Alcohol - what's new ?

[Doc Alan]

Once again alcohol is in the news – which is how I started the thread a year ago. http://filipinaroses.com/showthread.php/29822-Tagay-tayo-!-Cheers-!-...in-moderation-!


Facts are less easily available in the Philippines, but beer and now wine consumption are still increasing. There is lax monitoring of sales. The minimum legal age is 18, but underage drinking is common. Many Filipinos don’t consider excessive drinking might be a health problem, and don’t seek – or can’t afford - early treatment when they do get problems.
Now our Prime Minister David Cameron is attacking the “ scandal of society “ caused by the UK’s drinking culture which costs the NHS over £2.7 billion ( £1 billion on A + E services ) and society ( crime and lost work ) £17 – 22 billion annually. Solutions include “ drunk tanks “ ( to let people sober up overnight ), more police in A + E departments, and “ booze buses “ with paramedics. See http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-17036826
Most doctors support minimum pricing per unit of alcohol. In Scotland 45p / unit has been suggested. That would increase the cost of a 2 litre bottle of cider from £1.20 to £3.75. Not everyone agrees because it would punish all drinkers, not just those with problems. Overall alcohol consumption is down – binge drinking is the problem.
Members may wish an update on last year’s advice:-
• If you don’t drink, don’t start for health benefits.
• If you drink, do so moderately : - no more than 3-4 units / day for males and 2-3 units / day for females ( more susceptible to alcohol ). Try to have 2 “ dry “ days / week.
• A unit is about half a pint of ordinary strength beer, lager or cider, 25ml ( small measure ) of spirits, and there are 1.5 units in a 125ml ( small glass ) of wine.
• Light – moderate drinking reduces heart disease risk, and increases life expectancy.
• Moderate drinking increases risk of various cancers ( breast in women; bowel in men; mouth, throat, voicebox and gullet in both sexes ).
• Heavy drinking raises blood pressure, causes liver disease, obesity, and other problems.
• Avoid drinking in pregnancy if possible ( possible harm to unborn baby ).

[lastlid]

I like the sounds that Dave Cameron is making but how they will translate into practice remains to be seen. Sounds like a good way for the country to reduce the outlay on the NHS etc. :xxgrinning--00xx3:

The drunk tanks sound interesting....or is that just another name for a police cell?

Okay, just googled it......mobile police cell.

[lastlid]

Any interesting differences between Scotland and the rest of the UK on this one Doc? My understanding is that the problem is bigger, north of the border.

[imagine]

i think youths have always been open to binge drinking, always do things over the top, i started drinking at 16 yrs old, reasonably moderate at that time, untill 17 yrs old then up untill around 19 yr old , i didnt think i was drunk untill i was paraletic, then after 19 reasonably moderate again,after 25 yrs old, i have only ever drank on occasion, i hate the side effects , hang overs, shouting out for hughie down the toilet bowl and the room spinning, moderation is ideal

[sars_notd_virus]

Once again alcohol is in the news

Facts are less easily available in the Philippines, but beer and now wine consumption are still increasing. There is lax monitoring of sales. The minimum legal age is 18, but underage drinking is common.

This is true,lack of monitoring in little corner shops!! Ive seen lots of underage/teenagers purchased their alcohol from them...In the BIG shops like Asda, Morrisons they ask for an ID if they are not sure of your age.
I would say that alcohol is not bad for one's health ,everything in moderation is good.... my husbands Nan is now 100years old , and always tells us that ''A little of what you fancy does you good''
Cheers!!:xxgrinning--00xx3:

[lastlid]

......... i hate the side effects , hang overs, shouting out for hughie down the toilet bowl and the room spinning, moderation is ideal

Ha. Me too.

[Arthur Little]

I rarely touch the "demon:devil-smiley-029: drink" :66: nowadays ... NOT because I'm completely teetotal :nono-1-1: but - with me being recently diagnosed with diabetes - it would interfere with my medication.

[Arthur Little]

I rarely touch the "demon:devil-smiley-029: drink" :66: nowadays ...

... having said that, :yeahthat: I'm rather partial to the [very] occasional pint of cider! :party-smiley-012:

[Doc Alan]

Any interesting differences between Scotland and the rest of the UK on this one Doc? My understanding is that the problem is bigger, north of the border.
You are correct, and Arthur's drinking habits are unusual ( that is, low :xxgrinning--00xx3: ).
Scots drink - on average - a quarter more alcohol per head than the English and Welsh. Alcohol - related deaths are twice those south of the border, and alcohol figures in about half of homicides ( fact, not Taggart :NoNo: ).
There has been a raft of measures to control the problem. For over 2 years licensing has been tightened, promotions reduced in pubs and clubs, displays in shops restricted, with more counselling / treatment.
Last autumn in Glasgow there began a crackdown on under age drinking, and a " booze bus " ( just one ) has been helping drunks this winter. There is to be a pilot scheme for offenders who get the chance to avoid custodial sentences by wearing an " anklet " alcohol monitor.
The SNP, supported by medics and police, may succeed in making minimum pricing law by April . But not everyone agrees ( moderate drinkers, whisky producers, and Labour opposition ) and there could be problems with European competition law.
It's too early to be sure, but alcohol - related deaths may be starting to fall, with fewer Scots drinking over the limit :).

[Arthur Little]

Arthur's drinking habits are unusual

:iagree: ... suppose you're right ... :anerikke: ... alcohol consumption is, on the whole, one "pleasure" I'm quite happy to do without. ;)

[stevewool]

me too very rarely drink - maybe a shandy ,

[lastlid]

I dont drink at all. The last drink I had was on the flight home from the Philippines in June. I didnt even have a drink on our wedding night - I was offered a bottle of beer and my wife turned it down on my behalf. :icon_lol: She doesn't drink and this is a good influence on me.

[lastlid]

Scots drink - on average - a quarter more alcohol per head than the English and Welsh. Alcohol - related deaths are twice those south of the border, and alcohol figures in about half of homicides

Any idea why that is Doc, I wondered if it was to do with keeping warm in harsher winters with a wee dram or two by the fire etc etc? But having spent some time in Scotland I am not so sure that might be the only reason......

[Doc Alan]

Any idea why that is Doc, I wondered if it was to do with keeping warm in harsher winters with a wee dram or two by the fire etc etc? But having spent some time in Scotland I am not so sure that might be the only reason......
Perhaps I should explain - I was born in Glasgow, then studied and worked there for about 16 years :). Scottish A + E units on Saturday nights ( and Sunday - Friday ) would convince anyone that there is a particular problem with alcohol north of the border :doh.
Many see Scotland's vice of alcohol excess rooted in the soil of 19th century industrialisation, poverty, and bad housing in Glasgow.
In my opinion, it's also due to the depressing weather - there are two seasons in Scotland, winter and July ! :omg:

[lastlid]

........... there are two seasons in Scotland, winter and July ! :omg:

Yep. I would agree with that.

[Arthur Little]

Yep. I would agree with that.

Likewise, :iagree: ... from bitter > :36_1_26[1]: < experience. :D

[Terpe]

Personally I enjoy a drink or three.
I especially enjoy a nice glass of wine with food, plated or snacks, and of course relaxing in the company of friends.

When the mood takes me I also really enjoy a glass of ice cold beer. San Miguel Lite's quite nice.
I used to drink loads of beer in Japan. Especially after a hard day's work at the office, we'd all go out for eating drinking and karaoke. The whole office. Now that's real team bonding.Wonderful times.

The funny thing is though I've never been really drunk. Most people know when it's time to 'call-time', don't they?

I've never staggered around the streets bladdered, rat-arsed,hammered,p*$$*d,slaughtered,s**t-faced,smashed or a***holed etc. Funny just how many colourful Synonyms the English language uses to describe levels of drunkeness.

I can admit to feeling under the weather after being on 'the sauce', and to be honest I have occasionally fallen asleep after too much of the 'old sherbert'.

But seriously, to my mind, the really major alcohol related problems seem to blight our towns and cities on Friday and Saturday nights.

It's almost as though certain sections of society just don't know how to enjoy a night out with friends that doesn't depend on boozing until completely rat-arsed.

Surely it's not beyond our capabilities to provide entertainment in our towns that does not involve alcohol. Is it?

In my opinion, the idea that a 'drunk tank' is part of the solution is completely out of all logic.

Allowing establishments to continue unabated to operate a business that's based totally on uncontrolled consumption of alcohol is part of the problem.

I'm not talking about prohibition or partial selective bans (like smoking). I'm really thinking about using some government funding to bring about a cultural change for a darn good night out for all that doesn't involve 24 hour competitive drinking.

Oh, wait!! The world doesn't work like that, does it.

Ah, I must've been on the 'sauce' again.

[Doc Alan]

Anyone who doubts we have a particular problem with alcohol in the UK should read this article ( http://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(11)60022-6/fulltext ), or try to watch “ Britain’s Hidden Alcoholics “ on BBC One next Monday ( 20 February, 8.30 pm ).
However achieved, there’s a need for a cultural shift. It’s not just Glasgow’s Royal Infirmary A + E , but every hospital A + E – especially at weekends. Even that is not the whole story. An increase in consumption by young people – “ pre-loaded “ by drinking alcohol from the supermarket at home before going out to carry on binge–drinking - is one aspect of the problem.
The other is middle class adults drinking at home, 2/5 drinking above recommended limits at least once a week. A similar number of men and women have an alcohol problem. Every week pubs are closing, booze is bought by the middle classes for consumption at home, and they’re in denial about the risks. Hazardous consumption ( more than 8 units on one occasion ) is one of them. Another is drinking alcohol without food ( unlike other European countries ). Finally, underestimating the amount drunk - because of all the publicity, but also not realising or accepting there is a problem.
“ Booze buses “ and “ drunk tanks “ may not have much impact. Minimum pricing would have much more. Whatever the solutions, the fact is the UK has an alcohol problem which it can’t afford. It costs £90 / year for every taxpayer. Health professionals worry about the illnesses caused. Too many of the public are in denial.
I don’t expect members to post how many units they consume. But please add them up, be honest with yourself ! I consume 15 units / week and have 3 alcohol – free days / week ( http://www.drinkingandyou.com/site/uk/what.htm ). If you’re drinking more than the recommended limits, do something about it. Don’t blame me for going on about it – I’m only the messenger !

[joebloggs]

from today's sun :bigcry:

http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/news/4132817/Baby-was-left-to-die-with-alcoholic-mum.html

:cwm24:

[lastlid]

.

[scottishbride]

I worked at the Supermarket called Co-operative Food. And there are loads of teenagers and under age trying to buy Alcohol from us. They actually goes to me all the time:icon_lol: They really think I am stupid to let them buy it without asking ID.:NoNo: They normally swear and become abusive! The Co-op normally banned this teenagers. I remembered serving one guy who is very drunk! And he is known alcoholic in my area. He was abusive to me when I refused him.. Swear a lot! :cwm23: We are very strict when it comes to underage and intoxicated customers. I also remembered one American who is buying loads of BEER after 10 pm. and we refused him as the alcohol license is only until 10 pm. He was very angry and said, WHAT KIND OF LAW IS THAT? :icon_lol::NoNo:

[lastlid]

I also remembered one American who is buying loads of BEER after 10 pm. and we refused him as the alcohol license is only until 10 pm. He was very angry and said, WHAT KIND OF LAW IS THAT? :icon_lol::NoNo: The supermarket needs to have the means to cordon off the alcohol shelving so that it is obvious to potential purchasers that it's after 10pm and no sales of alcohol allowed.

[Arthur Little]

They normally swear and become abusive!

:rolleyes: ... so, they're not being particularly co~operative!

[Arthur Little]

:cwm24: ... so, they're not being particularly co~operative!

:cwm24: ... joking aside, though, the problem of underage drinking seems to be reaching endemic proportions in Scotland ... and is especially bad at weekends.

[scottishbride]

The supermarket needs to have the means to cordon off the alcohol shelving so that it is obvious to potential purchasers that it's after 10pm and no sales of alcohol allowed.

We actually have reminder of license hours for alcohol near at Alcohol Shelves and all the check out area. But people seems ignore it. Then, when you try to explain to them they get really annoyed. :ReadIt:

[scottishbride]

:cwm24: ... joking aside, though, the problem of underage drinking seems to be reaching endemic proportions in Scotland ... and is especially bad at weekends.

Yes, Arthur. I see this people everyday. Same faces and still they will try to buy even you refuses them many times..:icon_lol::NoNo: I read in one article that if you are Alcoholic you will be given benefits because of that!? I don't know if it's true.. :Erm::Erm:

[scottishbride]

Whoala! found the link http://www.thecourier.co.uk/News/article/20092/figures-show-drug-and-alcohol-addictions-heavy-toll-on-benefits-bill.html

[Doc Alan]

Scots drink a quarter more alcohol / head than elsewhere, so it’s not surprising that the proportion of Scottish alcoholics on benefits / disability allowances is greater by over half than the UK as a whole. In any case, it’s a small fraction of the estimated £3.6 billion that alcohol abuse costs Scotland every year.
The enormous costs to society far outweigh the tax revenues, even if these pay for the costs to the NHS. Almost 2/5 of these are for A + E and ambulance services. Drunks require nurses, doctors in many specialties ( A + E, surgeons and physicians ) and ancillary staff. Add to that the cost of treating the chronic health consequences of alcohol abuse ( liver, cardiovascular disease, cancers, psychiatric illness ) and you can understand why health professionals are just as worried as as politicians.
An alcoholic can be defined as one whose repeated drinking leads to harm in his / her work, social life and health. It’s often tied in with other life or health issues. Three quarters of alcohol sold in the UK is consumed by hazardous and harmful drinkers.
“ CAGE “ questions are quite good at detecting alcohol abuse and dependence, not so much the young binge drinkers, but the older home drinkers :
• Ever felt you ought to C ut down on drinking ?
• Have people A nnoyed you by criticising your drinking ?
• Ever felt G uilty about your drinking ?
• Ever had an E ye-opener to steady your nerves in the morning ?
Other warning signs are :
• Getting drunk regularly, drinking more than before, drinking alone, making excuses to drink, not sure how much you’re drinking
• If none of these apply to you, it could be someone you know who needs help.

[Rosie1958]

Like Lastlid, I don't drink alcohol at all and I commented on the previous thread about alcohol. I've just been reading a report in the news covering David Cameron's recent vow and was quite surprised to hear just how much this drunken stupor is costing the NHS and the taxpayer, not to mentioning policing .........

"David Cameron has declared war on booze Britain during a visit to a hospital.

The Prime Minister pledged to tackle the growing "scandal" of alcohol-fuelled disorder when he met doctors, nurses, paramedics and local police at the Royal Victoria Infirmary in Newcastle to highlight the cost of alcohol to the NHS.

He toured the hospital - which has a policeman on duty every Thursday and Friday night to handle incidents of drunken disorder on the wards - with matron Angela McNab and paramedic Paul Fell.

Mr Cameron said: "The facts are pretty stark.

"Alcohol costs the NHS almost £3 billion a year; that is a cost of £90 to every taxpayer.

"This has a huge impact on the NHS and a huge impact on accident and emergency which every Thursday, Friday and Saturday night are overrun by people who are drunk and incapable.

"We need to do more to tackle this problem.

"We are going to look at the issue of alcohol pricing. I'm quite convinced there is deep discounting of alcohol in supermarkets and convenience stores and that it is causing part of the problem.

"We need to take action right across the board. I want to make sure local councils have the power to close down bars that are causing a problem and that police can step in if they need to because it is against the law to sell to people who are drunk or underage.

"We also need to look at the issue of pricing. This is a national problem."

Figures today show an ever-growing bill for the NHS, which currently stands at £2.7 billion a year - including £1 billion on accident and emergency services.

That equates to £90 for every taxpayer, while the wider cost to society of alcohol abuse is estimated to be between £17 billion and £22 billion.

In the last year there were 200,000 hospital admissions for alcohol-related conditions, while the number of people treated for extreme drunkenness more than doubled to 18,500.

In the North East, alcohol-related deaths have tripled in the last two decades.

Every 18 hours, one person dies in the North East from alcohol-related illnesses.

Mr Cameron is known to be attracted to proposals under which the sale of alcohol below between 40p and 50p a unit would be banned.

The Prime Minister is examining Scottish moves to outlaw its sale below 45p a unit, as well as a plan to link taxes on drinks to their strength."



Each and every one of us is accountable for our own actions and this deplorable behaviour is not acceptable and makes my blood boil .......!

[Doc Alan]

Each and every one of us is accountable for our own actions and this deplorable behaviour is not acceptable and makes my blood boil .......!
Thank you Rosie :) . Politicians have their own agendas, so do healthcare workers, but I try to be more honest than them .
I don't care if members grow tired of the message I'm giving, so long as you read and think about it.
My " fifteen units a week " is either consumed while doing the quiz at a local pub or in other company,never alone !

[Steve.r]

After just finishing a stubby bottle of Carlsberg Export hic!! I must admit that I am not a heavy drinker, or to put is another way I am a light weight!! but I am happy with that. I have always lived in the countryside, so meeting friends always meant driving and I have never drunk and driven in the Uk.

While in Phils though, I find the drinking culture much more easy to slip into. In the heat or to be social it is nice to down a bottle of Red Horse in the evening or at a party. Last time I was there, on one particular night I did go over the top one evening, my asawa had said she had never seen me drunk before but that night she saw me. I dont do it very often as I hate the after affects, but once in a while shouldn't do me too much harm. My other half said she thought I was funny being drunk as all I did was smile and laugh. But drinking to excess for me is not what I like. Probably like many, you know your limits and know when you have a 'buzz' and know when to stop.

[lastlid]

Like Lastlid, I don't drink alcohol at all and I commented on the previous thread about alcohol.

Don't get me wrong, I do enjoy a drink but I have just simply made a concious decision not to, these days. It hasn't been difficult, quite easy really.

There is also the following in my mind. My wife's father died of alcohol related causes. My ex girlfriends father died of alcohol related liver disease. My fathers drinking was prolific and was a factor in my parents marriage failure. And my ex wife's father was an excessive drinker that led to the ugly breakup of her parents marriage. All of this makes it a little easier for me to not drink a drop.

Also excessive drinking accelerates the ageing process, inhibits the nutrional value of good food and adds to the waisteline etc etc.....I want to live that bit longer than I would do otherwise.

[Doc Alan]

I have always lived in the countryside, so meeting friends always meant driving and I have never drunk and driven in the UK.

While in Phils though, I find the drinking culture much more easy to slip into. In the heat or to be social it is nice to down a bottle of Red Horse in the evening or at a party. But drinking to excess for me is not what I like. Probably like many, you know your limits and know when you have a 'buzz' and know when to stop.
Knowing you, Steve, you don't have a problem with alcohol :).
Drink - driving laws are a good thing. But one consequence has been closure of pubs. An even more significant reason for their relentless closure is cheap supermarket booze. That's regrettable from the social point of view, and it's also why more people drink ( to excess ) at home. There is less control over what they drink at home. Could be worth watching " Britain's Hidden Alcoholics " next Monday ( 20 ) on BBC One.

[Arthur Little]

Likewise, :iagree: ... from bitter > :36_1_26[1]: < experience. :D

Whilst primarily, *it was used in response to comments about the :freezin: Scottish weather, the *above post could equally be applied to the main topic being discussed ... namely, 'Alcohol - what's new?'

Accordingly, therefore, emphasis is placed on the word "bitter". Bitter - commonly referred to as "best bitter" (when used to describe certain brands of ale) - immediately conjures up the notion of its being a sharp, acrid and, by definition, unpleasant substance. Yet, conversely, :anerikke: its universal appeal remains largely undiminished.

[lastlid]

Could be worth watching " Britain's Hidden Alcoholics " next Monday ( 20 ) on BBC One.

Watched it. Interesting.

[Terpe]

.....There is less control over what they drink at home. Could be worth watching " Britain's Hidden Alcoholics " next Monday ( 20 ) on BBC One.


Watched it. Interesting.

I've got my recorder set-up and will watch later.

[Doc Alan]

I watched " Britain's Hidden Alcoholics ", the documentary by Alastair Campbell, Tony Blair's former spin doctor. He gave up drinking in the 1980's as he was " cracking up through a combination of drink, overwork, and depression ". Now he has " the occasional glass of wine " and is " addicted to jogging ". We were treated to rather many shots of him jogging ( and not looking happy ). His messages were threefold :
* Britain has a serious problem with alcohol abuse.
* The Government can give guidance, set rules and regulations to curb excess drinking.
* Ultimately it's for all of us as individuals to assess our own relationship with alcohol.
The Government is publishing an alcohol strategy for England this year. Scotland, Northern Ireland, and the Republic of Ireland already intend to bring in minimum pricing, with other actions. A complete ban will never be attempted - how much the general public will accept by way of tough action remains to be seen. Despite all that's been said, many of us do enjoy alcohol in moderation.

[Doc Alan]

Compared to the UK, there is little information available about alcohol in the Philippines, so this is “ distilled “ from sources published a few years ago – see http://www.ihra.net/files/2010/05/02/Presentation_23rd_M10_Labajo.pdf http://www.ias.org.uk/resources/publications/theglobe/globe200103-04/gl200103-04_p12.html
Alcohol consumption is increasing by 10% a year. About 2/5 filipinos are occasional drinkers, over a tenth regular drinkers and 1/20 heavy drinkers ( males more commonly ). Most of them drink beer, although wine consumption is increasing. Beers are widely available in grocery and convenience stores. Wine, whisky, Tanduay rum, lambanog and others are supposed only to be bought in liquor stores, but monitoring is lax. 3/5 of Filipino youths aged 13 and above appear to have access to alcohol, especially males. Minimum legal drinking age is 18. Manufacturing of beer and liquors is one of the most profitable industries. Alcohol appears in the media as part of day-to-day life for Filipinos – through advertising, soap operas, comedy shows, music video channels and sports.
An average Filipino family spends 1% of its income on alcohol ( up to 20% for heavy drinkers ).
Reasons for alcohol consumption seem to be much the same as the UK.
Local alcoholic drinks include basi ( sugarcane ), lambanog ( coconut ), tuba or tapuy ( rice ). Consumption tends to be in regions where they are produced ( Ilocos, Mountain Province, Quezon, Negros ).
There are minimum police records on petty crimes and traffic violations during fiestas and beer festivals. There is no law against drunk driving, which is on the increase ; only a traffic violation when it causes injuries. http://www.mb.com.ph/node/268549/drinking-and-driving-philippine
Cirrhosis and liver cancer are commoner than in the UK ( but hepatitis B is the major cause ). http://www.mb.com.ph/articles/241355/liver-cirrhosis-causes-and-complications Other illnesses are similar to UK. Alcohol rehabilitation centers have low admission rates compared to similar institutions for drug dependency. Many filipinos don't consider alcohol abuse as a medical problem. It's certainly not recognised as such a problem – so far – in the Philippines, compared to UK.

[Terpe]

I've got no statistics, it's just what I notice on TFC news programmes. But, looking at the reasons for most murders in the Philippines, it seems that alcohol is usually involved. Arguments are very common when someone has been 'drinking', and loads of people carry either guns or knives.

Just an opinion.

[Doc Alan]

Your opinion seems to be borne out by facts, Terpe, although below are in part best estimates :-
* Alcohol appears to be involved in half of all crime in the UK.
*Many victims of violent crime are drinking or under the influence of alcohol at the time of their assault.
* Over one-third of offenders have a current problem with alcohol use, and a similar proportion with binge drinking.
* Nearly half had misused alcohol in the past.
* One third had violent behaviour related to their alcohol use.
*Alcohol had been consumed prior to the offence in nearly three-quarters of domestic violence cases and was a ‘feature’ in almost two-thirds . About half of these convicted domestic violence offenders were alcohol dependent.
*At least 1 in 5 people arrested by police test positive for alcohol.
* Alcohol is a factor in:
- Half to two thirds of homicides
- Three quarters of stabbings
- Half of fights and domestic assaults
- 1 in 5 road deaths
*In Scottish Accident & Emergency admissions, over two thirds of assaults are related to alcohol. Most of these assaults are at weekends, many involved being under 30.
*There are more homicides in Philippines than UK, a majority gun–related, although I don’t have figures for how often alcohol is involved.
-Homicides during 2009 – Total / Rate per 1000,000.
Philippines: 4,947 / 5.4
United Kingdom: 724 / 1.2

[Terpe]

Those statistics are a real eye opener.
When you add up all the costs of crime plus NHS incurred costs I wonder if they outweigh the income generated by alcohol tax and duty.

I'm in no way suggesting a ban :yikes: I enjoy a drink.
I'm sure there must be other ways to both increase income from alcohol and to also significantly reduce costs to the public purse.
Maybe, increasing the legal age to drink alcohol from 18 to 21 could be one strategy?

I read somewhere that even the Romans complained bitterly about the level of drinking in Britannia :D:

[lastlid]

I don't really find the stats surprising. The stats demonstrate why it is genuinely a national issue, that society as a whole needs to tackle.


Also see Dedworths link on bar brawl in the House of Commons :D :


http://filipinaroses.com/showthread.php/36359-Bar-brawl-at-House-of-Commons

[Doc Alan]

Those statistics are a real eye opener.
When you add up all the costs of crime plus NHS incurred costs I wonder if they outweigh the income generated by alcohol tax and duty.

I'm in no way suggesting a ban :yikes: I enjoy a drink.
I'm sure there must be other ways to both increase income from alcohol and to also significantly reduce costs to the public purse.
Maybe, increasing the legal age to drink alcohol from 18 to 21 could be one strategy?

The total tax revenue from alcohol in the UK was estimated at £ 5.7 billion three years ago - far outweighed by the NHS and " society " costs ( again an estimate of £ 17 - 22 billion ).
As you say, no UK government would try to ban alcohol. Increasing the legal age to 21 has been suggested as more 21 year olds look like adults than 18 year olds, even without formal identification.
Let's see what the Government's alcohol strategy for England has to say when it's published later this year.
Cheers :xxgrinning--00xx3:.

[lastlid]

What price / cost / value do you attach to the social cost......immeasurable. :Erm:

[mickcant]

We drank for happiness and became unhappy
We drank for joy and became miserable
We drank to be outgoing and became self-absorbed
We drank to be sociable and became argumentative
We drank for sophistication and became crude & obnoxious
We drank for friendship and made enemies
We drank to soften sorrow and wallowed in self-pity
We drank for sleep and woke without rest
We drank for sex drive and lost our potency
We drank for strength and became weak
We drank medicinally and developed health problems
We drank because of job stress and lost the job
We drank for relaxation and got the shakes
We drank for confidence and became uncertain
We drank for bravery and became afraid
We drank for certainty and became doubtful
We drank to stimulate thought and blacked out
We drank to make conversation and slurred our speech
We drank for warmth and lost our cool
We drank for coolness and lost our warmth
We drank to feel heavenly and discovered hell
We drank to forget and became haunted
We drank for freedom and became slaves
We drank for power and became powerless
We drank to erase our problems and saw them multiply
We drank to cope with life....and invited death