goldthorpe the town that stood still

[stevewool]

well what scum there are in goldthorpe, many was not even born when she was PM but wow, thats a place that never forgets and never forgives, looks like they all live well though, did not see many starving people, most was chuffing and drinking too,they should make it into a museum of what could happen if you dont move on and get over it,

[Terpe]

Does anyone know anything at all about the UK coal mining industry and the overall decline?

How many coal mines were actually closed under the Labour Government (mainly Harold Wilson) ?

How many coal mines were actually closed under the Conservative Government (Margaret Thatcher) ?

I'm not defending or attacking anyone just want to establish facts that are plainly ignored.

Why do we only hear that Margaret Thatcher destroyed coal mines and the associated mining communities when the facts show a hugely different story? :NoNo:

[Dedworth]

Does anyone know anything at all about the UK coal mining industry and the overall decline?

How many coal mines were actually closed under the Labour Government (mainly Harold Wilson) ?

How many coal mines were actually closed under the Conservative Government (Margaret Thatcher) ?

I'm not defending or attacking anyone just want to establish facts that are plainly ignored.

Why do we only hear that Margaret Thatcher destroyed coal mines and the associated mining communities when the facts show a hugely different story? :NoNo:

I posted this a few days ago under the Ex Prime Minister Margaret Thatcher dies thread

Coal had been a decaying industry for years, history was re-written by Labour and they keep repeating it until they believe it is true :-

Declining number of pits under Wilson & Callaghan

1964 .. 545
1965 .. 504
1966 .. 442
1967 .. 406
1968 .. 330
1969 .. 304

1974 .. 250
1975 .. 241
1976 .. 239
1977 .. 231
1978 .. 223
1979 .. 219

Declining Number of pits under Mrs Thatcher

1979 .. 219
1980 .. 213
1981 .. 200
1982 .. 191
1983 .. 170
1984 .. 169
1985 .. 133
1986 .. 110
1987 .. 94
1988 .. 86
1989 .. 73
1990 .. 65



Perhaps someone can tell us how many pits re-opened during 1997 - 2010 under Blair and Bottler Brown

[stevewool]

i have no idea but i am sure someone will come along and tell us the truth, in my work i use to deliver to all the pits around that area from orgreave then upwards to barnsley, this was before the pit closers and was still delivering to them during the strikes too, yes it must have been very very hard to have your job taken, but you have to look at the job, is it safe will i be in this work for another 10 years and so on, but i beleive these people was brainwashed by there unions JOB FOR LIFE MATE, what company can survive like this, none and its proved it too,
The area around goldthorpe is booming lots of very large companies have moved into the area and surely that is better then working down the pit for your life, but like i said before to get anywhere in life and what ever party are in goverment it is down to yourself to make a better life,

[Terpe]

Sorry Dedworth. I just couldn't follow that other thread.
So many opposing views with no quarter given either way.
Those folks who lived through the Labour years and then the Tory years would need to be about my age by now.
Sorry, I'll duck out of this one now.

We all need to move on.
I think about the future, that where I'll be spending the rest of my life..........hopefully

[les_taxi]

All the above posts are so true,but you have people who jump on the Maggie hate bandwagon and if you really believe that to celebrate someones death who at the end of the day did what they thought was best (and many,many agree) at the time then you are as sick as them.
I detest Brown,Blair and believe the crisis we have now is far worse than under Maggies rule but when they die I will not celebrate their death-I've got more compassion and moral fibre than that:xxgrinning--00xx3:

[RickyR]

Have to be honest, as someone that comes from Doncaster (very close to goldthorpe) and a mining area, the area has never recovered from the mines closing. I don't blame that on Thatcher, times change. Pretty much all other industry in the area has collapsed as well.
There is work in sandwich factories, call centres and distribution centres, but aside from that there isn't much more.
Last time I was in Doncaster, I found the area to be incredibly depressing, scruffy depressed looking people, shuffling around. Travel not so far way to Leeds, Harrogate, York etc and things do seem much better.

I chose to move away for work, and recently the possibility of moving back arose, Humber Pilots were recruiting and I'd probably had a good chance at the job, but I know that living in Humberside/South Yorkshire isn't easy now, but house prices are superb....

[andy222]

Like terpe said you have to have lived through that era and worked in the industries that were affected to have a good idea of the devastation she caused.

[Dedworth]

Like terpe said you have to have lived through that era and worked in the industries that were affected to have a good idea of the devastation she caused.

Above figures show Andy that much of the decline was caused by industries becoming uneconomic in earlier years. I went to college with two fellas who thought they had jobs for life with Kodak.................

[jake]

Like terpe said you have to have lived through that era and worked in the industries that were affected to have a good idea of the devastation she caused.

Andy, if you read the post again by Terpe he never actually said anything about the industries and thatcher!

Just looked up Goldthorpe as i didn't know where it was.
Medieval farming village was how it was described. Yesterday proved the residents haven't moved on!

[les_taxi]

Just blame Maggie for everything:NoNo:
I got hangover today-bloody thatcherism:icon_lol:

[RickyR]

I went to school in a village called Brodsworth ( the same school as Jeremy Clarkson), and it's only about 10 minutes from Goldthorpe. Goldthorpe is somewhere if you visited you'd remember for being truly awful. A place full of people forgotten without industry.

[joebloggs]

just because some of you :heartshape1: thatcher doesn't mean everyone else has to, you might find it hard to believe some :xxaction-smiley-047 her.

you just ignore the facts about poverty increased, unemployment increase under thatcher, and just because it didn't affect you, but it affected many others :doh

and people have a right to protest, i'm sure you lot will be when blair snuff it :icon_rolleyes:

[Trefor]

Have to be honest, as someone that comes from Doncaster (very close to goldthorpe) and a mining area, the area has never recovered from the mines closing. I don't blame that on Thatcher, times change. Pretty much all other industry in the area has collapsed as well.
There is work in sandwich factories, call centres and distribution centres, but aside from that there isn't much more.
Last time I was in Doncaster, I found the area to be incredibly depressing, scruffy depressed looking people, shuffling around. Travel not so far way to Leeds, Harrogate, York etc and things do seem much better.

I chose to move away for work, and recently the possibility of moving back arose, Humber Pilots were recruiting and I'd probably had a good chance at the job, but I know that living in Humberside/South Yorkshire isn't easy now, but house prices are superb....

I grew up in the area too. I was born in London, but my parents moved me to Scunthorpe when I was a baby (Father got a job at the steelworks - another example of a declined industry), we then moved a rural village called Westwoodside near Epworth when I was a teenager. Yep, Doncaster is a pretty depressing area, but to be honest no different to other areas with similar backgrounds. You get the same thing across the world - where towns once prospered and then fell into a state of 'disrepair'. Even in the UK you can see examples where the woollen mills were during the industrial revolution.

RickyR - have you tried Robin Hood International Airport? sounds posh until you realise it is Finningley :-)

[jake]

just because some of you :heartshape1: thatcher doesn't mean everyone else has to, you might find it hard to believe some :xxaction-smiley-047 her.

you just ignore the facts about poverty increased, unemployment increase under thatcher, and just because it didn't effect you, but it effected many others :doh

and people have a right to protest, i'm sure you lot will be when blair snuff it :icon_rolleyes:

Joe, i have no affiliation with any political party in the UK.

I was always taught to respect the dead and even if i didn't like her she wasn't some bampot dictator.

People should show some respect for her family even if they didn't agree with her politics.

[joebloggs]

People should show some respect for her family even if they didn't agree with her politics.

its not just politics thou, it effected peoples lives, you'll not see me celebrating her death, but i can understand why some people will be :cwm24:

[les_taxi]

just because some of you :heartshape1: thatcher doesn't mean everyone else has to, you might find it hard to believe some :xxaction-smiley-047 her.

you just ignore the facts about poverty increased, unemployment increase under thatcher, and just because it didn't affect you, but it affected many others :doh

and people have a right to protest, i'm sure you lot will be when blair snuff it :icon_rolleyes:
No joe difference is as much as I hate Blair/Brown and all the hardship THEY have caused I would not celebrate their death:NoNo:

[joebloggs]

what hardship did blair cause ? getting 1.5million kids out of poverty and taking many pensioners out of poverty ?

[les_taxi]

what hardship did blair cause ? getting 1.5million kids out of poverty and taking many pensioners out of poverty ?

Omg you are joking Joe!
I must have been beamed to a different planet :yikes:

[joebloggs]

Omg you are joking Joe!
I must have been beamed to a different planet :yikes:

I've posted the link 3 times already :icon_lol:

[les_taxi]

Kids in poverty my ....! Most kids have mobile phones and eat at Mcdonalds:icon_lol:

[bigmarco]

Didn't like her wouldn't celebrate her death but certainly didn't mourn her passing.
However there are many people North of Watford who believe she ruined their lives closed down their industry, forced husbands and fathers from reasonable standards of living on to the dole queues. Thankfully it never happened to me but I think if I had gone from being able to provide a decent living for my children to having to sign on for probably the rest of my working life I might just have carried a grudge for as long as the people of Goldthorpe.
Having been fortunate enough to have never had to stand in their shoes I do however respect their right to demonstrate in their own village in a peaceful way. To me they were not scum but people make their own point.
Some cynics might well suggest that the whole thing seemed conveniently stage managed for the assembled media if you know what I mean.

[les_taxi]

Hmm interesting so what is the difference between 'celebrating the death of someone' some people hated to a Islamic pratt celebrating deaths of British servicemen

[RickyR]

I grew up in the area too. I was born in London, but my parents moved me to Scunthorpe when I was a baby (Father got a job at the steelworks - another example of a declined industry), we then moved a rural village called Westwoodside near Epworth when I was a teenager. Yep, Doncaster is a pretty depressing area, but to be honest no different to other areas with similar backgrounds. You get the same thing across the world - where towns once prospered and then fell into a state of 'disrepair'. Even in the UK you can see examples where the woollen mills were during the industrial revolution.

RickyR - have you tried Robin Hood International Airport? sounds posh until you realise it is Finningley :-)

I know Westwoodside very well. I've used Robin Hood a few times on commercial aircraft and found it fine. Also flown in and out a lot in light aircraft as recently as last summer (also from Sandtoft).

[Dedworth]

Omg you are joking Joe!
I must have been beamed to a different planet :yikes:

Same planet that I'm on Les :xxgrinning--00xx3:

[bigmarco]

Hmm interesting so what is the difference between 'celebrating the death of somone' some people hated to a Islamic pratt celebrating deaths of British servicemen

I've got to underground for 8 hours Les but I'll think about that one :biggrin:

[grahamw48]

I know well all the places mentioned (grew up in Pontefact and travel to the rest regularly on business).

Let's not forget Grimethorpe...the name of which used to describe it perfectly. :icon_lol:

.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-20901162

[andy222]

Joe, i have no affiliation with any political party in the UK.

I was always taught to respect the dead and even if i didn't like her she wasn't some bampot dictator.

People should show some respect for her family even if they didn't agree with her politics.
Respect for her family? Her son was a con artist who turned his back on this country to live in America. Get a grip.:xxgrinning--00xx3:

[stevewool]

Andy, if you read the post again by Terpe he never actually said anything about the industries and thatcher!

Just looked up Goldthorpe as i didn't know where it was.
Medieval farming village was how it was described. Yesterday proved the residents haven't moved on!

that is so funny:icon_lol::icon_lol::icon_lol::icon_lol::icon_lol:

[stevewool]

Respect for her family? Her son was a con artist who turned his back on this country to live in America. Get a grip.:xxgrinning--00xx3:

i am going to turn my back on this country too as soon as i can ,

[stevewool]

what i have been reading from lots of people here is how maggie seemed to have split a country.
She seems to be the one who has split families apart never ever to speak to one another ever again,
She even gave les a headache for being drunk too it seems,
But what is stricking me is about you lot are saying how she took the industrie from places like yorkshire the coal , steel, ship building and so on,
Well if a business is not making money it closers down and then you either move to another company that is employing or move to a differant area for work, here is where it gets intresting, all the people coming from europe that are coming here to Work, not claim benefit, why is it wrong for them to come here to work when the people it seems up in those places dont work anyway, just me thinking out loud

[Dedworth]

Some here seem to hold the opinion that the state should pour money into uneconomic, outdated, uncompetitive industries - so much the better if they are heavily unionised and full of archaic working practices

[RickyR]

How did Germany maintain its industry? What political decisions ensured their success?

I agree with Graham though, the vilifying of Thatcher is ridiculous. Last time i checked we arent a republic, She was a prime minister not a president, she represented the party and cabinet, and pushed through her parties policies. The party was voted in 3 times with 40%+ of the votes with her as leader and followed through policies that the previous government had established.

Some policies clearly left destruction, and places like South Yorkshire still bear the scars, but these policies were also labours doing.

Personally, in the present climate, I couldn't find anything positive to say about labour or the Tories, or the lib dems for that.

[grahamw48]

The owners/managers ask for increased efficiency. The workers (read UNION LEADERS) say no...in fact, they want a 35% pay rise... = inflation = more pay demands = inflation etc etc.

Result: The company has the life strangled out of it. Foreign companies take the business.

Enjoy driving your foreign car, watching your foreign TV, using your foreign washing machine, cooker, computer, flying abroad on your foreign plane, sending your Balikbayan boxes on a foregn ship, etc etc...all of which could be manufactured here. :NoNo:

[les_taxi]

At last a bit of reason on here-she won 3 Elections and like any party she made mistakes but for many she did a lot of good.
My costs have gone up tremendously in recent years-no good me blaming governments it's down to many reasons but I do not expect to be bailed out if I failed.
I would look to do something else-many polish have come here and have opened lots of car was units and are doing great.
Some people think they are owed a living,you are not!

[grahamw48]

Well, I think that you, like me are self-employed Les... nuff said. :wink:

[les_taxi]

Yes and at the moment me and 8 others are setting up a brand new taxi company in Harrogate:xxgrinning--00xx3:
Bloody hard work,we are taking a gamble having left the largest company in town and sold our shares in that company.
It will succeed we are confident but if it did not I'm not gonna blame anyone else

[grahamw48]

Well, if you're ever looking for more drivers who speed everywhere, ignore red lights, wake everyone up parping their horn outside, and tell passengers their life story and political views for the entire journey....I'm your man ! :xxgrinning--00xx3::icon_lol:

[grahamw48]

Respect for her family? Her son was a con artist who turned his back on this country to live in America. Get a grip.:xxgrinning--00xx3:

But Mark Thatcher was such a GOOD boy...

.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iOFvgiCyChA

[Dedworth]

Although for reasons best known to themselves Labour failed to re-open any pits they did embark on a massive job creation programme in the North, Wales etc to the extent that more than 20% of all jobs are in the public sector. In places like Liverpool , Newcastle and so forth public sector employment is 33%. No doubt many positions are highly paid jobs for the boys and fellow travellers - Decision Support Analyst, Change Facilitators, Sustainability Officers and suchlike

[grahamw48]

Yes, generates a lot of income for the country and important new skills...pushing bits of paper about. :NoNo:

[les_taxi]

At the end of the day how many elections did she win?:biggrin:
To win three tells you the majority of the public wanted her-end of agruament really:biggrin: