More expensive than London

[Terpe]

That the Philippines is still a Third World country cannot be denied. About half the population is still classified as poor. They do not earn enough to live decently, with “decent” being defined as always having enough to eat and clothes to wear, as well as having a roof over their heads that protects them from the elements at all times. It also means earning enough to send the kids to school with everything they need—bags, books, shoes, uniforms and pocket money.

At the heart of the Philippines is the National Capital Region, which is considered the political, economic and social center of the country. Most foreigners therefore equate Manila with the Philippines. Not necessarily the City of Manila, but more of the 13 cities that comprise Metro Manila.

As part of the developing world, we are sometimes shocked to learn that the cost of living in Metro Manila is higher than the capitals of many developed countries.

PH was paradise
Not too long ago, expats considered the Philippines a veritable paradise. Our country was a favored destination for executives working for multinational corporations because the cost of living was so low. What they earned went a long, long way. They could live in mansions in the exclusive villages of Makati, with maids and drivers to boot.

That was then, but today the situation is different. Not only has the cost of living gone up in the metropolis, it has matched and even exceeded many capitals.

The cost of labor has also gone up, and continues to rise with each passing year. A couple of weeks ago, there was yet another increase in the daily minimum wage of our workers.

This is not to say that our workers do not deserve higher pay. For the most part, they do. But losing the competitive edge that came with lower labor costs has translated to jobs lost. The global manufacturing sector, for one, is no longer as eager to set up shop in the Philippines because they can find qualified workers willing to receive less in such countries as Vietnam and China.

Without the investments, providing jobs for all has become even harder. It is a huge challenge for any administration to invite investors to come to the Philippines, when they have to pay more to Filipino workers. Their expats also have to settle for less in terms of benefits than their counterparts in other countries. All because the cost of living and the cost of labor in the country have risen to such an extent that the only edge we have left is the fact that English is still widely spoken here.

Beyond reach to most
Consider, too, that the “perks” of living in Metro Manila are fading. Dining out has become an expensive proposition nowadays. Where previously middle class families could afford to dine out in the best restaurants and spend vacations in the best resorts, now they have to settle for much less.

Add to this the fact that traffic in the NCR remains a nightmare, and that every rainy season guarantees that large parts of Metro Manila can get flooded with every downpour, and we realize that we are a Third World country where First World rates are the norm.

If blame has to be determined, it can be said that both the government and the private sector are to blame. The government did not act decisively enough to make sure that the country’s competitive edge was maintained. The private sector raised the cost of owning property, products and services to unrealistic heights.

What then can be done to correct the imbalance?

For one, the national government can come up with a strategic plan to recover the advantages the Philippines used to have over other countries. In doing so, foreign investors will be forced to take a second look.

For its part, the private sector can likewise get together and prepare a long term plan of development, wherein the working class can attain their dreams of a better life.

Filipino Dream
The US has what they call the American Dream, where any person or family can become wealthy through sheer hard work and determination. Why not have our own Filipino Dream? This dream should be one that is attainable to any Filipino man or woman who is willing to work hard. Luck or connections should not play a role in attaining that dream.

A decent standard of living should be attainable in Metro Manila for the ordinary worker. No one should ever have to look at what others own and have with envy. No one should ever have to accept the fact that he or she can never attain an impossible standard of living.

Other countries which were once poorer than the Philippines have been able to move forward as one. They created a powerful middle class which is the bedrock of economic stability for all countries. If they could do it, is there any reason why we can’t?

Source:-
http://www.manilatimes.net/index.php/opinion/editorials/25072-more-expensive-than-london

[somebody]

From a takeover the very large Japanese company I work for took over some offices and factories in Cebu and while keeping them for now have no intention to expand and even with the problems Thailand had last year and the natural hatred Japanese and Chinese have for one another still prefer to have their outsourced factories and resources in Asian countries in these two countries rather than Phill.

Phill has a bad rep with many Asian countries it seems while some still use it I am always surprised how as individuals phills welcome visitors so well but as a country are so bad as a rule they are at tourism and hosting business. Yes i know they have both a tourist industry and business infrastructure but when you look at the potential and what they have you do wonder how the English speaking, very outward looking (compared to many asian countries), highly educated workforce does so badly.

I really don't think its just down to wages as Phill has so many other advantages when looking at tenders proposal for Factories With stability, Telecom links, from what i know the wages would not affect the costs that much (Many of the staff in the Workplaces of our company in other Asian regions whether white collar or blue collar are Pinoys!!!) its as if the country some how with out realising puts up a v sign some how to the outside world!!

[grahamw48]

They could make a start on the CORRUPTION....a word that was noticeable by its absence in the article.

Their leaders continue to set a great example. :rolleyes:

The comparison between living costs in Manila and London is ridiculous without taking into account what you get for your money. :NoNo:

[somebody]

They could make a start on the CORRUPTION....a word that was noticeable by its absence in the article.

Their leaders continue to set a great example. :rolleyes:

The comparison between living costs in Manila and London is ridiculous without taking into account what you get for your money. :NoNo:

yep as i have quoted on this website previously very very high up and powerful people at my company belive the corruption to be worse than many other Asian countries hardly a badge of honour:rolleyes:

But it does also apart from corruption seem to be a weird attitude to those who are not pinoy a bit like when you go to the Barrio Fiesta or a Pinoy run business in the Uk and your welcome as a non Pinoy but the person serving you even though they have lived in the UK for a long time speaks decent English prefers to speak to a Phill so things can be done the phill way. Even to the point where its made evident your the one who wants to spend money etc...

The airport at MNL for international flights is a joke and look at the chaotic build for the domestic terminal :rolleyes: Why go though that hassle when you can go to Bangkok and use a decent quality airport? How come Thailand and Indonesia are both more tourist friendly than the Philippines when English is not a first language, they don't share a common religion with much of the west (in much of Indonesia) talk about shooting your self in the foot:doh

[CBM]

If you want to run a business in the Philippines you need to spend about a quarter of your management time on local regulatory issues.

A friend who has spent twenty years in the Philippines building up a sucessful business which is respected locally is seriously thinking of relocating his IT business to Cambodia, although English is not so widely spoken there, because the legal climate is so much more friendly to foreign investment there.

Part of the problem in the Philippines is simply that there are far too many laws; a legacy from the Spanish era.

Another friend sent five months obtaining permission to put a fence round the steps to his office to stop tramps sleeping there; he had to obtain 23 separate approvals.

Then we have the whole area of the anti-dummy law, the laws limiting foreign ownership, the awful complication of the Customs, and so on.

Most companies look at the Philippines and say to themselves, "Is it worth it?"

[Clara]

:xxgrinning--00xx3:

[Clara]

Thank you for the helpful information about Metro Manila.

[Peter D]

The comparison between living costs in Manila and London is ridiculous without taking into account what you get for your money. :

I agree we really need to compare exactly what you get for your money , for instance whats the price now of a Mc Donalds meal( big mac/fries/drink) in Manila , last time I was there it was about 80 Peso but I suppose it gone up a lot ? Recently found dentists charge approx 85% less in Manila than UK . Checked a few hotels and these seem to be still reasonable . Taxi from the airport to Manila could be had for 60 peso by using the escalator and going out through the departures entrance and jumping in a taxi thats just made a drop but security were trying to prevent people doing this so I suppose now its no longer possible ?

[grahamw48]

Yes, you can still hop a taxi at Arrivals...as I have always done, and did so again earlier this year. :)

As a tourist, prices in Manila are a fraction of those in London, whether it be hotels, food and drink, entertainment or transport.

Yes, you can probably buy expensive property in Manila, but the build-quality will come nowhere near the standards laid down anywhere in the UK.

You can buy similar new cars there, but you have to drive them on roads that would be closed for safety reasons in this country, or buy a secondhand car in Manila that will actually cost you more than its equivalent in the UK and will probably be in an unroadworthy state by our standards.

Then you can try buying car insurance with equivalent cover to what would be offered as a minimum legal requirement in the UK.
Good luck with that. :NoNo:

Personally I'm happy to accept the somewhat 'sketchy' standards and prices in the Phils in exchange for the sheer adventure and fun to be had there. :)

The biggest bores you'll ever meet there are the moaning and whinging expats who do nothing but point out the negatives.
Why do they stay ? :rolleyes:

[tone]

Really interesting thread!
We've been looking at property prices around Manila and I couldnt believe the prices of some of the houses!
I've been reviewing pensions etc and definately want to retire abroad, and with the option of tax free pensions in the Phills my paltry pots may actually provide me with some standards.

But I'd like to be within reach of Makati - looking at the cost of properties it may be more difficult than I thought.

Just out of interest does anyone know of any property price indexes for Manila?

Tone

[London_Manila]

I agree we really need to compare exactly what you get for your money , for instance whats the price now of a Mc Donalds meal( big mac/fries/drink) in Manila , last time I was there it was about 80 Peso but I suppose it gone up a lot ? Recently found dentists charge approx 85% less in Manila than UK . Checked a few hotels and these seem to be still reasonable . Taxi from the airport to Manila could be had for 60 peso by using the escalator and going out through the departures entrance and jumping in a taxi thats just made a drop but security were trying to prevent people doing this so I suppose now its no longer possible ?

Hotels in Manila are expensive for what you actually get, in Thailand the hotels are around 50% cheaper

The yellow meter taxis can still get you to Makati for a low price

I would not advise trying for a cheaper taxi just outside the airport, yes you might save 200 pesos but then that taxi might take you to a pre arranged (by phone on the move) hold up = it does happen
They know you will have plenty of money you have just arrived there

A big mac meal is now around 120 pesos

Buying property in Manila is not so easy and plenty of sharks around looking to rip you off
Renting is is easy and much less hassle and you can move on at any time

[fred]

Then we have the whole area of the anti-dummy law, the laws limiting foreign ownership

foreign ownership?:Erm:
Doesnt exist here.
Thats why they have anti dummy laws.

[grahamw48]

I would not advise trying for a cheaper taxi just outside the airport, yes you might save 200 pesos but then that taxi might take you to a pre arranged (by phone on the move) hold up = it does happen
They know you will have plenty of money you have just arrived there

I take it you've experienced such an occurrence ?

Got some evidence/reports of this happening to a Brit ?

I have never witnessed a taxi driver even using a mobile phone while in the car with him in 22years.

Caution and common sense yes, scaremongering...no. :NoNo:

[lastlid]

I suppose that in truth, one can live in the Philippines for a good number of years and have differing experiences. My wife lived in the Philippines all her life till she left last year and she appears to be highly cautious in her outlook towards personal safety when in public. Having heard her out I have no doubt the caution is well founded. Her mother for example sewed up her hand luggage external compartment zipper before she flew to the UK just in case anyone attempted to plant any drugs in her bag. Was that overkill or just being sensible?

It was only last year that her sister had her gold chain ripped off her kneck while standing waiting for a Jeepney, while holding her son in her arms.

I could go on.....and now that she is here she and friends marvel at how different it is here, by contrast.

[grahamw48]

Oh I absolutely agree about being vigilant about personal safety in the Phils.

I remember my ex having a gold necklace being grabbed from her neck in a Jeepney one time...all part and parcel of living and moving amongst many poor and desperate people.

Securing your luggage properly is another good habit to get into (wherever you are travelling).

I think this comes under common sense though. :)

[andy222]

I can honestly say hand on heart if I won a couple of hundred grand on the lottery I would be there.:xxgrinning--00xx3:

[stevewool]

I can honestly say hand on heart if I won a couple of hundred grand on the lottery I would be there.:xxgrinning--00xx3:

less then that and i will be ahead of you,

[andy222]

I hope you get your dream steve and I will be checking my numbers tonight.:xxgrinning--00xx3:

[London_Manila]

I take it you've experienced such an occurrence ?

Got some evidence/reports of this happening to a Brit ?

I have never witnessed a taxi driver even using a mobile phone while in the car with him in 22years.

Caution and common sense yes, scaremongering...no. :NoNo:

no its never happened to me because i always use the airport taxis = still well cheap

I have read about it in the Manila times nearly every time i go there and also my gf there said it happens a lot, especially with taxis around the airport

I think that maybe you dont use the taxis much in manila because its hard to get most of them off the phone and pay more attention to their driving, i had one driver even txting as we were going along, really these drivers are on the phone nearly always
:NoNo:

in general the taxis are quite safe there (i use them every day) but in certain areas it requires more caution

anyway what are you going to save by doing this a few hundread pesos at best :Erm:

[grahamw48]

I use taxis all the time in Manila...but at the right price, buses and Jeepneys too.

Yes, I save a few pesos on everything, using the exact same services as every other visitor.
Those pesos mount up.

That's probably why I've been able to have numerous visits there numbering months or years rather than weeks.

Nothing wrong with being careful with my money...'look after the pennies' etc. :)

[tone]

I can honestly say hand on heart if I won a couple of hundred grand on the lottery I would be there.:xxgrinning--00xx3:

Same here and good luck with the numbers to all...

[grahamw48]

Don't forget your friends. :Jump: :icon_lol:

[tone]

Lately Rina has been very keen to do the lotto - and amazingly we are winning weekly but thats with 3-4 numbers - she thinks its a matter of time before a proper win is ours..

Personally I am looking at earning my way out of the UK..

[grahamw48]

Yep, me too.

Have you all had your free cavity wall insulation and loft insulation top-ups yet ? :)

[tone]

Not yet - but my house was new last year and is very "green" in regard to the energy efficiency.

I am jus hoping its worth a lot more than I paid for it in 10 years so that I can foxtrot oscar...

[grahamw48]

New houses should be fine, as long as they were actually built according to building regs.

I've come across plenty (whole estates) which weren't. :rolleyes:

Good for me though. :D

[fred]

I could go on.....and now that she is here she and friends marvel at how different it is here, by contrast. Contrast Yeah..
In the UK they wack you on the head with a baseball bat before ripping off the chain!!:Cuckoo:

[lastlid]

Contrast Yeah..
In the UK they wack you on the head with a baseball bat before ripping off the chain!!:Cuckoo:

Of course. True. But less prevalent, less likely to happen here. Its a matter of degree. The fact is that my wife feels a lot safer here than in Manila or Cavite. So do her friends.

[andy222]

Of course. True. But less prevalent, less likely to happen here. Its a matter of degree. The fact is that my wife feels a lot safer here than in Manila or Cavite. So do her friends.

You speak for yourself Lastlid IOM is a lot differnet fro the mainland.:xxgrinning--00xx3:

[lastlid]

You speak for yourself Lastlid IOM is a lot differnet fro the mainland.:xxgrinning--00xx3: I lived in Manchester for over 20 years though and Aberdeen, Leicester and London and all. Spent the first 21 years of my life in London.

I never spent much time in the West Midlands though. A quick foray in with the visit to Cadbury World was a rare one.

[grahamw48]

I lived in Middlesbrough for 2 years. :cwm3:

[lastlid]

Do you qualify as a Monkey Hanger?

[grahamw48]

I wish.

At least Hartlepool has a beach...next to the nuclear power station. :)

[lastlid]

I imagine it is probably the case that it depends on what part of the UK and what part of the Philippines we are referring too. Manchester is a large area and there are good parts and not so good parts. Presumably the same in the Philippines? Having said that, my wife evidently never felt completely safe travelling in Dasmarinas and on her way in to Manila by tricycle and jeepney etc etc. She tended to want to leave anything of any value at home as she felt there was a high chance of it being stolen.

Sure, if you live in places like Toxteth or Moss Side etc then you are at an increased risk, but of course, thankfully, these areas don't have a large radius. My distinct impression is the catchment areas for "dodginess" in the Philippines have much larger radiuses (radii).

[andy222]

Well when I go to the phils I feel safer there. Example on the way to work yesterday I heard on the radio that the police had been called out to a domestic argument. The copper had a petrol bomb thrown at him. Ended up in hospital. I doubt if you would here of that in the phils.

[lastlid]

Well when I go to the phils I feel safer there.


I have no doubt you do Andy. :xxgrinning--00xx3:

[grahamw48]

I feel about 40 years younger...which I'll happily trade for having to keep my hand on my wallet. :)

[andy222]

I have no doubt you do Andy. :xxgrinning--00xx3:

Lastlid I think moving to the IOM was probably one of the best decisions you ever made because here on mainland its getting worse. Fiarplay to you mate.:xxgrinning--00xx3:. I dont think anything will be done until the scum turn up in posh places like Buckinghamshire. Or near to where MPS live. As for London look at places like Tower Hamletts what a :action-smiley-081:hole that is. I wouldnt send my worsed enemy there.

[London_Manila]

I imagine it is probably the case that it depends on what part of the UK and what part of the Philippines we are referring too. Manchester is a large area and there are good parts and not so good parts. Presumably the same in the Philippines? Having said that, my wife evidently never felt completely safe travelling in Dasmarinas and on her way in to Manila by tricycle and jeepney etc etc. She tended to want to leave anything of any value at home as she felt there was a high chance of it being stolen.

Sure, if you live in places like Toxteth or Moss Side etc then you are at an increased risk, but of course, thankfully, these areas don't have a large radius. My distinct impression is the catchment areas for "dodginess" in the Philippines have much larger radiuses (radii).

In the uk we tend to know what area to avoid = Hackney Peckham

The fact that we are not pinoys does makes us instant targets in the philippines

yes its never happened to me as well but i do exercise caution wherever i go in the philippines

not scaremongering just common sense diba :)

[Dedworth]

I dont think anything will be done until the scum turn up in posh places like Buckinghamshire. Or near to where MPS live.

A few more incidents like this wouldn't go amiss

A man has denied assaulting a Peterborough MP during an incident in the city on Saturday.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-cambridgeshire-19068071

[junior02]

I take it you've experienced such an occurrence ?

Got some evidence/reports of this happening to a Brit ?

I have never witnessed a taxi driver even using a mobile phone while in the car with him in 22years.

Caution and common sense yes, scaremongering...no. :NoNo:

Ive experienced taxi drivers on ther cel fones many times, ther normaly texting even the yellow airport taxis, ive had many problems with manila taxi drivers trying to rip me off, and about 12 years ago i had this driver that seemd to me as crazy or on drugs going on wrong side of the road to on coming traffic and he took me through some small streets going to fast and some of the locals started to chuck stones at the car. nearly got into fight with one in marikina as he was trying to chat my now wife up.I could go on and on with my bad experiences.Taxi drivers are my number 1 hate in rp.. you have been very lucky graham48

[grahamw48]

Well, I did ask. :D

So thanks for letting us know about your experiences. :xxgrinning--00xx3:

I tend to think that people to make their own 'luck' though, and I've certainly got out of plenty of taxis after only a short distance, or decided not to take a particular taxi or trike because I didn't like the look of the driver.

I can tell you some right horror stories from when (as a youngster) I used to hitch-hike all over THIS country, not to mention some of the weirdo British taxi drivers I've met, many of whom used to come from our criminal classes in days gone by, before councils became stricter on licensing.

- Just got to be as streetwise as you can. :)

Incidentally, if a taxi driver picks up his cellphone while driving me in his car, I tell him in no uncertain terms to put it down and concentrate on his driving....in the Phils or here.

I'm like that. :icon_lol:

[lastlid]

Yes, but judging by your picture, Graham, you travelled everywhere on the back of a cow......:icon_lol:

[deeen]

Yes but as soon as it started texting, he was off !!!:D

[lastlid]

Yes but as soon as it started texting, he was off !!!:D

Or as soon as Graham started texting he was off.....:icon_lol:

[grahamw48]

Oy !

I could travel under my own steam thankyou ! :1056158225:

.
http://img441.imageshack.us/img441/8027/various017.jpg

[andy222]

Did you try yodalling there Graham?:icon_lol:

[lastlid]

Did you try yodalling there Graham?:icon_lol:

I imagine so as texting hadn't been invented in those days....

[grahamw48]

I imagine so as texting hadn't been invented in those days....

What, last year ? http://img510.imageshack.us/img510/8703/whistle.gif

[lastlid]

What, last year ? http://img510.imageshack.us/img510/8703/whistle.gif

:Erm: :D

[stevewool]

Oy !

I could travel under my own steam thankyou ! :1056158225:

.
http://img441.imageshack.us/img441/8027/various017.jpg

where is the multi pocket jacket:xxgrinning--00xx3:

[grahamw48]

In my bag ! It's pretty hot hiking there. :D