New "income support rates"????just need some clarifications

[chieldave]

Maybe Sir Terpe wanted to enlighten me bit with this....:Erm:
Was just reading this thread http://filipinaroses.com/showthread.php/26857-Applying-for-a-Fiance-or-Spouse-Visa-A-quick-guide?highlight=vip+premium+fee
then was happened to read under sir Terpe's post on number 23 regarding his reply to income support rates and under that is the website where u managed to find it http://www.focusondisability.org.uk/brates-1.html....was just bit surprised if how true it is or I'm just making my self troubling with nothing:doh,,,clicking that site gives u the rates for the year April 2012 to 2013 and April 2011 to 2012...me aware that my sponsor(hubby) should left at least 106 pounds thingy every week after tax and expenses,but seemed the rates given for april 2012-2013 gets higher to 111.45 pounds:yikes:..pls. pardon me if I'm just understood it wrongly sir as sites mentioned benefits thingy....thanks advance

[Terpe]

Maybe Sir Terpe wanted to enlighten me bit with this....:Erm:
Was just reading this thread http://filipinaroses.com/showthread.php/26857-Applying-for-a-Fiance-or-Spouse-Visa-A-quick-guide?highlight=vip+premium+fee
then was happened to read under sir Terpe's post on number 23 regarding his reply to income support rates and under that is the website where u managed to find it http://www.focusondisability.org.uk/brates-1.html....was just bit surprised if how true it is or I'm just making my self troubling with nothing:doh,,,clicking that site gives u the rates for the year April 2012 to 2013 and April 2011 to 2012...me aware that my sponsor(hubby) should left at least 106 pounds thingy every week after tax and expenses,but seemed the rates given for april 2012-2013 gets higher to 111.45 pounds:yikes:..pls. pardon me if I'm just understood it wrongly sir as sites mentioned benefits thingy....thanks advance

That is correct.
The 2012/2013 weekly rates for Income Support (with effect from April 6 2012) are:-
Couple - both aged 18 or over £111.45
Dependent Child - from birth to day before 20 £64.99

The thread and post you mention is dated 2010 and much of that information is now somewhat old and is therefore out of date.
It's important to review only recent posts about those issues, especially concerning any visa applications.

Hope that helps

[chieldave]

:)yes sir i do understand that some infos on that thread is bit old already and some is outdated ....but in regards with the site where we can see the income support rate for 2012-2013,is this mean that if we try to put basis of how much the weekly left should be by the sponsor,that should be 111.45 starting now this april 2012 till april 2013 and not 105.95 anymore like I mostly seen from other current threads here asking basis/guide of income support left weekly?not seen yet here the most current thread stating the new basis/guide of weekly income left so that's why i posted this for clarification.just may others who going to apply on coming months from now will be aware too if it so...:NoNo: getting higher and higher now....thanks again sir

[chieldave]

does it mean that say if we start our 6 months bank statement this month of april or may, my hubby's bank statement at least must have 111.45 left after expenses weekly not 105.95 the basis anymore?..sorry for keep repeating it,just really wanted to be sure..would be glad to hear reply from others as well:Help1:...
thank u

[Terpe]

does it mean that say if we start our 6 months bank statement this month of april or may, my hubby's bank statement at least must have 111.45 left after expenses weekly not 105.95 the basis anymore?..sorry for keep repeating it,just really wanted to be sure..would be glad to hear reply from others as well:Help1:...
thank u

I hope I can explain this for you. If you still feel confused please don't be shy to ask questions again, I have no problem for questions :xxgrinning--00xx3:

The ECO will eventually want to be sure that AFTER taking account of regular non-discretionary expenditure (such as rent or mortgage payments, council tax and secured loans etc) there is an amount remaining of not less than the income support levels.
This does not mean to say that you must save any specific amount each week/month etc.
It's also not an amount left over after all expenses. It's only the non-discretionary expenditure. (ie the expenditure that you have no choice on)
Spending on food for example is considered discretionary. You choose what to buy and how much to spend.
It only means that you must have that amount available to spend if you so wish.
Just for example if your husband is spending £111.45 on clothes and video games and not actually saving anything, he still has that amount of 'disposable income', just that he is spending it.

Hope this helps

[grahamw48]

The reason the 'amount' needed after expenditure goes up each year is because the equivalent govt. benefit goes up each year....ie, like a 'pay rise'.

Most benefits paid by the govt. are increased by a pound or two every April or November to keep up with inflation, and this therefore affects everything else linked to those benefit amounts.
So nothing mysterious or complicated. :)

[chieldave]

I hope I can explain this for you. If you still feel confused please don't be shy to ask questions again, I have no problem for questions :xxgrinning--00xx3:

The ECO will eventually want to be sure that AFTER taking account of regular non-discretionary expenditure (such as rent or mortgage payments, council tax and secured loans etc) there is an amount remaining of not less than the income support levels.
This does not mean to say that you must save any specific amount each week/month etc.
It's also not an amount left over after all expenses. It's only the non-discretionary expenditure. (ie the expenditure that you have no choice on)
Spending on food for example is considered discretionary. You choose what to buy and how much to spend.
It only means that you must have that amount available to spend if you so wish.
Just for example if your husband is spending £111.45 on clothes and video games and not actually saving anything, he still has that amount of 'disposable income', just that he is spending it.

Hope this helps




:)Wow thanks for that reply sir,,,it lightens me bit:idea:...guess me and my hubby bit had wrong understanding with what we supposed to plan...if you don't mind sir I will just share what we thought to do before I have read your reply,,,I will welcome opinions,suggestions ideas or changes that may help with...
=Hubby has no savings left from his account due to wedding and his visit here last November.Then when he came back there he needs to paid those some due payments he left there(non-discretionary),then the money left each month from last December til last month March been used to discretional expenses(still recovering from some other payments and kitchen repair thingy) so we decided not to start the statements to be shown for until regular flows in out will happen....
=Now,since from this april month regular flows back already,so we decided to start the statement till 6 months that will be on september,at least those money left will be put on savings account as well so at least we have some savings to be shown(better than nothing),BUT
=since we realized that it will take long months before we able to complete it,we can't take longer to be away and not see each other again so we have this plan that he will come here by November exactly our 1st anniversary and that will be the time as well that we will going to apply my spousal visa...we thought its nice idea the fact that not only that we gonna be together on our anniversary,he as well be here with me during that nervous month,BUT
=the fact that he gonna be here means additional expenses for flight coming here and expenses of his stay and not forget the cost as well for visa fees and other documents to be passed:doh.....AND SINCE
=he don't having savings yet so we thought that this money we can save(money left after expenses) from april till june we'll be use for all coming expenses(visa fee and other documents,his flight,his expenses of staying here) and rather we will just start july statement till october that will be shown to embassy where the flow in out is clean and money left as well will be clear enough that its in there,save, and we just transfer it on savings account.........that's what we supposed to plan...
BUT AFTER READ YOUR REPLY,SOMETHING A CHANGED PLAN ON MY MIND THAT GONNA SHARE IT TO HIM BUT NOT SURE IF ITS RIGHT(pls correct me if I'm wrong )
I understand that on his monthly income,what ECO need to see is there's still money left AFTER non discretionary expenditure...so let say for example from this month of May till October he earns 1,200 each month minus 500(non-discretionary,which i think that's called direct debits on his account monthly ie. mortgage,gas,electricity,water,council tax) leave him 700 pounds where on that he use to get his food and money he sending to me monthly leaving say 500 pounds cash or more on monthly bank statement then we gonna transfer it on
his savings account each month that will be continue till October at least we have savings to present at embassy say 2,000-3,000.BUT on that savings is where we gonna get our visa fee/ requirements cost/his flight for November/might get few expenses of his stay here leaving say 1,500 on savings account...MY QUESTION IS,do u think it's just fine the plan about withdrawing money from savings we have for visa fee/ requirements cost/his flight for November/might get few expenses of his stay here) ,and that withdrawals might happen during may,june and october which obviously will be seen by embassy?
REASON FOR WITHDRAWAL BY
MAY = ENGLISH TEST and other expenses of it
JUNE= BUY TICKET for his coming in november
OCTOBER END WEEK = visa fee to pay

Humbly lighten me this:Help1::please::confused:
thank you
My apology if me wrote this in a wrong thread

[chieldave]

The reason the 'amount' needed after expenditure goes up each year is because the equivalent govt. benefit goes up each year....ie, like a 'pay rise'.

Most benefits paid by the govt. are increased by a pound or two every April or November to keep up with inflation, and this therefore affects everything else linked to those benefit amounts.
So nothing mysterious or complicated. :)

ohh,thank you for that info graham:).....yes i understand that its really increasing now and then just that bit surprised when I saw that changes is effective this month as well,thought another month:D:icon_lol::Cuckoo:.sorry for my ignorance..:doh,,ohhh "ignorance of the law excuses no one":NoNo:

[Terpe]

chieldave,

It's the overall financial position that's looked at.
Savings can help but it's not the total amount in your account(s) at the time that's relevant, it's the fact that you must have an on-going regular cash-flow and appear to be in good financial shape.

You need to show that there is a minimum of £111.45 available each week to support you both after deducting total housing costs (rent/mortgage & council tax etc) plus any secured loans.
Any money that your sponsor sends to you in the Philippines is discretionary spending.
All other expenses (food,clothing,electricity/gas/water etc) are also considered discretionary spending.

You will need to submit 3 months bank statements as a bare minimum (6 months is better) to support your financial standing.

In order to support costs for expenses such as the English Test, Visa Charges and flight tickets etc you will need to have access to funding. Whether that funding is from savings or credit cards or from a third party is entirely your own decision.

Remember that the costs of Visa Charges and also for your UK flight tickets will not show on your latest bank statement at the time of visa application.

This information is based only on current UKBA requirements and immigration law.
There is no way of knowing just how these will change for the future.

I hope this helps.

[manilabong]

I am so glad that I chanced upon this thread! It is only now that I understood the discretionary/non-discretionary expenditure. My husband is addicted to video games that he spends a lot on them. I keep telling him to cut it down since I was worried about the reflection it'll make on his bank statements and all I get is a "relax, babe!" :doh

[zaxy]

addicted to video games hope he spend alot time with u when u in uk :)

[manilabong]

addicted to video games hope he spend alot time with u when u in uk :)

Hahaha! Tell me about it! :D

[chieldave]

chieldave,

It's the overall financial position that's looked at.
Savings can help but it's not the total amount in your account(s) at the time that's relevant, it's the fact that you must have an on-going regular cash-flow and appear to be in good financial shape.

You need to show that there is a minimum of £111.45 available each week to support you both after deducting total housing costs (rent/mortgage & council tax etc) plus any secured loans.
Any money that your sponsor sends to you in the Philippines is discretionary spending.
All other expenses (food,clothing,electricity/gas/water etc) are also considered discretionary spending.

You will need to submit 3 months bank statements as a bare minimum (6 months is better) to support your financial standing.

In order to support costs for expenses such as the English Test, Visa Charges and flight tickets etc you will need to have access to funding. Whether that funding is from savings or credit cards or from a third party is entirely your own decision.

Remember that the costs of Visa Charges and also for your UK flight tickets will not show on your latest bank statement at the time of visa application.

This information is based only on current UKBA requirements and immigration law.
There is no way of knowing just how these will change for the future.

I hope this helps.


Sir Terpe,:bigcry:....I'm very sorry again if my brain is so slow of functioning at this moment,,,makes me more confused..
so do you mean our plan is not good idea as it obviously it will appear on my hubby's savings account the withdrawal money of english test/visa fees/flight ticket during those months in which we gonna show at embassy those bank statements as well?(pls correct me again)As we're nowhere we can borrow money for it or loan,hubby want it from his own....

if that so,how about just this plan,how about we will just gonna show 4 months bank stement from july-october then savings account from that july month start as well so it will be obvious that money left on bank statement monthly(ie. 111.45x4 or more) will transfer it on savings account so they will know where money left goes from those month(will not withdraw from it probably 2,000)...then money we gonna spend for english test/visa fees/flight ticket is just the money he will gain from this month april till june but we not going to include these bank statement of course...IF NOT STILL,

does it mean that we need to gain first the money for expenses english test/visa fees/flight ticket,then gain money to have some on savings account(considering that we not going to ask another sponsor or somebody that could let us borrow money for it or loan for it) say maybe april till october then just after that we can start focusing the bank statement that we gonna pass at embassy which has good cash flow in out say nov-jan2013(at least 3 months) then just after that we can apply the visa,since you said"Savings can help but it's not the total amount in your account(s) at the time that's relevant",..... what u think?...really sorry if me still not get the point sir..huhu:Brick::NoNo:

pls give me advice or idea what's best for it....really confused :-(

[Terpe]

Sir Terpe,:bigcry:....I'm very sorry again if my brain is so slow of functioning at this moment,,,makes me more confused..
so do you mean our plan is not good idea as it obviously it will appear on my hubby's savings account the withdrawal money of english test/visa fees/flight ticket during those months in which we gonna show at embassy those bank statements as well?(pls correct me again)As we're nowhere we can borrow money for it or loan,hubby want it from his own....

if that so,how about just this plan,how about we will just gonna show 4 months bank stement from july-october then savings account from that july month start as well so it will be obvious that money left on bank statement monthly(ie. 111.45x4 or more) will transfer it on savings account so they will know where money left goes from those month(will not withdraw from it probably 2,000)...then money we gonna spend for english test/visa fees/flight ticket is just the money he will gain from this month april till june but we not going to include these bank statement of course...IF NOT STILL,

does it mean that we need to gain first the money for expenses english test/visa fees/flight ticket,then gain money to have some on savings account(considering that we not going to ask another sponsor or somebody that could let us borrow money for it or loan for it) say maybe april till october then just after that we can start focusing the bank statement that we gonna pass at embassy which has good cash flow in out say nov-jan2013(at least 3 months) then just after that we can apply the visa,since you said"Savings can help but it's not the total amount in your account(s) at the time that's relevant",..... what u think?...really sorry if me still not get the point sir..huhu:Brick::NoNo:

pls give me advice or idea what's best for it....really confused :-(

Your original plan is OK
Personally I would suggest 6 months bank statements. Don't submit any overdrawn.

[chieldave]

if that so,how about just this plan,how about we will just gonna show 4 months bank stement from july-october then savings account from that july month start as well so it will be obvious that money left on bank statement monthly(ie. 111.45x4 or more) will transfer it on savings account so they will know where money left goes from those month(will not withdraw from it probably 2,000)...then money we gonna spend for english test/visa fees/flight ticket is just the money he will gain from this month april till june but we not going to include these bank statement of course..

that's really our original plan sir as we have no choice to get money from any close family/relatives/another sponsor or anyone to let us borrow of gift for us that will serve as our savings,so we just thought that what we gain each month of that 4 months bank statement that we gonna show to them will put it or transfer it to savings account(2,000maybe)...
he never gets overdrawn just either the reason is due to pay for non discretionary or discretionary expenditure,just sometimes 0 balance before...yes me even feel more comfy to submit 6 months bank statement but it means it will not till December,but since he planning to come here on our anniversary,we just thought that might good time to submit application even bit we take the risk of just 4 months bank statement....really praying:pray: that it will have good result after all,just so hard being away with each other:NoNo:

Personally sir,if I would ask you how much the percentage of positive results about the plan(just about financial thingy),what would you rate?sorry,I know it's bit silly question ,but just to gain us bit confident about it,but I would thank you as well if u say frankly less percentage...(sigh)

[Terpe]

.....Personally sir,if I would ask you how much the percentage of positive results about the plan(just about financial thingy),what would you rate?sorry,I know it's bit silly question ,but just to gain us bit confident about it,but I would thank you as well if u say frankly less percentage...(sigh)

I know you'll understand when I tell you it's impossible for anyone to predict.
The ECO will make a decision based upon the whole application, not just on that part involving the financial test.
If you can fully comply with all requirements to the satisfaction of the immigration rules and the ECO then the visa is yours.

[chieldave]

I know you'll understand when I tell you it's impossible for anyone to predict.
The ECO will make a decision based upon the whole application, not just on that part involving the financial test.
If you can fully comply with all requirements to the satisfaction of the immigration rules and the ECO then the visa is yours.

yes sir I understand that,was thought u gonna say that:D.....anyway sir Thank you so much for all the replies:)....I still have more concerns but gonna put it in another right thread:xxgrinning--00xx3:

[tiger31]

:)yes sir i do understand that some infos on that thread is bit old already and some is outdated ....but in regards with the site where we can see the income support rate for 2012-2013,is this mean that if we try to put basis of how much the weekly left should be by the sponsor,that should be 111.45 starting now this april 2012 till april 2013 and not 105.95 anymore like I mostly seen from other current threads here asking basis/guide of income support left weekly?not seen yet here the most current thread stating the new basis/guide of weekly income left so that's why i posted this for clarification.just may others who going to apply on coming months from now will be aware too if it so...:NoNo: getting higher and higher now....thanks again sir
it maybe getting higher and higher but try living on that amount its not easy

[zaxy]

nothing easy in this world i wish my gf can join me in uk but life getting hard in uk :(

[davidbulsara]

hi.....i am the husband of chieldave.....hello to all.....there has been a bit of confusion between myself and my wife concerning my bank statements and how it should look to the embassy firstly i think i am right in understanding that as long as i were to leave £111 in my bank account or even more which is very possible then would it matter if anything other than the £111 were to be withdrawn would not matter?....for example i save £111 for which will be left in every week for at least till my wife arrives here in uk and on top of that i will be saving up for visa fee then withdraw it out within 6 month period but still not touched the £111 savings then told embassy that the withdrawal was for the visa fees then that would surely be acceptable??? but as i understood from my wife that it would be negative on their part to see such a large amount come out all at once seems insane to me as it is for very good purpose and for them and seems absolutely ridiculous that the withdrawal should be even questioned!!!!!

[Terpe]

I believe if you read through the posts in this thread, and also follow the links, then you'll have a much better understanding.

No offence intended.

[davidbulsara]

really just wanted for simple answer cos new to this site.....no offence too

[Terpe]

really just wanted for simple answer cos new to this site.....no offence too

OK, I'll try. here goes.

On the financial support issue the UKBA wants to be convinced that you can support yourselves without any additional public funds.

As it stands right now there is no any actual amount stated in the 'immigration rules' that indicate just how much is considered as 'sufficient'. It's up to the sponsor and applicant to prove there is sufficient for them to maintain themselves.

UKBA will be looking at the amount of money left after any regular non-discretionary expenditure (such as rent or mortgage payments, council tax and secured loans etc)

Various Immigration Tribunal's have concluded that it would not be appropriate to have immigrant families existing on resources that were less than the 'Income Support Level' for a British family of the same size.
So although appoximate, it is probably the best guide available.

In principle this means that if the total amount of money that the applicant and sponsor will have to live on will be below what the income support level would be for a British family of that size, then it may be appropriate to refuse the application on maintenance and accommodation grounds.

Your bank statements will normally show your income and your outgoing expenditure. ECO's are not accountants but, if you are generally living within your means and can afford the cost of another adult consumer joining the household, this should be immediately obvious.

Only those people with very low income that regularly leave them with a discretionary income close or equal to the equivalent of means-tested benefit might feel the need to make a budget plan to signpost how they can afford another consuming person in the house.

[davidbulsara]

thank u for the time you have spent writing that......much appreciated......so as long as i show maybe say for example £150 after all compulsary payments have gone out would it be fair to assume that extra money apart from the £150 i can withdraw from my bank at any time for visa fees or anything else?

[Terpe]

I'm not sure I understand your question there.

If you have £111.45 per week available after your non-discretionary expenses (mortgage/rent/council tax/loans etc then that is sufficient to support you both.

Cash savings are not specified but it makes sense to be able to show at least enough to cover expenses like visa fees, air tickets etc

[davidbulsara]

thank you ...thats all i need to know...will be able to keep to plans now for november...i thought the same thing as long as i have the funds to show that i can provide for my wife then other money or savings the embassy are not too fussed about....thanks again.....regards....david:)

[Terpe]

thank you ...thats all i need to know...will be able to keep to plans now for november...i thought the same thing as long as i have the funds to show that i can provide for my wife then other money or savings the embassy are not too fussed about....thanks again.....regards....david:)

You're welcome David, that's why were're here.
Hope you'll find time to pop in now and then and keep us updated on your progress.

There's really a lot of very useful stuff here just waiting for you both.

Good luck with your plans :xxgrinning--00xx3:

[davidbulsara]

can i ask what this means please?....."Remember that the costs of Visa Charges and also for your UK flight tickets will not show on your latest bank statement at the time of visa application."

[andy222]

The charges will show on your statement the month after your visa application.

[davidbulsara]

thank you for that andy....does that mean that it would be wrong to take out visa fees from my bank account while statements are being checked by embassy?

[davidbulsara]

or within the 6 month period?...or does that not matter when i take visa fee money out as long as i have the £111 every week showing up?

[andy222]

David just make sure you have enough money in your account for the flights and visa at the time you submit your bank statements. I believe you can pay on the day you submit your visa application. :xxgrinning--00xx3:

[davidbulsara]

sorry andy.....lost u a bit there do you mean flight for my wife to come here or my flight to go there and see her again?....cos if it is flight for her to come here how is that possible to predict that she will be accepted and if not flight is none refundable......if flight for me to see her then i need to book flight well before we submit application like i intend to book flight next month.....sorry for being confused

[andy222]

Depends whether you are travelling back together or she is coming here on her own David. Just have enough money in your account to meet the needs.:xxgrinning--00xx3:

[davidbulsara]

thanks andy.....what our plan is that from july 1st thats when bank statements will start till december.....would like to have only 5 months statements cos in november am planning on going to see her and would have liked application to go in while i am there (not sure whats best on full 6 months and application go in after i come back home or 5 months while i am there?...also she will be coming here on her own when been accepted...so question 1..better 5 months and be there or full 6 months and not be there?
q2.....i have heard that embassy will look on it as negative if they see large amount go out of bank account during 6 month period...is this true?...like if i pay for my flight of around £700....but if i keep to the £111 per week without that being touched and have additional £700 for flight is that ok?
and finally q3....my wife will be travelling alone hopefully in feb next year so do i book her flight after she been accepted which makes sense cos if she does not get accepted then i have lost flight money!....andy and Terpe....really appreciate the help on behalf of my wife and i:)

[Terpe]

David,
If you can demonstrate that you have more than £111.45 per week to spend on anything you want after you paid for your mortgage/rent/council tax/secured loans etc then you are not going to be refused on insufficient funding. So don't worry about that.
There is no stipulation to actually save £111.45 per week. You are free to spend it on whatever you want when you want. It's just important to demonstrate that it's there to support you both as 'free' funds.

You must though supply all the evidence you can to prove that to the ECO.
That's the reason to supply bank statements, pay slips, accommodation details, mortgage/rent evidence etc.

The UKBA stipulate at least 3 months bank statements. Most people provide a little more, usually up to 6 months, but that's your own choice depending on you personal circumstances. If your cash flow is marginal the more you provide the better.

There are no immigrations rules that state you cannot make specific withdrawals from your own bank account. Just be sure not to submit any bank statements that show overdrawn accounts as that could be a flag to the ECO that you are living beyond your means.


Hope that helps a little.

[davidbulsara]

thank you all for putting my mind at rest:)

[grahamw48]

Yes...don't book the flight until she has the visa.
Even if it costs an extra hundred quid, you won't be worried about that. :D

[davidbulsara]

thank you too:)

[chieldave]

hello again...my husband just wondering about the £111 per week disposable income at least, is this requirement per callendar month cos of some people on monthly wage instead of weekly?:xxgrinning--00xx3:
thanks advance

[grahamw48]

Multiply his average monthly salary by 12 and then divide by 52 ? :Erm:

[andy222]

I think this is easier correct me if I am wrong. 6 x monthly bank statements with £450 surplus and £3000 savings will see you through.