasnt willing to show up alone rather than with the entire clan or her personal bakarda that can start to cost money befor even any real interest is established on either side plus if shes not brave enough to meet that for me bodes poorly for the future , just a very personal take that.

The other phenomina ive encountered is that from the moment of contact you are epected to talk to the lady exclusively even befor meeting whilst they can continue there on line activeties which I find quiet mad:rolleyes:

For me this time im clear in myself despite the banter that im immediatly upfrnt about who i am and what im here for the truth is easy and requires no memory and I expect the same standard from prospective partners If that doesnt work I will come again untill its the right one comes my way.

I will never again use the net to try and establish an LDR it cost me two years of my time wiser though I may be now back to the fish project good luck in the future Hope:xxgrinning--00xx3:

[HopeUK]

I find it kinda infuriating that people can’t just approach life with an open and clear mind. For me, every effort should be made to be honest and truthful with others, end of story. You don’t need to lie to get ahead.

I do recall about a month ago I thought to install Yahoo Messenger on my work PC as this had become our most successful spontaneous meeting tool of late – better than Facebook as they recently decided to ban its use at work. Within an hour of installation she appeared and one of the first things she asked me was who else I was talking with through Messenger. I told her the truth – I wasn’t speaking with anyone else but her, and even joked with her that as this had happened we were simply fated to be together. I don’t think this moment was instrumental in our downfall, but I think it might illustrate a difference in our behaviours. Maybe she’s been lied to so many times that the truth was overwhelming and seemed too good to be true, as it were.

As you say KeithAngel, go with the truth and there’s no tripping yourself up. I never saw the point to agendas or lying in relationships - at best it just creates a dry rot. I guess I’m coping with this quite well because the one constant in my life is an inability to find the right person. I seem to have the ability to bounce back from these things and carry on, probably out of a sense of desire for success in finding that one true woman – there have been so many chances for me to just throw in the towel and never bother again but I find I just can’t give up no matter how many times I get beaten up. I’ve had quite a few relationships. Some have barely got off the starting blocks, or fallen in due course. My last one had the best run at eight years. I think that rather than managing a fully successful life-long relationship (at 38 years old, that’s already long past possible) I’m just fated to have experiences and collisions with many women. It just feels inevitable. A shame really because in spite of my tastes in the ideal woman for me, all I’ve ever really been interested in is in having a stable, loving relationship. It’s ironic to me that in all of life’s difficulties this is the one thing which has always eluded me. Still, as I have said I can’t give up, and with this in mind this will NOT be my last effort at an interracial relationship. Why the focus on interracial? Well, I’ve come to realise that generally speaking I now find western women boring, or worse. There will be rare exceptions I know, and I don’t speak for all western women when I say this but I find a lot of them seem to want to be more like men than women, and a large slice of those left don’t deserve to be called women. I may not go with the LDR through the web as you say.. I think I’ll just bide my time and go to Japan next year with an open mind and heart and see what reveals itself. I have other reasons for wanting to go to Japan anyway, and at least I already have a friend with a Japanese wife whom I can speak with. That may be my next big adventure. In terms of possibilities I can’t imagine it could be any worse.

[complex]

Hi Gavin, thanks for taking the time to re-live the experience, I can only hope it will be something you laugh about in the future when you look back and think you went half way around the world and back in such a short time, an epic experience.
Sorry how its panned out, sounded so promising when I started reading, I can imagine having the same reaction as you did when you received her call, numbing for sure, we would all feel the same. I wouldn't begin to guess at her reasons as like you and everyone else have said it just doesn't make sense, aunt from Chicago just doesn't ring true to me.
I wish you had said you would go with her to collect her belongings, wonder what her reaction would have been. Maybe like its been suggested she just doesn't know her own mind and is immature and unable to cope with the situation. Only she knows.

You didn't say if the guy waiving at the airport was a friend that had accompanied her?

Not much else I can say really thats not been said already, seems you have coped rather well considering.
To travel the distance you did for a lady is a big deal (as I often remind my wife :-) the way that girl treated you is beyond words, i hope you can start planning your Japan trip and just forget about this saga.

[complex]

Hi Gavin, thanks for taking the time to re-live the experience, I can only hope it will be something you laugh about in the future when you look back and think you went half way around the world and back in such a short time, an epic experience.
Sorry how its panned out, sounded so promising when I started reading, I can imagine having the same reaction as you did when you received her call, numbing for sure, we would all feel the same. I wouldn't begin to guess at her reasons as like you and everyone else have said it just doesn't make sense, aunt from Chicago just doesn't ring true to me.
I wish you had said you would go with her to collect her belongings, wonder what her reaction would have been. Maybe like its been suggested she just doesn't know her own mind and is immature and unable to cope with the situation. Only she knows.

You didn't say if the guy waiving at the airport was a friend that had accompanied her?

Not much else I can say really thats not been said already, seems you have coped rather well considering.
To travel the distance you did for a lady is a big deal (as I often remind my wife :-) the way that girl treated you is beyond words, i hope you can start planning your Japan trip and just forget about this saga.

[HopeUK]

Hey Complex, thanks for the thoughts, and I can already laugh about it my friend - it's all so preposterous. The guy with her was the taxi driver, but he could have been her husband or the aunt from Chicago for all I know! :laugher:

It did occur to me to go with her when she went to pick up her stuff - I did want to meet her brother and sister after all, but I'd had my fill of travelling and at that point I trusted her.. she'd met me at the airport safe and sound after all. I get your reasoning though. As I said to my mom in an email this morning all I can do now is look forward and leave her to whatever future she's committed herself to. I did send her one last email before I severed contact. It read:


Hi Blossom,

Just thought to let you know I'm back on home ground. Shame we should have been having a blast but hey, your call sweets.

Cryin' shame really - it all could have been soo good.. you have no idea of the future we both lost :_(

Ingat ka palagi,

Gav x


As I say, a real shame.. but I have gained a lot from it all. There are many "firsts" for me.. It was my first trip to Schiphol airport (I LOVE it), I have experienced my first long-haul flight (so I know what to expect on the trip to Japan), I have confidence in dealing with airports and what to typically expect, and I can't imagine any holiday will ever be so short again, nor can I imagine a more bizarre outcome to any future LDR! For everyone here who has had success in finding their equal and opposite I applaud your efforts and stoicism, and hey maybe there's a beautiful Japanese woman out there who has been waiting all this time for me to evolve my travelling confidence, and who is mature enough to snap me up when we DO meet.. :Hellooo: Even in the face of my recent experience, given that asian ladies are to me the most beautiful women on the planet, and therefore virtually irresistible, she shouldn't have too hard a time on her hands.. hahaha!! :)

[Doc Alan]

I did send her one last email before I severed contact. It read:


Hi Blossom,

Just thought to let you know I'm back on home ground. Shame we should have been having a blast but hey, your call sweets.

Cryin' shame really - it all could have been soo good.. you have no idea of the future we both lost :_(

Ingat ka palagi,

Gav x

Thanks again for updating us Gavin. Your response is a model of restraint!:) I'm sure you were tempted to write more and who would have blamed you !
Guess your mother would have had lots of advice for you :yikes: but all of us who have kids (no matter what age) can only support and always be there for them - we can't control them !:xxgrinning--00xx3: Just a word of advice from me - don't tell her you're off to Japan just yet !:D

[triple5]

You're a top man, Gavin :xxgrinning--00xx3: Most people who had just gone through what you have would feel crushed and fell like burying their head in the sand, but you seem to have taken it on the chin and ready to move on. I always find in moments like that something good comes out of it. Seems like you made 2 good friends at the end of it and that will no doubt take you on another journey.

[HopeUK]

Alan, thanks for your words again mate.. For a few seconds quite a few words crossed my mind but when I thought about the fact that what I was about to say would likely be my parting words to her I realised (to my moderate surprise at the time) that a part of me still did feel a love for her, and I couldn't bring myself to say anything except what I truly felt. I have to say my mom and I have developed a very equal and respectful relationship over the last twenty years or so, and she has been nothing but supportive and understanding in all of this. I think she's been more upset about this than I have to be honest, but she's an understanding person and I think she realises the true value of experience - in that respect I would say she's quite unusual for a mother! haha! With that in mind I think she'll understand when I throw myself eastwards once more.. I don't think she'd have it any other way.

Triple5, thanks man - Honestly!?? I did feel like curling up and screaming, but in the end it would only have given me a headache and upset the neighbours, and wouldn't have changed the circumstances one iota. All I could do was see the good in it. As for my friends, well it was an extreme way of finally meeting someone about fifty miles away from home but it was all worth it I think, in spite of the outcome. I also can't help but notice the beautiful symmetry in having Facebook be the architect of both my downfall and resurrection.

[Notavirusalso]

Welcome home Gavin,
Glad to hear that you made it back safely, Dont worry about the finding the right girl at 38 as im 46 and have just found the right woman for me and married her last December.
Although your stay in the Philippines was so very short I wish we could of had time to invite you to stay with my wife if only for a few days to give you time to think it though before flying back, You would of found it an amazing place, Everyone I meet there is friendly and at 50php lang for a hair cut (sulit) you cant go wrong, I would have one everyday if i had more hair.
Anyway mate I love your onwards and upwards attitude..stiff upper lip not a quivering bottom one.
Some one as nice as you seem will recive your just deserts.
Peace.

[Florge]

sorry to hear about your ordeal.. we were concerned really if she picked you up at the airport after the lost communication... anyway, this is a blessing in disguise... she may have ended scamming you all the more if she pursued the relationship... maybe her conscience was bugging her and actually, she did the right thing... at last!

if i knew you were at manchester, we could have given you a warm, cozy shed, i mean bed (lol) to sleep in ;)

[HopeUK]

Notavirusalso: Cheers friend! I suppose I don't really consider myself over the hill at 38 but I always worry about the passage of time when I think of time not spent loving.. haha, incurable romantic - It seems I'm always hoping for the best. I've been pleasantly surprised by the warm wishes and help offered. It also seems that if I had stayed a little longer the remaining 99% of the Philippines would have been there to help! lol!

Florge: Funnily enough it did cross my mind to wonder whether it had been a scam with a 'happy' ending.. I would say 'I will always wonder' but as has been pointed out, onwards and upwards. :)

[aromulus]

manchester, ;)

:omg::omg:

[HopeUK]

Hi everyone,

I expect this will be the last post I plant on this matter but I thought people who have been following this with scepticism/interest/horror etc.. might be interested to know that life had one last little slash in an attempt to bleed me some more..

My girl sent one last email to me to let me know that she did in fact pass her IELT exam and to thank me for helping her to reach her happiness, that she had noticed that I had removed her account from my Facebook friends list but that she wouldn't forget me.. Bye.

You know it was probably just the way she worded it, but it made me feel as though the holiday fiasco had been a hard choice for her to make, made from the point of view of her 25 years of home life, and just maybe not a backhanded attempt to get out of the situation in a shock of reality.. Just maybe it may have worked with a little more patience on both of our parts.. Unlikely I know, but knowing life and its way of presenting irony at any opportunity, I have to wonder..

Overall, I have to say that was something of an unexpected email and a final bittersweet ending to the matter.

As Unlucky Alf would say.. "Oh, bugger"..