Minimum Income Proposals

[Arthur Little]

There's been a great deal of concern amongst our membership in recent months over government plans to set a certain income level for those hoping to bring non-European partners for settlement in the United Kingdom.

At the moment, the figure being bandied about is, I believe, somewhere around £26,000 per annum.

First of all, I should stress that - as far as I am aware - no final decisions have yet been made as regards the implementation of these draconian measures :nono-1-1:... nor indeed if they will even be approved.

Anyway ... in an effort to quell the fears of those folk most likely to be affected in the event of the green light being given - and, as a former Local Government Employee, earning a Gross Annual Salary of *£10,386 at the time of my early retiral as a Senior Clerical Assistant in 1993 - I took the liberty, this forenoon, of contacting my local Council's Human Resources Department to enquire what *that amount would equate to in present day terms.

Here's what I discovered:

Almost two decades on, £10,386 would be equivalent to £17 -£18k approximately - at best! :doh Quite a shock, really! And a bit of a wasted effort on my part. But, if nothing else, it proves what I'd long suspected ... £26,000 is nowhere near what the Government claims to be "average". On the contrary, it's still considerably ABOVE average.

That's what so damned unfair about such proposals. :cwm23:

[grahamw48]

There seems to be no logic applied to wage rates these days. :NoNo:

A bin man hooking up wheelie bins to the back of a truck is probably getting paid more than the person who pays his wages.:doh

Now when they used to be humping heavy bins on their shoulders from the back of people's houses and physically tipping the things into an open truck....YES they were earning their (much lower then) money. :)

On the other hand there are the thousands of Quango employees on 40 grand a year for pushing bits of paper about and making money on their travel expenses. :rolleyes:

[malchard888]

Yes indeed Arthur, its sounds like if you work in central London u are more likely to meet their suggested salary scale than if you live like u do in central Scotland. Another crazy, unfair and ridiculous idea from this dithering Government :angry:

[Arthur Little]

:gp:s, Graham & Malcolm!!

Binmen, or "scaffies" ... as they were once called - nowadays redesignated 'Refuse Collection Officers' - do a helluva lot less backbreaking work than they used to ... for a much LARGER pay. :crazy:

[sars_notd_virus]

Everything has gone up but not our wages:angry:

[grahamw48]

Surely the only TRUE measure has to be DISPOSABLE income...just as mortgage lenders go by . :Erm:

[lastlid]

Here are the stats........

Mean gross UK annual income, regardless of area. The statistical national average of about 26000 squidly diddlys. Presumably what the government are going by. I sympathise with those that live in areas where local average incomes are below the national average.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/economics/8909797/Average-salary-falls-3pc-in-face-of-high-inflation.html

BTW the average male earns more than this figure and the average female less.....

[Terpe]

Surely the only TRUE measure has to be DISPOSABLE income...just as mortgage lenders go by . :Erm:

Totally agree Graham.
The government has opted for gross income as that is the key determinant for most benefits and, allegedly, one of the drivers of these proposals is to eliminate the benefits factor.

[lastlid]

Surely the only TRUE measure has to be DISPOSABLE income...just as mortgage lenders go by . :Erm:

Its easier to measure / assess gross income than disposable income.................so I guess they take the easier route.......

[lastlid]

Surely the only TRUE measure has to be DISPOSABLE income...just as mortgage lenders go by . :Erm:

I have had 3 mortgages over the course of time and I seem to recall they were all looked at with my gross income in mind. But I took my final mortgage out a good number of years ago, so maybe things have changed.....

[lastlid]

Here's even more stats....showing average figures for different forms of employment....doesn't cover the binmen though......

http://www.payscale.com/research/UK/Country=United_Kingdom/Salary


And interestingly...........by city......

http://www.payscale.com/research/UK/Country=United_Kingdom/Salary#by_City

[grahamw48]

I've been involved in selling finance for many years, and when correctly completed all finance application forms (including mortgages and bank loans) will include a detailed list of OUTGOINGS, thereby arriving at the applicant's DISPOSABLE income.

This is the only way in which a lender can ascertain whether the prospective borrower is able to COMFORTABLY meet the repayments.

It was of course the widespread ignoring of these basic requirements which ultimately led to the collapse of the banking industry, especially in the USA.

Now though at first it may appear more complicated for the govt. to base their income requirements on disposable income, in fact they actually have more detailed (and confidential) information to hand than does the average mortgage lender or bank...especially in the case of those submitting a visa application !

As usual, our silly ex-prep school MPs have little knowledge of commerce and their methods of sorting the wheat from the chaff (when applied correctly :rolleyes:).

[lastlid]

I've been involved in selling finance for many years, and when correctly completed all finance application forms (including mortgages and bank loans) will include a detailed list of OUTGOINGS, thereby arriving at the applicant's DISPOSABLE income.

This is the only way in which a lender can ascertain whether the prospective borrower is able to COMFORTABLY meet the repayments.

It was of course the widespread ignoring of these basic requirements which ultimately led to the collapse of the banking industry, especially in the USA.

Now though at first it may appear more complicated for the govt. to base their income requirements on disposable income, in fact they actually have more detailed (and confidential) information to hand than does the average mortgage lender or bank...especially in the case of those submitting a visa application !

As usual, our silly ex-prep school MPs have little knowledge of commerce and their methods of sorting the wheat from the chaff (when applied correctly :rolleyes:).

I guess you are right Graham. :icon_sorry: Thinking about it they did ask about other outgoings.....the initial focus was on gross income but they must have been looking at outgoings too....



As usual, our silly ex-prep school MPs have little knowledge of commerce and their methods of sorting the wheat from the chaff (when applied correctly ).

I just think they can't be bothered to go that far....

[zaxy]

we shall see in june how things go :)

[Arthur Little]

we shall see in june how things go :)

Well ... :anerikke: ... "June is burstin' out all over" (more than can be said for the :sunshine:!). And, with the advent of 'Summer', the Queen's Diamond Jubilee Celebrations :xxparty-smiley-050: - a truly :cwm24: awe-inspiring feast of :Britain: Pomp & Ceremony - intermingled with marvellous entertainment :REDancedancer08: :wiggle: :333: for those privileged to attend.


Happy days, eh? ;)


But, back to stark reality! :doh Sadly, :bigcry: all good things must come to an end. Notably absent from St Paul's earlier, was the gloomy shadow of one, Theresa May. Could it be she is lurking :xxparty-smiley-004: in the corridors of power ... waiting to pounce with her radical shakeup of the Immigration System?

Tomorrow ... all is due to be revealed. Anyone heard anything definite yet? :rolleyes:

[joebloggs]

i doubt tomoz Arthur but looks like it will be sometime this month ..

[lastlid]

They did say the 6th June....but....

[BoholoX]

I hopw with all the celebrations it's not a good time to bury bad news...

[gWaPito]

To be honest, if this proposed £ 26k minimum is going help reduce the welfare bill then surely it gotta be a good thing.

There are a whole raft of benefits to be claimed as a couple after the ILR is in there palms.

Surely, morally it isn't right to expect others to supplement there income. I know there's a long list of injustices going on right now in our country. By adding to it doesn't make it right.

Im afraid, for a very few, they could possibly become victims of our own generous (for some ) welfare system.

[lastlid]

I dont think it needs to be as high as 26k. Why that high?

[grahamw48]

It is clear discrimination..certainly where Spouse visa is concerned, since the wife/husband is entitled to work from day one anyway, thereby making a contribution to the household income.

The proposals are a complete nonsense. :NoNo:

[gWaPito]

I dont think it needs to be as high as 26k. Why that high?

Being no expert on what you can and cant claim, there is one benefit I know of and thats childs tax credits.....£ 25k and under you can claim...im sure, amongst others

[songz777]

Well i dont earn 26k and I am going to see my Angeline on 9th June, if it all works out I do want to marry her, I think I will go ahead whatever the government propose because she so precious to me ... love is strong & moves all mountians I hope it can move unfair laws to genuine people who can support their sweetheart on a lot less than 26k!

Take care John ( getting nervous about the loooong journey leave by car Friday 12:00 night arrive Cagayan de oro city monday 11:30! )

[lastlid]

Being no expert on what you can and cant claim, there is one benefit I know of and thats childs tax credits.....£ 25k and under you can claim...im sure, amongst others

Okay. I see where you are coming from. But I still think £26k is too high. I can't see why tax credit alone can come between 66% of UK earners and their foreign spouses coming to the UK. Tax credit could be waived for sponsors, for example.

[lastlid]

I would quite like to see the government figures if 26k is based on potential welfare benefits claimable. Fortunately such a ruling wont affect me as I am the right side of that figure. But ...

[gWaPito]

Okay. I see where you are coming from. But I still think £26k is too high. I can't see why tax credit alone can come between 66% of UK earners and their foreign spouses coming to the UK. Tax credit could be waived for sponsors, for example.

So who's gonna pay the short fall? Is it right to expect the already hard pressed tax payers of this land to furnish your chosen lifestyle.

Im not out to make mischief here, im just looking at it from the ordinary guy in the street point of view.

[lastlid]

So who's gonna pay the short fall? Is it right to expect the already hard pressed tax payers of this land to furnish your chosen lifestyle.



Nobody furnishes my lifestyle except me.

[stevewool]

just throw my bit in here, idont expect anything from this goverment, i dont want anything from this goverment,if i want something i go to work to earn it,

[joebloggs]

the figure of £25k+ was mentioned, because at that income you wouldn't qualify for some benefits, what makes this wrong is, that as a British Citizen if your eligible to apply for the benefit then you have a legal right to, apply the same rules to those who are from the EU who are in the UK and after a few months of working here they can claim those benefits but they dont want you a British citizen to, that they will refuse your wife a visa :crazy:. yet some Europeans in the UK can claim child benefit etc for their kids back in their own country :Cuckoo::crazy::angry:

[joebloggs]

So who's gonna pay the short fall? Is it right to expect the already hard pressed tax payers of this land to furnish your chosen lifestyle.

Im not out to make mischief here, im just looking at it from the ordinary guy in the street point of view.

your presuming that these people will claim these benefits, which benefits are you talking about gWaPito ? , i dont know about you, but you can't have much of a lifestyle on what you get from the gov/taxpayer.

[stevewool]

a long time ago when i was married in another life we got tax credits for our son, god knows why but we got so much cant remember how much but it was paid monthly, anyway when we was seperated my son came with me so i got this money, anyway it was april time and you had to fill in the forms to see if there was any change, thats the time when my divorce was going through so i had other things on my mind so i forgot, a few months later i got a letter saying that i owe them money because i did not fill the form in on time, thats when i told them to stick it paid the money to them and thought to myself i will never have any money from the goverment again, funny thing is we did not ask for the money in the first place

[Arthur Little]

To be honest, if this proposed £ 26k minimum is going help reduce the welfare bill then surely it gotta be a good thing.

There are a whole raft of benefits to be claimed as a couple after the ILR is in there palms.

Surely, morally it isn't right to expect others to supplement there income. I know there's a long list of injustices going on right now in our country. By adding to it doesn't make it right.

Im afraid, for a very few, they could possibly become victims of our own generous (for some ) welfare system.

:doh We've had this argument before ... and I'd rather NOT go through it all again :nono-1-1: - BUT, :23_116_6[1]: there are a great many decent, hard working British people who earn nothing like £26K a year. Quite a few on here, in fact! Okay, you might ... but at what cost timewise? How many extra hours per day do you work for that kind of money? :rolleyes: And is it really worth seeing less of your wife and son for the sake of it?

Referring to your 3rd paragraph in #19 ... what's "morally right" about denying an individual the basic human right to bring his/her lawfully wedded partner to live in the country where he/she was born and bred - and paid tax - because he/she simply doesn't earn enough (despite working full time) to sponsor their partner's application? :cwm23:

[stevewool]

am i missing something here lads annd lasses and before i say it i dont mean to offend anyone at all, but surely we want our partners to be here with us so we can be together and work together for a better life, people dont expect to come here and live free at all, when i say free i mean not helping with work and bringing a income into the household, or is it people come here get pregnant and claim, claim,claim, surely no one is thinking that or am i just a fool thinking everyone wants to improve there life through hard work, like i said this is just my thoughts i dont want to offend anyone

[lastlid]

there are a great many decent, hard working British people who earn nothing like £26K a year.

66%

[gWaPito]

Nobody furnishes my lifestyle except me.

I dont doubt that :) I was just pointing out that benefits can be claimed under a certain amount. That certain amount as far as I know is £ 25k. Im sure this is the reason why the goverment want to set this minimum....ie to stop recourse to public funds.

[lastlid]

I dont doubt that :) I was just pointing out that benefits can be claimed under a certain amount. That certain amount as far as I know is £ 25k. Im sure this is the reason why the goverment want to set this minimum....ie to stop recourse to public funds.

But that eliminates 2/3rd of the population.

[gWaPito]

am i missing something here lads annd lasses and before i say it i dont mean to offend anyone at all, but surely we want our partners to be here with us so we can be together and work together for a better life, people dont expect to come here and live free at all, when i say free i mean not helping with work and bringing a income into the household, or is it people come here get pregnant and claim, claim,claim, surely no one is thinking that or am i just a fool thinking everyone wants to improve there life through hard work, like i said this is just my thoughts i dont want to offend anyone
No, you are missing nothing Steve.....what im pointing out is, benefits can be claimed after getting the ilr...apparently a whole raft of them and that fact was pointed out by a moderator a while back....thats if you earn under a certain amount.

[lastlid]

If one is earning £25500 per annum, how much tax is paid and how much tax credit is recouped?

[gWaPito]

But that eliminates 2/3rd of the population.

It probably does....that's the downside, as ive already said, having a generous welfare system

[joebloggs]

it should be your legal right to bring your partner to the UK, what you earn, what you can or can't claim should have nothing to do with it :NoNo:

[gWaPito]

:doh We've had this argument before ... and I'd rather NOT go through it all again :nono-1-1: - BUT, :23_116_6[1]: there are a great many decent, hard working British people who earn nothing like £26K a year. Okay, you might ... but at what cost timewise? How many extra hours per day do you work for that kind of money? :rolleyes: And is it really worth seeing less of your wife and son for the sake of it?

Referring to your 3rd paragraph in #19 ... what's "morally right" about denying an individual the basic human right to bring his/her lawfully wedded partner to live in the country where he/she was born and bred ... simply because he/she simply doesn't earn enough (despite working full time) to sponsor the partner's application? :cwm23::yikes:

Btw Its actually sons now ..you shouldn't assume what im doing or earning Arthur. Nothing wrong in your last sentence....what is wrong is what ive already pointed out..ie not at the expense of the other tax payers..claiming benefits because of your partner...not too dissimilar to going to the pub with a bunch of mates then expecting them to keep you in fags and drink all night...not the done thing.

[stevewool]

its a funny old world, there will always be people who claim for every single thing, even in my family there is a few who claim and there children do the same, some have never worked for 40+ years and still they claim. its beyond me:NoNo::NoNo::NoNo::NoNo:

[joebloggs]

It probably does....that's the downside, as ive already said, having a generous welfare system

why not join them gWaPito then ? not so generous when your on it , imagine what you could spend your £71 a week on :rolleyes:

[stevewool]

why not join them gWaPito then ? not so generous when your on it , imagine what you could spend your £71 a week on :rolleyes:

its only generous if you have no mortgage or bills to pay, and you have lots of kids and you have no intention of working at all, the trouble is we all have bills and a mortgage, thats why we all have to work very hard

[gWaPito]

why not join them gWaPito then ? not so generous when your on it , imagine what you could spend your £71 a week on :rolleyes:

Umm probably a daytime meal at cosmo followed by evening meal at one of our few good Chinese eating houses :xxgrinning--00xx3:

[joebloggs]

some interesting reading, and the problems the gov will face if they try this.
http://www.jcwi.org.uk/sites/default/files/documets/UBLDBL_0.pdf

[lastlid]

some interesting reading, and the problems the gov will face if they try this.
http://www.jcwi.org.uk/sites/default/files/documets/UBLDBL_0.pdf

"In relation to the increase in the maintenance threshold, the foregoing case studies provide faces
to the nameless 67% MAC refers to in its report.

They show how pregnancy, low or average pay,
accidents, disability, recent entry to the labour market as a graduate, circumstances of victims of
human rights abuses and low currency exchange rates all potentially result in applicants failing the
proposed maintenance requirements.
The case studies also highlight how problematic the proposed implementation of these measures is.
Through exclusion of consideration of third party support, future employment prospects of couples,
savings and employment of the immigrant spouse, even more hurdles are placed in the way of
applicants. Why on any logical count should these be excluded from consideration when calculating
whether maintenance levels are met?
As for the attachment requirement, the two case studies demonstrate the difficulties that those fleeing
from human rights abuses are likely to encounter, and how those settled in the UK for over a decade
may well in future be prevented from reuniting with their spouses / partners.
Helen’s and Adenike’s stories of violence and abuse should remind MPs how probationary periods
disempower their victims, and double lock them into cycles of violence and mental abuse.
All of these case studies should also raise a question as to how far manifesto commitments to
promote and protect family life would in practice be realized in the event of the implementation of
such proposals. They should also lead to a question about the extent to which such proposals fall
below international consensus (as reflected by international and regional human rights instruments)
on basic minimum standards that should be accorded to couples and families."

[grahamw48]

Screw the ones escaping from 'human rights abuses' and other such unproven crap.

They can stay in France. :rolleyes:

Why the hell are our relationships being lumped in with these parasites ? :angry:

[London_Manila]

Surely the logic is simple = its all about keeping people out :doh

I am not implying that this figure is right but what ever figure they decide on then some people will fall below it

The present government love to been seen as taking a hard line on immigration and with everyone "up in arms" with the sheer number of european people coming here then i am sure they see this as a vote winner

Lots of people living here want the gates shut for good and they dont care who that effects

[grahamw48]

Yes, I think we all have brains enough to realise what lies behind it.

What is being discussed is the obvious unfairness of what is proposed in relation to BRITISH Citizens wishing to bring their partners from the Philippines.

[lastlid]

Surely the logic is simple = its all about keeping people out :doh



You are probably right. But the method of keeping people out lacks any modicum of discernment.

[benjy]

Screw the ones escaping from 'human rights abuses' and other such unproven crap.

They can stay in France. :rolleyes:

Why the hell are our relationships being lumped in with these parasites ? :angry:

Too right! I don't know many people in my area that earn over 26k...... f*cking hard times at the minute last thing we need is for it to be harder and let it screw with our relationships:cwm23:

[gWaPito]

I must be typing in double dutch :NoNo:

Oh, thank you for the reputation, whoever sent it :) Im presuming (a leaf out of Arthur's book :)) someone at least, is getting my drift.

[grahamw48]

Probably a lot of people are getting your drift...just that they don't agree with you....and you sure aint going to beat them into submission. :D

[gWaPito]

Probably a lot of people are getting your drift...just that they don't agree with you....and you sure aint going to beat them into submission. :D
:D I guess your right Graham. :xxgrinning--00xx3:

[sars_notd_virus]

Minimum Income Proposals??

...there shouldnt be any minimum income proposal or criteria ....the visa should be given FREE as in the rest of Europe spouses/fiances.....my proposal is that why not put criteria on people already here, ..they shouldnt have kids if they dont have a job!! that will be more constructive... it should save ''us'' tax payers a few million pounds!!:rolleyes::xxgrinning--00xx3:

[grahamw48]

Absolutely right. :xxgrinning--00xx3:

THEY have more votes though...and are prone to rioting when order and reason invade their ignorant, irresponsible and tawdry little world. :NoNo:

[sars_notd_virus]

Surely the logic is simple = its all about keeping people out :doh

I am not implying that this figure is right but what ever figure they decide on then some people will fall below it

The present government love to been seen as taking a hard line on immigration and with everyone "up in arms" with the sheer number of european people coming here then i am sure they see this as a vote winner



...it doesnt matter as what price they put on..just sounds good to the ignorants coz they think it includes EU which it didnt:rolleyes::crazy:...a real vote winner for the ignorants eh

[Arthur Little]

Minimum Income Proposals??

...there shouldnt be any minimum income proposal or criteria ....

... too damned right, there shouldn't! :NoNo:


the visa should be given FREE as in the rest of Europe spouses/fiances.....

... :yeahthat:'s long been a bone of contention with me; there OUGHT to be a system of equality, whereby Settlement Visas (following - or for the express purpose of - marriage/civil partnership) are either FREE to ALL applicants - or chargeable at an equivalent rate to EEA nationals!!


my proposal is that why not put criteria on people already here, ..they shouldnt have kids if they dont have a job!! that will be more constructive... it should save ''us'' tax payers a few million pounds!!:rolleyes::xxgrinning--00xx3:

:iagree: ... :gp:!

[imagine]

why dont they just pay all the hard workers a decent pay , then there'd be no problem about rescourse to public funds :Erm:

[Arthur Little]

:yikes:

Btw Its actually sons now ..

... oops ... my mistake - you HAVE been a busy man! :)


you shouldn't assume what im doing or earning Arthur.

I'm NOT "assuming" anything ... merely going by what you yourself happened to mention when this matter was previously discussed. ;)

[gWaPito]

... oops ... my mistake - you HAVE been a busy man! :)



I'm NOT "assuming" anything ... merely going by what you yourself happened to mention when this matter was previously discussed. ;)

Oki doki Arthur...:D:xxgrinning--00xx3:...its good night from him:xxgrinning--00xx3:

[joebloggs]

i'll assume gWaPito your not claiming child benefit for your little ones, after all your thinking about the hard pressed taxpayer :rolleyes:, now if you are then your using your legal right to claim it (for now anyway - til next year :rolleyes:) just like everyone else

your spouse doesn't have a right to 'recourse to public funds' until she has at least ILR, so what difference will this minimum income make then ? .. if you've a problem with the British partner claiming any sort of benefit then if they are eligible then its their legal right to, no matter who they are wed to, just as a EU citizen can claim.

you remember Tony on here ? how he struggled to get his wife here, i wonder if he's claiming benefits now from the hard pressed taxpayer ? did you wish him luck gWaPito :rolleyes:

i dont give a :censored: if any British Citizen claims what ever, they should have a legal right to bring their partner here, the problem with me is those from the EU have more rights than British people, now thats what the hard pressed taxpayer should have a problem with...

and Osborne said "that those with the "broadest shoulders should bear the greatest burden" rightly so :rolleyes:

[andy222]

Well said Joe.:xxgrinning--00xx3:

[lastlid]

Well. The hour hath passed and nothing has happened. :Erm:

[lastlid]

To be honest, if this proposed £ 26k minimum is going help reduce the welfare bill then surely it gotta be a good thing.

There are a whole raft of benefits to be claimed as a couple after the ILR is in there palms.

Surely, morally it isn't right to expect others to supplement there income. I know there's a long list of injustices going on right now in our country. By adding to it doesn't make it right.

Im afraid, for a very few, they could possibly become victims of our own generous (for some ) welfare system.



Being no expert on what you can and cant claim, there is one benefit I know of and thats childs tax credits.....£ 25k and under you can claim...im sure, amongst others


I still fail to see how someone who is married to any spouse and is earning 25 grand a year, for example, being classed as a burden on the state. Especially if they have worked all their life. And as for Child Tax Credit - isnt that tax relief and not a benefit? Why should someone who earns 20 to 25 grand a year be penalised by being not allowed to bring their spouse into the country on financial grounds. I say again, need it be as high as 26 grand.....

[stevewool]

i am one of the lucky ones here, i do earn well but its down to hard work, my emma is here also and our future plans are all going well, i feel for all our friends on here and who ever else is trying to bring there partners here, good luck i say and never give up,all this talk about a burden to our state and resources, i dont think anyone who is trying to bring there partners even think about getting benifits from the government,some one should explain the cost of bringing our partners here to help this economy with themselves working and paying tax should in the long term help everyone

[lastlid]

And another thing............from a slightly tongue in cheek stance, if we take the threshold rate at which people are eligible for tax credit as the determining criteria, (I seem to recall that there were moves to raise that threshold, were there not? ) why not hoof the threshold for tax credit up to 40000 a year and then refuse settlement visa applications to anyone under 40000 year from bringing their spouse into the country. :Erm: :NoNo:

[andy222]

Ok I have been on this site for a while now and listened to a lot of the comments. Obviously a lot on here earn a good salary i.e over £26000 per year. My point is I have worked all my life. Im a qualified mechanical engineer. Because of all the engineering work going abroad I had to change my career. Instead of siting on my butt and claiming unemployment benefit I went into the healthcare profession as most of you know I work for the NHS. I think I do a good job. The downside is I dont earn the money now that I did in engineering so I am being penalised for working and not earning the required amaount. Is that my fault?

[joebloggs]

Andy222 not only that i'm sure your wife will want to work and not be a burden to the hardworking taxpayer and like most filipino's will not want or need 'recourse to public funds', and after all if they are a taxpayer they have a right as much as anyone else to claim what ever benefits their entitled to.

[grahamw48]

I am willing to bet the wages of several hundred thousand residents of South London, Bradford and Leicester that this will not go through. :)

[andy222]

Yes joe she will work here if she is allowed. I still feel there will be a way round it so we will wait and see.

[Notavirusalso]

There needs to be controls but it should be fair, I married a Fillipina and we have paid all our fees etc. so I would expect anyone coming here from outside our country to do the same, But this is not the case as we are part of the EU. It looks good on the front of the red tops Govt. fight immigration but to those of us in the know know that this is targeted towards people from outside the EU and thats the bit they forget to mention, I guess telling half truths isn't lying ?
Either way this threshold is somewhat irrelevent as one could be earning 20000 a year and have a house thats paid for and low bills with more disposable income than someone earning 60000 a year with a big mortgage and less disposable income, So once again the Govt. are flapping their lips with out engaging brain or even more likely don't really care as it is some one getting paid to come up with these ridiculous ideas having never been or know anyone in that situation.
Bunch of big footed red nosed clowns should all be working for Billy Smart

[grahamw48]

Totally agree...and DISPOSABLE income, as I've previously mentioned. :)

[joebloggs]

Totally agree...and DISPOSABLE income, as I've previously mentioned. :)

but thats what some immigration judges use as a guide already :rolleyes:

but your right there will be lots of problems for the gov if they do introduce a minimum income.

[joebloggs]

Theresa May will be making an announcement tomorrow on the new rules on forced marriage.

It doesn't mention whether the announcement will cover the other issues in the consultation.

[lastlid]

Ok I have been on this site for a while now and listened to a lot of the comments. Obviously a lot on here earn a good salary i.e over £26000 per year. My point is I have worked all my life. Im a qualified mechanical engineer. Because of all the engineering work going abroad I had to change my career. Instead of siting on my butt and claiming unemployment benefit I went into the healthcare profession as most of you know I work for the NHS. I think I do a good job. The downside is I dont earn the money now that I did in engineering so I am being penalised for working and not earning the required amaount. Is that my fault?

Thats a fair point Andy. In other words, you probably at a time in the past, paid both taxes and maybe National Insurance at a much higher rate than you do now. Fair point that.

[gWaPito]

i'll assume gWaPito your not claiming child benefit for your little ones, after all your thinking about the hard pressed taxpayer :rolleyes:, now if you are then your using your legal right to claim it (for now anyway - til next year :rolleyes:) just like everyone else

your spouse doesn't have a right to 'recourse to public funds' until she has at least ILR, so what difference will this minimum income make then ? .. if you've a problem with the British partner claiming any sort of benefit then if they are eligible then its their legal right to, no matter who they are wed to, just as a EU citizen can claim.

you remember Tony on here ? how he struggled to get his wife here, i wonder if he's claiming benefits now from the hard pressed taxpayer ? did you wish him luck gWaPito :rolleyes:

i dont give a :censored: if any British Citizen claims what ever, they should have a legal right to bring their partner here, the problem with me is those from the EU have more rights than British people, now thats what the hard pressed taxpayer should have a problem with...

and Osborne said "that those with the "broadest shoulders should bear the greatest burden" rightly so :rolleyes:

Thank you Joe. Believe you me, I do have a problem with these new Europeans coming in our country and generally extracting the urine.

We got many at my place of work who's wife's never set foot here not to mention the kids they are claiming for....disgraceful

Actually, I did congratulate and wish, both Simon and Tony good luck....im genuinely happy for both them.

It was a much earlier post on this thread by a moderator who mentioned why this proposed 26k minimum is being mooted...ie because of benefits beginning to kick in around that figure.....me, being me, latched on to it.

Honestly Joe, you should care who claims what and what for...its our money.

[lastlid]

There needs to be controls but it should be fair, I married a Fillipina and we have paid all our fees etc. so I would expect anyone coming here from outside our country to do the same, But this is not the case as we are part of the EU. It looks good on the front of the red tops Govt. fight immigration but to those of us in the know know that this is targeted towards people from outside the EU and thats the bit they forget to mention, I guess telling half truths isn't lying ?
Either way this threshold is somewhat irrelevent as one could be earning 20000 a year and have a house thats paid for and low bills with more disposable income than someone earning 60000 a year with a big mortgage and less disposable income, So once again the Govt. are flapping their lips with out engaging brain or even more likely don't really care as it is some one getting paid to come up with these ridiculous ideas having never been or know anyone in that situation.
Bunch of big footed red nosed clowns should all be working for Billy Smart

I agree. Any threshold, if there is to be one, needs to be fair across society, north to south and east to west and well thought out.

[grahamw48]

Sadly, unlike our MPs and senior civil servants who draft these regulations, we are unable to augment our salaries by making fraudulent claims for expenses to be paid out of the public purse and 'employing' relatives. :angry:

[gWaPito]

i am one of the lucky ones here, i do earn well but its down to hard work, my emma is here also and our future plans are all going well, i feel for all our friends on here and who ever else is trying to bring there partners here, good luck i say and never give up,all this talk about a burden to our state and resources, i dont think anyone who is trying to bring there partners even think about getting benifits from the government,some one should explain the cost of bringing our partners here to help this economy with themselves working and paying tax should in the long term help everyone
I totally agree...apart from saying you are lucky...nothing lucky about hard work..its what you've chosen to do. Me and you, both :)

[gWaPito]

Andy222 not only that i'm sure your wife will want to work and not be a burden to the hardworking taxpayer and like most filipino's will not want or need 'recourse to public funds', and after all if they are a taxpayer they have a right as much as anyone else to claim what ever benefits their entitled to.
Nice one....I agree wholeheartedly :D
Btw Nice to read a wised up post. :xxgrinning--00xx3:

[gWaPito]

I still fail to see how someone who is married to any spouse and is earning 25 grand a year, for example, being classed as a burden on the state. Especially if they have worked all their life. And as for Child Tax Credit - isnt that tax relief and not a benefit? Why should someone who earns 20 to 25 grand a year be penalised by being not allowed to bring their spouse into the country on financial grounds. I say again, need it be as high as 26 grand.....
Child benefit is a benefit....child tax credit is exactly that, a hand out.

[lastlid]

Child benefit is a benefit....child tax credit is exactly that, a hand out.

So tax relief is a handout? :D

I always thought Tax Credit was like tax relief. And if you don't earn you don't get it. Not really a "handout" in the more usual sense of the word.

When my ex wife got about 15 or thereabouts quid a month in tax credit a good few years back I always saw it as tax paid by me (us) that was given back to us by the revenue boys. Not a handout. More akin to tax relief than anything, which in my book isn't a handout either.

So I still say, why 26000 grand a year? Why that high? I can't see any justification for it that is either fair or appropriate.

[Notavirusalso]

Child benefit is a benefit....child tax credit is exactly that, a hand out.

Huh so the money i earn and then pay in tax (which we dont claim anyway cuz we are "high earners" lol) they decide that i can pay a "litle" less tax cuz we have a child is a hand out ? NO.....If i dont work or earn money or pay tax and then get given money,,, then thats a hand out

[DeltaRomeo]

A very interesting thread.. personally I would go along with the no earning threshold but with some kind of signed contract that No public funding would be claimed. In reality of course this couldn't work.. none of us knows what is around the corner and how circumstances may change. But there again.. If an earning threshold is upheld.. who knows how secure that earning capability is?

[lastlid]

A very interesting thread.. personally I would go along with the no earning threshold but with some kind of signed contract that No public funding would be claimed. In reality of course this couldn't work.. none of us knows what is around the corner and how circumstances may change. But there again.. If an earning threshold is upheld.. who knows how secure that earning capability is?

Thats a fair point too. :xxgrinning--00xx3: Exactly.

[gWaPito]

So tax relief is a handout? :D

I always thought Tax Credit was like tax relief. And if you don't earn you don't get it. Not really a "handout" in the more usual sense of the word.

When my ex wife got about 15 or thereabouts quid a month in tax credit a good few years back I always saw it as tax paid by me (us) that was given back to us by the revenue boys. Not a handout. More akin to tax relief than anything, which in my book isn't a handout either.

So I still say, why 26000 grand a year? Why that high? I can't see any justification for it that is either fair or appropriate.
I dig what you saying lastlid :) but, the powers that be deem child/family tax credits as public purse.
This is why those of you on a joint annual of less than 25k cant claim it until your partner has ilr.

[lastlid]

Public purse yes. Handout no.

And even if it is classed as a benefit I still cant see why it should come between someone and their foreign spouse / fiancee settling in the UK. Someone just under that threshold would get very little back in tax credit, but would be excluded from bringing their wife to the UK using the 26G criteria.

Child benefit is a benefit given out to both earners and non earners. Tax credit is tax paid back to the earner and tax payer. A refund or allowance or credit.

[Arthur Little]

This is why those of you on a joint annual of less than 25k cant claim it until your partner has ilr.

:crazy: ... they're the very ones who need it MOST!!

[gWaPito]

:crazy: ... they're the very ones who need it MOST!!

I agree, Arthur :xxgrinning--00xx3:

[gWaPito]

A very interesting thread.. personally I would go along with the no earning threshold but with some kind of signed contract that No public funding would be claimed. In reality of course this couldn't work.. none of us knows what is around the corner and how circumstances may change. But there again.. If an earning threshold is upheld.. who knows how secure that earning capability is?
And would also agree with that.....nobody indeed knows whats around the corner...its a comforting thought there's always the generous welfare system to fall back on. Joke!

[joebloggs]

you've a right to claim what ever benefits your entitled to, and where your wife is from shouldn't matter at all (is that not discrimination ? )
gWapito i'm against people abusing the system, infact i think if you've not paid in, you can't take out of the system.

the gov if it does go ahead will open a big can of worms, it will face many court cases, and judicial reviews, it will either U turn or it will be forced into changing the figure to a lower figure. The gov has a :censored: record at winning immigration cases, it was forced into lower the age back to 18 from 21, it was forced into cancelling the COA (cert of approval) if you wanted to get married, but this is a bigger ball game than them and bigger than the pasty tax :rolleyes:

[lastlid]

...... and bigger than the pasty tax :rolleyes: :D

Big news in Cornwall.....

[joebloggs]

:D

Big news in Cornwall.....

Mark Samworth, who heads Samworth Brothers which owns the Ginsters brand, gave £100,000 to the Tories, between the announcement of the VAT change in the budget and the government’s volte face on Monday.
http://politicalscrapbook.net/2012/05/ginsters-pasty-tax-tory-donations/


:angry:

maybe everyone on here and other forums similar could have a whip round and make a donation the gov will change their mind to about the minimum income :rolleyes:

[lastlid]

Mark Samworth, who heads Samworth Brothers which owns the Ginsters brand, gave £100,000 to the Tories, between the announcement of the VAT change in the budget and the government’s volte face on Monday.
http://politicalscrapbook.net/2012/05/ginsters-pasty-tax-tory-donations/



:angry:

maybe everyone on here and other forums similar could have a whip round and make a donation the gov will change their mind to about the minimum income :rolleyes:


Yes. I saw Dedworth's posting on that. I just find the pasty thing quite funny.

http://filipinaroses.com/showthread.php/38697-Pasty-La-Vista?highlight=Pasty+La+Vista

[gWaPito]

you've a right to claim what ever benefits your entitled to, and where your wife is from shouldn't matter at all (is that not discrimination ? )
gWapito i'm against people abusing the system, infact i think if you've not paid in, you can't take out of the system.

the gov if it does go ahead will open a big can of worms, it will face many court cases, and judicial reviews, it will either U turn or it will be forced into changing the figure to a lower figure. The gov has a :censored: record at winning immigration cases, it was forced into lower the age back to 18 from 21, it was forced into cancelling the COA (cert of approval) if you wanted to get married, but this is a bigger ball game than them and bigger than the pasty tax :rolleyes:
You are right, of course :rolleyes: although it pains me to say it.

I think lastlid copied and pasted something earlier yesterday and it makes sense....well, it does to me.....the consensus being, implementing this proposal, wont work.

Again there are far too many other injustices going on for it to work...like you said 'discrimination' .

Others on here have said it would/ could be a vote winner..quite possibly....like its been said before...the genuine law abiding immigrant getting tarred with all those EuroTrash.

The stories in the papers dont help there cause.

[joebloggs]

Yes. I saw Dedworth's posting on that. I just find the pasty thing quite funny.

at least you knew where you was with this guy :rolleyes:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u_XgFHRs96E

[lastlid]

at least you knew where you was with this guy :rolleyes:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u_XgFHRs96E

Alan B,Stard. A blast from the past. I used to like this guys comedy. Dont see so much of him these days. Him and Aid Edmondson. :xxgrinning--00xx3:

[joebloggs]

at least he had a backbone unlike most PM's and MP's these days :NoNo:

ade still about (going around England's countryside) , not seen much of Rik thou :cwm24:, they met at University of Manchester :xxgrinning--00xx3:

[joebloggs]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tetk_ayO1x4

it looked like someone else said YES,YES, YES :doh