FAO andy222 - Letter in the Belfast Newsletter re Comrade Milliband & Co

[Dedworth]

Hearing of Ed Miliband admitting in an interview that the Labour Government had got immigration wrong with their open door policy must be one of the biggest understatements in British history.

As one of his ministers has said, he was one of the architects of Labour’s immigration disaster.

The Labour Party that was formed to help the British working class actually became the ones that threw millions of working-class people on the economic scrapheap through bringing in cheaper labour.

They became the ones who betrayed working-class areas as many areas were turned into multicultural ghettos with no social cohesion.

To say that mass immigration was good for the UK is completely false as the UK was a successful nation before this took place as we had a settled population.

Now many British people have to scrap for the few jobs that are available, school places, housing. It also has put pressure on the NHS.

It has brought many more criminals to the UK, many of whom we are unable to deport. Many others have brought their own cultural baggage.

Anyone who asked a question or objected was made out to be a racist, like Gordon Brown said about pensioner Gillian Duffy.

It is reckoned that 80 per cent of immigrants vote Labour.

I hope that Mr Miliband’s weasel words will not deceive the British people whose country Labour have nearly destroyed.

http://www.newsletter.co.uk/community/your-view/labour-party-betrayed-the-working-class-1-4877877

[andy222]

I agree with most of that Ded but that demented bitch Thatcher was the one that ripped the heart out of our manufacturing industry in the first place.

[Terpe]

I agree with most of that Ded but that demented bitch Thatcher was the one that ripped the heart out of our manufacturing industry in the first place.

I cannot think how that was Andy??
Not picking an argument at all, nor asking for any. But my memories of those times (when I was young) also include the stupidity and total stubborness of some unions (of which I was also an unwilling member) who opposed any reform or updating whatsoever simply because of her political colour and for no other sensible reason.
You seem so anti-Thatcher I'm just interested in why
According to statistics only 39% of union members voted for Labour in the 1983 general election.
History tells us it was not a one way street. The unions also have a negative contribution as I recall.
That's my recollection anyways.

I lost a lot of money during those times and also a lot of respect for the unions.

Just my opnion.

[stevewool]

just to add my pennies worth, being someone who does not vote and dont follow politics and i dont know many people who are in any party either, but personally i think Thatcher will go down in history as one of our greatest leaders, she would have my vote, just my thought

[andy222]

I cannot think how that was Andy??
Not picking an argument at all, nor asking for any. But my memories of those times (when I was young) also include the stupidity and total stubborness of some unions (of which I was also an unwilling member) who opposed any reform or updating whatsoever simply because of her political colour and for no other sensible reason.
You seem so anti-Thatcher I'm just interested in why
According to statistics only 39% of union members voted for Labour in the 1983 general election.
History tells us it was not a one way street. The unions also have a negative contribution as I recall.
That's my recollection anyways.

I lost a lot of money during those times and also a lot of respect for the unions.

Just my opnion.
Unions now there is a new one to blame. Like I have said before what do you do when a government puts the cost of living up? Obviously you need more salary to keep up with those price rises. Why do we pay union fees? I think the idea is for them to fight for you. The reason we are in this position now is the fault of past governments hiking prices up. Therefore salaries go up. Why do you think china and india are doing so well? Easy answer CHEAP LABOUR. I respect your opinion though your entitled to it Terpe.:xxgrinning--00xx3:

[andy222]

just to add my pennies worth, being someone who dose not vote and dont follow politics and i dont know many people who are in any party either, but personaly i think Thatcher will go down in history as one of our greatest leaders, she would have my vote, just my thought
Ok Steve obviously your speaking from a personal point of view and that is respected. Also you probably did very well out of thatcher. But I am talking about the broader picture. I lived through that era in engineering (MANUFACTURING) and I know what happened.

[DaveyWallis]

Reality...

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1232897/Manufacturing-decline-Labour-greater-Margaret-Thatcher.html

[bigmarco]

I blame Thatcher for a lot of things. She sold off all the utilities the railways and much more besides. Now all we hear about is gas and electricity prices constantly rising, above inflation rail fare increases every year and this can all be attributed to her.
In my own opinion she created the Loadsamoney selfish culture of making people greedy and prepared to stand on anybodys shoulders to get ahead. I believe that the greed within the banking sector and in the city of London in general is largely attributable to her.
On Europe she is as guilty as anybody as she like every Conservative Prime Minister including Heath never trusted the British People with a vote on the European Union.
As for Trades Unions all I can say is that whilst everyone in the Public Sector was having their pay froze for the last 2 years I have had above inflation pay rises and will get another one next month. I am also extremely proud that I haven't had to strike for a pay rise in the last 10 years.

[andy222]

Reality...

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1232897/Manufacturing-decline-Labour-greater-Margaret-Thatcher.html
Its a simple answer really if you think about it. Thatcher did that much damage to manufacturing and like as been said selling off our resources there is no way back and there never will be.It would cost too much money to get those things back. By the way we all know Blair was useless. If you dont make it you cant export it. Its not rocket science.

[stevewool]

it just seems who ever has their name above that number 10 is to blame for everything, may be we have not had a leader who is strong enough just to say no sometimes, its ok saying well they did this and that and its going to takes 2 to 5 years to sort there mess out and before you know it they are out too, so its one big circle going round and round, its knowing when to jump off and get out,
who ever is going to get in is going to have a hard time. and my little vote if i ever did vote will not make one bit of differance,
the government dont do anything for me the local MP dont do anything for me but nod and smile, again my friends its down to yourself to make a better place for you and your family, unless you want nothing but to sit on yer fat backside and produce babies for ever, then you will be ok it seems, again just my simple thoughts of how to make a better life for ones self, no harm meant to others

[Dedworth]

Its a simple answer really if you think about it. Thatcher did that much damage to manufacturing and like as been said selling off our resources there is no way back and there never will be.It would cost too much money to get those things back. By the way we all know Blair was useless. If you dont make it you cant export it. Its not rocket science.

From the article

Manufacturing accounted for more than 20 per cent of the economy in 1997, the year Labour came to power. But by 2007, that share had declined to 12.4 per cent.

That is far steeper than the fall under Lady Thatcher, when its share of the economy fell from 25.8 per cent to 22.5 per cent.

[andy222]

Well if you want to believe it ded carry on mate.

[stevewool]

the past is the past boys who ever is to blame, think of today and tomorrow and the place with sunshine and warmth sitting with a cup of tea or a beer watching the sun go down on another wonderful day in your early retirement over in the phils, or where ever you are

[Dedworth]

Well if you want to believe it ded carry on mate.

Hard facts produced by the Office of National Statistics in 2009 when Labour were in power - are you questioning their validity ?

[andy222]

Wow the office of national statistics?:laugher: Laughable. What do they know?

[Dedworth]

Wow the office of national statistics?:laugher: Laughable. What do they know?

All Governments find them useful :wink:

[andy222]

All Governments find them useful :wink:
Of course they do Ded when they are a advantage to them.:icon_rolleyes:

[Arthur Little]

Far be it from ME to be seen to be taking sides in this ongoing debate ... but - love her, or loathe her - there can be little doubt that Thatcher will go down in the history books as being :Britain:'s most competent political leader since Winston Churchill.

[andy222]

Competent at what though? Arthur its very debatable. I wouldnt think the thousands of miners would agree. And the thousands who lost their homes because of black wednesday. Remember that?

[DaveyWallis]

Have to give you credit Andy, in spite of overwhelming evidence and hard facts you still stick to your opinion.

[andy222]

Have to give you credit Andy, in spite of overwhelming evidence and hard facts you still stick to your opinion.
:laugher:all part of the fun andy.

[Dedworth]

Have to give you credit Andy, in spite of overwhelming evidence and hard facts you still stick to your opinion.

:xxgrinning--00xx3: Seconded, Andy does stick to his guns

[Arthur Little]

Competent at what though? Arthur its very debatable. I wouldnt think the thousands of miners would agree.

Well ... :anerikke: ... like, I suspect, MOST of us contributing to this thread, I'm no authority on political matters.

So ... based on my [very] limited knowledge of the topic in hand, here are four notable achievements that spring to mind ...

... as a force for change, she:

(i) o Hauled :Britain: out of the economic quagmire of the 1970s, by facing-down the NUM in prolonged, disruptive strike action which - while ostensibly about pay and conditions - had, in effect, been instigated to stir up mass discontent throughout the nation.

(ii) o Reformed the Trade Union Movements to allow the democratic methods of secret ballots, thereby lessening the possibility of coercion.

(iii) o Provided a role model for "championing" the efforts of individuals prepared to work hard to achieve success.

and

(iv) o Collaborated with the incumbent US President, Ronald Reagan and Pope John Paul II in contributing to the downfall of Communism.


And the thousands who lost their homes because of black wednesday. Remember that?

:yeahthat: was in late 1992 ... long after her resignation.

[bigmarco]

If all it took to achieve success was hard work then all our Nurses Doctors Soldiers would be millionaires.
She taught people that if you want to get on in life you have to trample over everybody else to get there.

[stevewool]

the fact is, there is only yourself to help yourself