Preparing Appeal against spouse visa refusal.

[bigmarco]

Hi Everyone
Just to let you know we have submitted a letter of reconsideration to the ECM and are waiting to see if this has any luck.
In the meantime my wifes papers will be arriving by FEDEX tommorrow together with her completed appeal form for me to send on to the appeal tribunal togerher with the fee.
I am intending to request an Oral appeal as I feel it would be more beneficial if I actually turn up and was wondering if any of our experts agree that this is the best course.
Secondly is there any benefit to be gained in getting some professional help for the appeal and if so can anybody recommend somebody suitable.
Lastly has any of our members had any experience of an Oral appeal and if so is there any information on what actually happens.
Many thanks

[imagine]

cant help you myself with that info, but im wishing you all the luck :xxgrinning--00xx3:

[juvyjones28]

Good luck and God speed on your route Mark! :Wave: I'm pretty sure you will win the appeal, you do have a strong case:xxgrinning--00xx3: Stay positive, we will be praying for you both:pray:

[lastlid]

Yes. Good luck Marco.

[joebloggs]

Oral hearing is much better than paper hearing. At an oral hearing you will be present and can argue your case, whereas in paper hearing, it will be heard in your absence for this reason you should have a better chance than a paper hearing.

i doubt it will get this far Marco. I'm sure it will be over turned by the ECM.

[lastlid]

Oral hearing is much better than paper hearing. At an oral hearing you will be present and can argue your case, whereas in paper hearing, it will be heard in your absence for this reason you should have a better chance than a paper hearing.

i doubt it will get this far Marco. I'm sure it will be over turned by the ECM.

And I hope with an apology and a cheque for £800 ..........

[Terpe]

..I am intending to request an Oral appeal as I feel it would be more beneficial if I actually turn up and was wondering if any of our experts agree that this is the best course.
Secondly is there any benefit to be gained in getting some professional help for the appeal and if so can anybody recommend somebody suitable.
Lastly has any of our members had any experience of an Oral appeal and if so is there any information on what actually happens.
Many thanks

I fully agree with your decision on Oral Appeal.
You will find that these affairs are much more informal than you might imagine and you will have every chance to participate.

Personally, I would be surprised and shocked if your case was not overturned and actually went to appeal.
If, for whatever reasons, it did go to appeal then on balance that in itself would suggest something is not as it should be and I personally would suggest securing the involvement of a professional to help you. Especially when presenting existing supporting caselaw.
I'll PM you if your request for reconsideration doesn't work out.

[Doc Alan]

Not my area of expertise but you're well supported here and I wish you all the best :xxgrinning--00xx3:.

[raynaputi]

Good luck bigmarco :xxgrinning--00xx3:

[joebloggs]

i think most people who go to appeal use a professional to represent them, but some people have not, like Terpe has said, it shouldn't be as formal as you think, even on the day the HO representitive might not turn up or they could withdraw the refusal.

but i'm sure it will be over turned by the ECO manager before it gets that far.

[sars_notd_virus]

best of luck bigmarco:xxgrinning--00xx3:

[rusty]

Good luck with your appeal. :xxgrinning--00xx3:

Would agree that the oral appeal would be better and feel that, given that you have answers to all the reasons for refusal backed with evidence, the need for professional help may not be needed.

[scottishbride]

Good luck on your visa appeal! I am sure you will get it sorted, you have a strong case.

[stevie c]

Good luck marco as others have said i also doubt very much that i will reach the appeal stage.....Im sure it will be overturned.

[andy222]

All the best mate.:xxgrinning--00xx3:

[Arthur Little]

You can rely on the full support of your friends and co-forumers here, Marco ... ALL THE VERY BEST to you! :xxgrinning--00xx3:

[bigmarco]

Thank you everyone and I hope and pray you are right. Many thanks for all your kind words and support you are all truly remarkable. I will of course keep you updated as we progress .

[Stevi]

Good luck!!! All the best! You can do it!:)

[tone]

Good luck Mate really hope they see sense and reverse their idiotic decision.

Tone

[Rosie1958]

The very best of luck to you both Big Marco, we are all behind you! :xxgrinning--00xx3:

[bruce]

Mate I really do feel for you ..we got my wife's visa but my step-sons was refused so i know how you are feeling right now.. of course my wife will not come here without our son ..I would not allow it either ..so we are fighting it ...so much work went into our applications just like yours I am sure, so this time we have decided to get help with our appeal, I just can not go through it again without some help....yes it will cost us money that we can not really afford but we have to..this time round we have to be as sure as we can be of getting our sons visa no matter what the cost it ...think very carefully mate, I would have to advise you to seek help ..sod the money ...

Please keep in touch ...I wish you the very best ..u are not alone, if u ever feel like a chat just shout eh ...Bruce ..

[bigmarco]

Hi Bruce
I understand why you are going for some help because you feel its hard to go through it again.
Our problem is my wife got some professional help in the Philippines for our initial application because we wanted to make sure we covered all bases. She signed a contract and it was quite alot of money (80000 php) with half upfront and half when we get visa. In hindsight I wish I had done the application myself with the help of the guys here as I feel I just wasted money.
I'm going to see what the outcome of the appeal is at the Embassy and if they uphold the refusal then I will seek professional help for the appeal in the UK.
I must say that as much as I was shocked by our decision I found yours to be really disturbing. In our refusal they are talking about abandonment of a child and in yours they are effectively splitting a Mother and child. I have no doubt that common sense will prevail in both our cases and I just pray that it is sooner rather than later.
Chin up my friend and I pray you have some good news soon Mark

[bigmarco]

Attached is a copy Email we received from the British Embassy this morning. I'm starting to pull my hair out now as the appeal documents quite clearly state the appeal can either be submitted to the Tribunal service in the UK or To the Embassy. I decided to submit to the Embassy in the belief that it would assist the ECM in reviewing the case. Quite why they should send this is beyond me. My wife has today forwarded a prepaid courier envelope to the Embassy to get our appeal documents back so they can be submitted to the UK. Cant help but think we've done something to upset these people as although they have acknowledged our letter of reconsideration as yet we have no response to the points raised in it.........

Dear Mrs. O’Donnell,



You have submitted appeal papers to this office, however your appeal must be lodged directly with HM Courts and Tribunals Service (HMCTS) in the UK.



Your appeal is also subject to a fee payable to HM Courts & Tribunals Service (HMCTS).



Details of how to pay the fee and lodge your appeal are available from the link below.



http://www.justice.gov.uk/



Your papers will be returned to you and have not been forwarded to the Tribunal Service. Please send a pre-paid courier envelope to the following address to enable us send your appeal documents back to you:



Appeals/AR Team (xxxxxxxxx)

Visa Services

British Embassy Manila

120 Upper McKinley Road

McKinley Hill

Taguig City 1634





Sincerely yours,

[andy222]

Bloody hell mate what a game.:doh

[Maria B]

Hi Everyone
Just to let you know we have submitted a letter of reconsideration to the ECM and are waiting to see if this has any luck.
In the meantime my wifes papers will be arriving by FEDEX tommorrow together with her completed appeal form for me to send on to the appeal tribunal togerher with the fee.
I am intending to request an Oral appeal as I feel it would be more beneficial if I actually turn up and was wondering if any of our experts agree that this is the best course.
Secondly is there any benefit to be gained in getting some professional help for the appeal and if so can anybody recommend somebody suitable.
Lastly has any of our members had any experience of an Oral appeal and if so is there any information on what actually happens.
Many thanks

Hello bigmarco,

I agree with you that it's best to have the oral appeal in where u can talk to the judges/members of the board straigthforward with your papers on hand to defend & find answers on the reason about your wife's spouse visa refusal.

If u want to gain help from the professional, you may find the MP in your area (mostly u can check it online) & check their office schedules for a free consultation. They will give u suggestions.

My husband did an Oral appeal (but different story...it's about my son's appeal).

Wish you all the luck & hope to hear good news about your appeal in the future.:Wave:

[joebloggs]

bigmarco you can no longer send appeal papers to the embassy, they only changed it recently, nov last year i think.

you sent your letter to the ECM at the embassy ??

hopefully they will over rule the refusal..

[Maria B]

:Erm: sorry bigmarco...

in my understanding, the appeal is being processed in the UK embassy Manila and not in the UK?

My suggestion is...u can appeal it here in the UK in behalf of your wifey. Once refused, they always attached a form if u want to appeal to the tribunal either in the Philippines or in the UK. If ever you've choose to process in the UK, all communication will be address to you (u can email them too) and a copy of the same communication will be sent to your wife as well. It will take about 3 months to wait as the UK embassy will forward an investigation to the Phil. embassy mentioning the person who refused the visa ( seen in the refusal paper ). BUT I have no idea if the procedure is the same as we are talking different status.

May I ask if you (or your wife) have tried to appear in the UK embassy Manila? Please let me know as all I wanted to know if they have cctv inside and all interviews are recorded.

I am just appealing again to the higher court (in the UK) as they are really squeezing me & my husband that they don't keep the records for long. We ask for the transcript & we are not satisfied. That's why we asked for the recorded (interview). Sometimes we thought to ask help from the human rights on why these people keeps me away from my son (who is now 20) :bigcry:

Sometimes I feel like losing hope/
Thank you.

[bigmarco]

bigmarco you can no longer send appeal papers to the embassy, they only changed it recently, nov last year i think.

you sent your letter to the ECM at the embassy ??

hopefully they will over rule the refusal..

Hi Joe it would be handy if they changed this information on the appeal papers as they quite clearly stated we could submit to either UK tribunal or British Embassy Manila. We will wait for their return and then send them on to the tribunal. Just a little bit annoyed at the time wasted.
Yes the letter of reconsideration was sent to the Embassy aswell which they acknowledged but have not responded to as yet other than to mention the appeal process in their E mail. I'm hoping that they take some notice of this otherwise I fear this could drag on for sometime.

[bigmarco]

:Erm: sorry bigmarco...

in my understanding, the appeal is being processed in the UK embassy Manila and not in the UK?

My suggestion is...u can appeal it here in the UK in behalf of your wifey. Once refused, they always attached a form if u want to appeal to the tribunal either in the Philippines or in the UK. If ever you've choose to process in the UK, all communication will be address to you (u can email them too) and a copy of the same communication will be sent to your wife as well. It will take about 3 months to wait as the UK embassy will forward an investigation to the Phil. embassy mentioning the person who refused the visa ( seen in the refusal paper ). BUT I have no idea if the procedure is the same as we are talking different status.

May I ask if you (or your wife) have tried to appear in the UK embassy Manila? Please let me know as all I wanted to know if they have cctv inside and all interviews are recorded.

I am just appealing again to the higher court (in the UK) as they are really squeezing me & my husband that they don't keep the records for long. We ask for the transcript & we are not satisfied. That's why we asked for the recorded (interview). Sometimes we thought to ask help from the human rights on why these people keeps me away from my son (who is now 20) :bigcry:

Sometimes I feel like losing hope/
Thank you.

Hi maria
Yes once we get the papers back from the Embassy we will forward appeal to tribunal in Uk and I have asked for oral hearing so that I can appear in person and answer any questions.
My wife has not appeared at Embassy as she was not asked to and they never even phoned her.
Our refusal was ridiculous and most of their grounds could have been sorted out in a phone conversation but they obviously have no interest in resolving these matters quickly merely to put further obstacles infront of you.
I'm sorry to hear of your problems aswell and hope and pray that you like us can have a happy resolution some day soon. Stay strong and determined and I'm sure you will prevail.

[Maria B]

thank u for the kind words bigmarco....

[Dedworth]

Attached is a copy Email we received from the British Embassy this morning. I'm starting to pull my hair out now as the appeal documents quite clearly state the appeal can either be submitted to the Tribunal service in the UK or To the Embassy. I decided to submit to the Embassy in the belief that it would assist the ECM in reviewing the case. Quite why they should send this is beyond me. My wife has today forwarded a prepaid courier envelope to the Embassy to get our appeal documents back so they can be submitted to the UK. Cant help but think we've done something to upset these people as although they have acknowledged our letter of reconsideration as yet we have no response to the points raised in it.........

Dear Mrs. O’Donnell,



You have submitted appeal papers to this office, however your appeal must be lodged directly with HM Courts and Tribunals Service (HMCTS) in the UK.



Your appeal is also subject to a fee payable to HM Courts & Tribunals Service (HMCTS).



Details of how to pay the fee and lodge your appeal are available from the link below.



http://www.justice.gov.uk/



Your papers will be returned to you and have not been forwarded to the Tribunal Service. Please send a pre-paid courier envelope to the following address to enable us send your appeal documents back to you:



Appeals/AR Team (xxxxxxxxx)

Visa Services

British Embassy Manila

120 Upper McKinley Road

McKinley Hill

Taguig City 1634





Sincerely yours,


Madness - time to appraise your MP of the situation with these idiots

[joebloggs]

Sometimes we thought to ask help from the human rights on why these people keeps me away from my son (who is now 20) :bigcry:

how old was your son when you applied for the visa , over 18 ?

[joebloggs]

i think it was always quick to appeal in the country you were refused in, because the ECM would look at your grounds for appeal and they could withdraw the refusal, if they didnt then they would send the appeals forms to the UK.

but if you appealled in the UK, they would send your appeal form to the ECM in Manila to reconisder your grounds for appealling, then the ECM would either withdraw the refusal or not and the appeal would go ahead, so taking longer

so it was in most cases quicker to appeal in the country you were refused (becuase the Tribuneral didnt have to send the papers to manila).

[Maria B]

how old was your son when you applied for the visa , over 18 ?

hi joebloggs...
he was 17 when we lodged the settlement visa...he just turned 18 after he got the appointment for his biometric. A week after he was then invited to the UK embassy in Taguig City for appearance with some questions & answers. My Dad was there with him as his guidance/moral support but they throw questions at him. Of course he's nervous.

[Maria B]

i think it was always quick to appeal in the country you were refused in, because the ECM would look at your grounds for appeal and they could withdraw the refusal, if they didnt then they would send the appeals forms to the UK.

but if you appealled in the UK, they would send your appeal form to the ECM in Manila to reconisder your grounds for appealling, then the ECM would either withdraw the refusal or not and the appeal would go ahead, so taking longer

so it was in most cases quicker to appeal in the country you were refused (becuase the Tribuneral didnt have to send the papers to manila).

This was also my Dad's suggestion to myself & hubby before. But hubby wanted to do it here...I was wondering 'what if' we listen to Dad:Erm:

[Arthur Little]

:doh ... what a palaver! Change for the sake of change! Just like Royal Mail. :rolleyes:

[joebloggs]

hi joebloggs...
he was 17 when we lodged the settlement visa...he just turned 18 after he got the appointment for his biometric. A week after he was then invited to the UK embassy in Taguig City for appearance with some questions & answers. My Dad was there with him as his guidance/moral support but they throw questions at him. Of course he's nervous.

you've said in a previous post your son is now 20 ? :Erm:

[Maria B]

you've said in a previous post your son is now 20 ? :Erm:

Yes at the mo my son is 20 yrs of age. At the time of lodging his settlement visa he was 17. When he was called for the biotmetrics he just turned 18. My husband explained to me & let me understand more about the appeal procedure. First of all:
*we lodge the appeal here in the UK, it tell us on the refusal paper what office to appeal.
*once an appeal is lodged in the UK the embassy in the Phils will have to send all infos to the appeal courts. That papers are called 'bundle' we make sure that we clearly state all the grievances when we send the appeal form.
*the appeal judge is completely independent.

When it is time for the appeal hearing make sure that you have all your grievances & questions wrote down so that u do not miss to mentioned anything.

We are now appealing against the first appeal. Also my husband is seeking legal advise where we stand within the human rights judgement on this matters because they are keeping a family apart. My husband does know of a case recently where the human rights told the British govt that they cannot keep a husband away from his british wife.

[Stevi]

Best of Luck,,,,!!!!!!:Hellooo:

[joebloggs]

Yes at the mo my son is 20 yrs of age. At the time of lodging his settlement visa he was 17. When he was called for the biotmetrics he just turned 18. My husband explained to me & let me understand more about the appeal procedure. First of all:
*we lodge the appeal here in the UK, it tell us on the refusal paper what office to appeal.
*once an appeal is lodged in the UK the embassy in the Phils will have to send all infos to the appeal courts. That papers are called 'bundle' we make sure that we clearly state all the grievances when we send the appeal form.
*the appeal judge is completely independent.

When it is time for the appeal hearing make sure that you have all your grievances & questions wrote down so that u do not miss to mentioned anything.

We are now appealing against the first appeal. Also my husband is seeking legal advise where we stand within the human rights judgement on this matters because they are keeping a family apart. My husband does know of a case recently where the human rights told the British govt that they cannot keep a husband away from his british wife.

you been appealing for more than 2 years ?

[bigmarco]

you been appealing for more than 2 years ?
I was thinking that aswell. I really hope our one doesn't drag on for that long.

[joebloggs]

I was thinking that aswell. I really hope our one doesn't drag on for that long.

i cant see it taking that long, lets hope your refusal will be over turned before it goes to appeal, how can the HO try and justify the refusal and look like :censored: at a tribunal :doh

[bruce]

Mate.. just remember that even if they ignore your reconsideration letter it still does not mean it will go all the way to an appeal hearing ....they can ignore a reconsideration letter but they can NOT ignore an appeal ..

It will be submitted in the UK then it will be sent to the Philippines for reconsideration. Once it arrives back in the Philippines they of course have two choices ..either over turn there original decision and grant your wife a visa or they can decide to fight it and stick to the refusal...should they do this the appeal will then head back to England and you will be informed of an appeal date ..always take the oral option @ the hearing eh ..should it ever get that far ....

Time wise is very hard to predict ..it has been know for the ECO in the Philippines to grant visa 2 days before hearing!!!!(leaving it for as long as they can) on other occasion it has been overturned fairly quickly ..from the advice I have been given it can be anything from 3 weeks up to 6 months depending on ECO ...

Good luck and lets all hope reconsideration letter does the trick ..if not lets hope they overturn there original decision quickly ?? ..

[tiger@tigress]

Hi all

I am confuse of where to send your appeal for Visit visa refusal.
Is it to British Embassy Manila or to
PO Box in Leicester?:Erm::Help1::icon_sorry::Cuckoo:

[Terpe]

Hi all

I am confuse of where to send your appeal for Visit visa refusal.
Is it to British Embassy Manila or to
PO Box in Leicester?:Erm::Help1::icon_sorry::Cuckoo:

If this was in connection with a visa for Family Visit you should have received all appeal details with the refusal letter.
If this was a General Visit visa (tourist) then there is no appeal process allowed.
The cheapest and quickest solution would probably be to re-apply, however this would depend on the reasons for refusal and you being able to satisy the ECO on those reasons in the next application.

[tiger@tigress]

It is for family visit and they got the appeal details as well but i dont is there fee to make an appeal and how much?

[Terpe]

I'm really sorry to hear about your Family Visit visa refusal.
Along with all the appeals details you also should have received details of the potential charges/fees.

May I suggest you take a look here at the UKBA webpage on Appeals System (http://www.ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk/asylum/outcomes/unsuccessfulapplications/appeals/system)

As I mentioned in my earlier reply, it may be much cheaper and quicker to just make a new application. Many appeals are taking quite a long time and with potiential fees of around £100
I have to admit I don't know how the new fees/charges are actually worked out.

An appeal may be a good route for you if you believe the ECO made a mistake.

If you don't mind my asking, what was the key reason given for the refusal?
If the ECO doubted compelling reasons to return, it may be difficult to counter this view in the tribunal