URGENT! What to do? Got refused !

[anvee]

Greetings,

I am indeed desperate for help. I have been refused for a visa because my husband and I are both unemployed and he's been living here for 8 months. Said that "You both appear to have limited cash savings, I am not satisfied that you currently would not meet the financial requirement of a UK settlement application!" But we are applying for a family visit visa and I have my parents-in-law to support us and sponsor us financially in the UK: my parents-in-law submitted - invitation letter, bank savings worth more £XX,XXX!, title deed of their house, copy of their passports!. I have included to the application and my cover letter that my sponsors are my husband (with his savings - he also submitted his bank statements with £4000 on it 6 months) and my parents-in-law! And it was also said "You have submitted NO EVIDENCE of any property, assets or other ties to the Philippines" but we submitted Deed of Sale of our car, motorbike & expensive equipments worth more than P100,000!!!! We just want to spend holidays with the family and get to know them because it'll be my first time meeting my parents-in-law because they couldn't come to the Philippines due to the long traveling and they're both 60+ yrs old!

Please please I need your advice. Please help! I think it is very unfair that they didn't even consider my submitted documents proof of ties and my parents-in-laws'! I even screenshot my mother and I's facebook statuses to prove that we have a very close relationship and we will back to celebrate her birthday June 2014 (I am an only child).. even my childhood photos with my mother!

Please help on how to appeal and say to them why they didn't submitted back my parents-in-laws documents as well as why they didnt consider the deeds of sale for our ASSETS?? Unless they dont consider cars/motorbikes/equipments as assets?????


Thank you!

[anvee]

http://i1316.photobucket.com/albums/t606/eurix16/IMG2_zps022688b7.jpg

[anvee]

I have submitted these together with my 3 page cover letter explaining important details!

Personal Documents:
- Passport
- Application form, duly dated and signed with passport-size photo
- Bank Statement (Union Bank)
- Visa Payment Confirmation
- Marriage Certificate
- Birth Certificate
Spouse’s Documents:
- Cover Letter of Support
- Copy of his Passport
- Bank Statement
Parents-in-law’s Documents:
- Passports Copies
- Invitation Letter
- Bank Statement
- Title Deed (to prove their ownership of my accommodation)
- Utility Bill
Miscellaneous:
- Proof of Ownership of our Dodge Ram Vam B250 with photos
- Proof of Ownership of our Honda XR200 with photos
- Proof of Ownership of our expensive equipments/tools with photos
- Photos of my relationship with Andrew
- Wedding Photos
- My mother and I’s relationship proofs (photos/screenshots)
- Emails/video call logs from my parents-in-law

[Terpe]

Hi anvee

So sorry to see that your visa got refused.

It's upsetting and difficult to accept I know, but try to remain calm and objective.

There's no mandatory requirement for specific documents for visit visa applications. The decision is principally based on the discretion of the ECO based upon the overall 'picture' of the application.
Also, basically there is no appeal process unless based on human rights or race discrimination grounds.
Any such appeals you might consider could be expected to take between 6-8 months to conclude.

On the positive side you are able to re-apply, at any time, by clearly and properly addressing the reasons for refusal.
Personally I'd suggest referencing the reasons for refusal and countering with both a written statement and evidential documenation.
The cost and risk of re-applying is low

You absolutely must clearly demonstrate a non-immigrant intent.
To best achieve that, you must convince the ECO, to his own satisfaction, that you have strong social, economic and family ties in the Philippines that would compel you to leave the UK at the end of your visit.

Common reasons to return home and strong/complelling ties may differ from country to country, city to city and individual to individual.
Some examples of ties can be a job, a house, social and family relationships, a bank account, possessions etc
AS mentioned before the ECO will be looking to see if the aspects of your life that bind you to your country outweigh those aspects that may cause you to be unwilling to return to your home country, or to attempt to change or extend your visa status.

Other key factors to keep in mind when applying for a UK visit visa, in addition to compelling intentions to return home, include having a clear well thought out visit plan including outline itinerary, dates of Travel, duration of stay and main reasons for wanting to travel at the specific time.
Having access to sufficient cash funds to support and accommodate yourself or how you'll be supported and accommodated by relatives or friends.

Anyone 'sponsoring' a visitor to UK should review the UKBA webpage Sponsoring a General Visitor (http://www.ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk/visas-immigration/visiting/sponsoringavisitor/)

I imagine it did not help your case to include proof of the sale of your assets.

May I kindly suggest you carefully read the refusal, decide the best approach to fully address all the reasons given and re-apply.
You'll need to support a subsequent application with clear documentary evidence and a very good letter of invitation support from the family members you are visiting.

Family sponsors should include:-
- 6 months Bank statements
- 6 months pay slips
- Proof of address (eg utility bill, Council Tax etc)
- Accommodation details (including owner's agreement / rental agreement)
- Sponsors passport copy (Photo page, any relevant stamp pages)
- The main reasons for the visit invitation at the specific time

Hope this will help get a subsequent application approved.

Try to stay positive all is not lost by any means.

[anvee]

Hi anvee

So sorry to see that your visa got refused.

It's upsetting and difficult to accept I know, but try to remain calm and objective.

There's no mandatory requirement for specific documents for visit visa applications. The decision is principally based on the discretion of the ECO based upon the overall 'picture' of the application.
Also, basically there is no appeal process unless based on human rights or race discrimination grounds.
Any such appeals you might consider could be expected to take between 6-8 months to conclude.

On the positive side you are able to re-apply, at any time, by clearly and properly addressing the reasons for refusal.
Personally I'd suggest referencing the reasons for refusal and countering with both a written statement and evidential documenation.
The cost and risk of re-applying is low

You absolutely must clearly demonstrate a non-immigrant intent.
To best achieve that, you must convince the ECO, to his own satisfaction, that you have strong social, economic and family ties in the Philippines that would compel you to leave the UK at the end of your visit.

Common reasons to return home and strong/complelling ties may differ from country to country, city to city and individual to individual.
Some examples of ties can be a job, a house, social and family relationships, a bank account, possessions etc
AS mentioned before the ECO will be looking to see if the aspects of your life that bind you to your country outweigh those aspects that may cause you to be unwilling to return to your home country, or to attempt to change or extend your visa status.

Other key factors to keep in mind when applying for a UK visit visa, in addition to compelling intentions to return home, include having a clear well thought out visit plan including outline itinerary, dates of Travel, duration of stay and main reasons for wanting to travel at the specific time.
Having access to sufficient cash funds to support and accommodate yourself or how you'll be supported and accommodated by relatives or friends.

Anyone 'sponsoring' a visitor to UK should review the UKBA webpage Sponsoring a General Visitor (http://www.ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk/visas-immigration/visiting/sponsoringavisitor/)

I imagine it did not help your case to include proof of the sale of your assets.

May I kindly suggest you carefully read the refusal, decide the best approach to fully address all the reasons given and re-apply.
You'll need to support a subsequent application with clear documentary evidence and a very good letter of invitation support from the family members you are visiting.

Family sponsors should include:-
- 6 months Bank statements
- 6 months pay slips
- Proof of address (eg utility bill, Council Tax etc)
- Accommodation details (including owner's agreement / rental agreement)
- Sponsors passport copy (Photo page, any relevant stamp pages)
- The main reasons for the visit invitation at the specific time

Hope this will help get a subsequent application approved.

Try to stay positive all is not lost by any means.

Thank you, I have submitted Family sponsors documents as you've stated. They are both retired. It was in their invitation letter.

That's why I included my mother and I's facebook status updates and even our photos to show them that we are very close family as I am her only child and she's a single parent so I included in the cover letter that "I am the only thing she has in the world." If that's not good enough to prove that I have strong family relationships, then I don't know what else to give to them!

I also mentioned our itenary for the 6 months, I also mentioned about planning to be out of the UK in the middle of my stay (Eurotrip with family because it's closer to UK) so I requested for multiple entry up to 6 months. I have submitted bank account with more than P100,000 from my savings before when I used to work as virtual assistant (I am now full time housewife), I also included in the letter that I am being supported by my husband through his savings (that's where we get our money for our expenses, he still have about £4000+ left in his account.. we're planning to do business here in the Philippines after our visit.. we have to get Andrew's tools/equipments in the UK to bring to Philippines).

What I don't understand is that ECO mentioned that I DID NOT SUBMIT any proof of my properties/assets where I submitted deeds of sale of those under our names.

I mentioned everything in detail in my 3 page cover letter including the dates of travel, duration of stay, my main reasons with explanation for each reasons. My husband also mentioned in his "Letter of Support" that he will look for part-time work when he comes back to UK to help with our expenses there even though my parents-in-law will accommodate us and feed us during our stay there.

Also, with ECO mentioning "UK Settlement Application", this one bothered me the most as family visit visa is not a settlement application. I am just disappointed and hurt. I mentioned that Dec 11 will be the birthday of my dad-in-law and it'll be nice to be there for his birthday as well as for the holidays! Just heartbreaking.

Anyways, thank you for your reply. I will do my best to stay positive but it's still sinking in and the thought of my parents-in-law being disappointed just breaks my heart even more!

[SimonH]

What I don't understand is that ECO mentioned that I DID NOT SUBMIT any proof of my properties/assets where I submitted deeds of sale of those under our names.




Morning Anvee,


Sorry to read of your refusal. I think you'll find the answer to your misunderstanding is that you've submitted deeds of sale of those assets and therefore they're not yours any more, they are now the assets of the person who bought them from you.

[anvee]

Morning Anvee,


Sorry to read of your refusal. I think you'll find the answer to your misunderstanding is that you've submitted deeds of sale of those assets and therefore their not yours any more, they are now the assets of the person who bought them from you.

They are Deeds of Sale we got from when we bought those assets, they are second-hand properties so the deeds of sale are named to us. We are the Vendee and not the Vendor.

[SimonH]

Sorry Anvee, my misunderstanding. So these are in fact proof of purchase :Erm:
Can I ask what you plan on doing with the properties :Erm: You say that you're planning on doing some sort of business when you get back, maybe when you re-apply you could include some sort of business plan and time scale, this would add to you're reasons for returning to the Philippines.

Hope all gets sorted quickly for you both :xxgrinning--00xx3:

[anvee]

Sorry Anvee, my misunderstanding. So these are in fact proof of purchase :Erm:
Can I ask what you plan on doing with the properties :Erm: You say that you're planning on doing some sort of business when you get back, maybe when you re-apply you could include some sort of business plan and time scale, this would add to you're reasons for returning to the Philippines.

Hope all gets sorted quickly for you both :xxgrinning--00xx3:

Thank you so much Simon. We are planning to do some fabrication business here in the Philippines. Andrew has alot of equipments in the UK that he might need in setting up the business here: one of the reasons of coming to UK aside from visiting my parents-in-law (included that in the cover letter as well). Maybe that will help our application next time, we already have the welding machine/compressor/plasma cutter/small tools here already but he uses it to fix our van so maybe a business plan will be huge help.

Andrew already wrote in his "Letter of Support" that he intends to have a workshop business here after our visit to the UK since most of his stuff are still there.

Thank you again.

[joebloggs]

sorry I don't have time to read all the thread now, i think your problem was\is the embassy don't believe you will go back before your visa expires and your applying for a visit visa to see your husband, if your in a genuine relationship you should be applying for a settlement visa. (i know your both unemployed thou !)

[anvee]

I am not applying to see my husband. My husband lives with me in the Philippines. He's been here for 8 months now. We are just visiting there to see my parents-in-law since they couldn't come to our civil wedding here last August 2013. My husband doesn't want to settle in the UK. Hence why he bought all those assets that we have for now (my parents-in-law are not happy about the big purchases though!).

[Terpe]

Anvee,

I wasn't doubting the documentation you and your sponsors submitted.
It's not simply the document itself but importantly what the document states and how the ECO views that in the overall picture of the application.

The reasons given by the ECO can be countered in a subsequent application.
He is driven to refusal by his belief that, in his opinion, your intentions are unclear and he is not convinced that you have sufficient reasons to return.

In principle it would be pointless to appeal.

One option you have is to write to the ECM (Entry Clearance Manager) outlining that you have the opinion that the ECO made an error and failed to review the supporting documents you included in your application. You should clearly request the ECM to reconsider your application.
Also point out that many of those key supporting documents have not been returned and you hope that they were not lost or mislaid during the visa review process leading to the decision to refuse.

There's no guarantee it will work but it's has worked many time in the past.
I'd also suggest writing regular follow ups to the ECM as well as ALL the following:-

Regional Operations Manager
NE Asia/Australasia - International Operations and Visas
UK Border Agency
British Embassy
120 Upper McKinley Road
Taguig City 1634
Metro Manila
Philippines

Tel: +63 (0)2 858 2235
FTN: 8411 2235
Mobile: +63 (0)917 556 8120
Web: www.ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk

Appeals and Correspondence Manager, Manila Visa Hub
NE Asia/Australasia - International Operations and Visas
UK Border Agency
British Embassy
120 Upper McKinley Road
McKinley Hill
Taguig City 1634
Metro Manila, Philippines

Fax: +63 2 8582305
Email: manilvisaenquiries@fco.gov.uk
Web: www.ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk

Trevor Lewis - Deputy Head of Mission
British Embassy Manila
120 Upper McKinley Road
McKinley Hill
Taguig City 1634
Metro Manila, Philippines

Asif Ahmad - British Ambassador to the Philippines
British Embassy Manila
120 Upper McKinley Road
McKinley Hill
Taguig City 1634
Metro Manila, Philippines

You'll need to do this pretty quickly

Also, please do review the refusal and put together another application that can be submitted at a later date depending on responses from the Embassy.

[anvee]

Anvee,

I wasn't doubting the documentation you and your sponsors submitted.
It's not simply the document itself but importantly what the document states and how the ECO views that in the overall picture of the application.

The reasons given by the ECO can be countered in a subsequent application.
He is driven to refusal by his belief that, in his opinion, your intentions are unclear and he is not convinced that you have sufficient reasons to return.

In principle it would be pointless to appeal.

One option you have is to write to the ECM (Entry Clearance Manager) outlining that you have the opinion that the ECO made an error and failed to review the supporting documents you included in your application. You should clearly request the ECM to reconsider your application.
Also point out that many of those key supporting documents have not been returned and you hope that they were not lost or mislaid during the visa review process leading to the decision to refuse.

There's no guarantee it will work but it's has worked many time in the past.
I'd also suggest writing regular follow ups to the ECM as well as ALL the following:-

Regional Operations Manager
NE Asia/Australasia - International Operations and Visas
UK Border Agency
British Embassy
120 Upper McKinley Road
Taguig City 1634
Metro Manila
Philippines

Tel: +63 (0)2 858 2235
FTN: 8411 2235
Mobile: +63 (0)917 556 8120
Web: www.ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk

Appeals and Correspondence Manager, Manila Visa Hub
NE Asia/Australasia - International Operations and Visas
UK Border Agency
British Embassy
120 Upper McKinley Road
McKinley Hill
Taguig City 1634
Metro Manila, Philippines

Fax: +63 2 8582305
Email: manilvisaenquiries@fco.gov.uk
Web: www.ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk

Trevor Lewis - Deputy Head of Mission
British Embassy Manila
120 Upper McKinley Road
McKinley Hill
Taguig City 1634
Metro Manila, Philippines

Asif Ahmad - British Ambassador to the Philippines
British Embassy Manila
120 Upper McKinley Road
McKinley Hill
Taguig City 1634
Metro Manila, Philippines

You'll need to do this pretty quickly

Also, please do review the refusal and put together another application that can be submitted at a later date depending on responses from the Embassy.

This is hugely helpful! Thank you so much. I do apologize for my tone in my writing sometimes. I am still frustrated about it. I'm sure you understand. Thank you again!

[Terpe]

This is hugely helpful! Thank you so much. I do apologize for my tone in my writing sometimes. I am still frustrated about it. Im sure you understand. Thank you again!

Of course we understand. It's an awful and upsetting situation.
Do make you letters requesting reconsideration of the decision.
Do follow up asking for updates etc.
Do NOT be shy about making daily messages if you feel inclined.

Be sure to have your docs returned and do be sure to prepare another application that fully addresses the reasons for refusal.

You'll have plenty of support here in the forum.
Visit visa applications are low cost and fast to process. :xxgrinning--00xx3:

[anvee]

Of course we understand. It's an awful and upsetting situation.
Do make you letters requesting reconsideration of the decision.
Do follow up asking for updates etc.
Do NOT be shy about making daily messages if you feel inclined.

Be sure to have your docs returned and do be sure to prepare another application that fully addresses the reasons for refusal.

You'll have plenty of support here in the forum.
Visit visa applications are low cost and fast to process. :xxgrinning--00xx3:

Thank you, I found the documents when I scanned it one by one (maybe I was temporarily blind due to the refusal letter! haha).

I asked them about why they did not consider the Deeds of Sale as our assets proofs and they clearly stated in the letter of refusal that I DID NOT SUBMIT anything. I also raised concern about why they didnt mention anything about my parents-in-law being my sponsor when I clearly stated in the application form "my spouse and parents in law" as sponsors. Are they not important to the decision making because theyre the main reason of visiting the UK. Also I asked them to enlighten me about the phrase "UK settlement application" because I dont think family visit visa is a settlement visa. I also said there that I feel like my documents have been completely ignored because of lack of consideration to them and completely claiming I didnt provide enough documents and proofs.

I will do email them everyday until I get answers because I am pretty confident I submitted everything they needed me to submit. The only thing the ECO was sure we're not coming back is due to both of us being UNEMPLOYED. We do have savings and parents in law are willing to sponsor. My husband mentioned he will find temporary work when he gets there as he doesn't really wanna settle down in the UK. I didn't mention anything about the "lost documents from my parents in law". Good thing I didn't or Id be super embarrassed! Good thing I found them first before I wrote the email !

Thank you for the support. Just heartbreaking because our intentions are genuine but I guess it's their job (they just make wrong decisions sometimes!)
It is lowcost but if you keep being denied it adds up! haha

[Terpe]

That's it.....go get 'em Juvee :ReadIt:

[joebloggs]

i see i thought your husband had returned to the uk, also it mentioned settlement in your refusal letter :doh

well in that case if you and your husband are only visiting the uk, then that's a different matter, its up to your sponsor to show you have the finances to support you.

bit out of order asking what your husband would be doing for 6 months in the UK, he's a British citizen and not subject to immigration control.

[anvee]

i see i thought your husband had returned to the uk, also it mentioned settlement in your refusal letter :doh

well in that case if you and your husband are only visiting the uk, then that's a different matter, its up to your sponsor to show you have the finances to support you.

bit out of order asking what your husband would be doing for 6 months in the UK, hes a British citizen and not subject to immigration control.

Exactly my point! My parents-in-law were kind enough to share their personal documents just to sponsor me because they're dying to see their awesome Filipina daughter-in-law :laugher: . In their bank statements, they showed that they are capable of sponsoring me even if they base it on £18,000+ requirement for settlement visas (and I only applied for visit visa!) just to make sure they wouldn't question it. But then, in the refusal letter, nothing about those documents from my other sponsors which are my parents-in-law!

My husband said in his Letter of Support that he is willing to work part-time to help with the expenses whilst we're in the UK (he also has small savings) but considering my parents-in-law will be sponsoring pretty much everything, it doesn't matter really. I really feel like that ECO A. Thomas was either drunk or high for even mentioning "settlement application".. so RIDICULOUS!!!:cwm23:

[Dedworth]

Good luck Anvee :smile:

[anvee]

Good luck Anvee :smile:

Thank you so much! I will definitely update about this and let you know guys know if ever I receive an email reply from ECM. I would be okay if the reasons of refusal are good enough to make me believe Im not worth the family visit visa. But not be biased, based from my documents and even the cover letter and photos, I strongly believe that the grounds of my refusal are unfair and inconsiderate.

[gWaPito]

When I applied for my mother in law to come over from the Philippines I needed signed avidavids from each of the family members. This is what you will need to get Juvee...signed character references from as many family members as possible with checkable backgrounds for example holding passports ....they need to explain why you will be coming back..in your case your mother will need to explain that..you will then need to get a solicitor to sign and stamp such letters...........This is what I did under the instruction of my solicitor here in the UK.

What does go against you is that you have little money to last the 6 months in the UK...£4000 from your husband and 100,000 peso from yourself barerly adds up to £30 per day living allowance

If its your in laws going to support you, the visit visa application would of been better coming from them ...for it's them who are going to support you.

Like me, they will have to show detailed income and outgoings along with plans of their house to show if they have the space to accommodate all of you...again, they will have to get this drawn up by a surveyor who will have to sign and stamp it....their are rules laid out on how many adults can stay in a certain sized house..they go by how many bedrooms etc

This is my experience of sucessfully applying for a Visit Visa for my mother in law this March.

So sorry to read about your distress Juvee :NoNo:

Lets all hope and pray everything works out for you in the end

Regards
Gwaps

BTW...I suppose I could post letters from my solicitor if that will help...I was going to do this around a year ago to help somebody else who was trying to get their mother here.

I'll have to do it later tonight..no time now

So chin up Andrew and Juvee :biggrin:..Like Terpe said, you have the forum behind you :xxgrinning--00xx3:

[gWaPito]

Exactly my point! My parents-in-law were kind enough to share their personal documents just to sponsor me because they're dying to see their awesome Filipina daughter-in-law :laugher: . In their bank statements, they showed that they are capable of sponsoring me even if they base it on £18,000+ requirement for settlement visas (and I only applied for visit visa!) just to make sure they wouldn't question it. But then, in the refusal letter, nothing about those documents from my other sponsors which are my parents-in-law!

My husband said in his Letter of Support that he is willing to work part-time to help with the expenses whilst we're in the UK (he also has small savings) but considering my parents-in-law will be sponsoring pretty much everything, it doesn't matter really. I really feel like that ECO A. Thomas was either drunk or high for even mentioning "settlement application".. so RIDICULOUS!!!:cwm23:

The ECO didn't use your in law's documents because it wasn't them making the application!!.....it's simple to us but, to those pen pushers lateral thinking isn't permitted

Your in laws will need to make the application on your behalf

[anvee]

The ECO didn't use your in law's documents because it wasn't them making the application!!.....it's simple to us but, to those pen pushers lateral thinking isn't permitted

Your in laws will need to make the application on your behalf

I didn't know that my parents in law will have to make the application on my behalf because it said in ukba website that i should be the applicant and just provide supporting documents ie invitation letter, proof of accommodation and bank statements WHICH THEY DID. So even if my husband and I dont have alot of money, my primary sponsors are my parents-in-law because theyre the ones we're visiting and accommodating/feeding me during my stay in the UK.

If they dont consider my in laws' documents then why would ukba website's supporting documents checklist included those? I am so confused :S.

From my understanding, it is my application.. under my name.. with my passport that they need to be stamped if I get the visa. :Erm:

I am now confused but thank you anyways gwapito! :)

[gWaPito]

I didn't know that my parents in law will have to make the application on my behalf because it said in ukba website that i should be the applicant and just provide supporting documents ie invitation letter, proof of accommodation and bank statements WHICH THEY DID. So even if my husband and I dont have alot of money, my primary sponsors are my parents-in-law because theyre the ones we're visiting and accommodating/feeding me during my stay in the UK.

If they dont consider my in laws' documents then why would ukba website's supporting documents checklist included those? I am so confused :S.

From my understanding, it is my application.. under my name.. with my passport that they need to be stamped if I get the visa. :Erm:

I am now confused but thank you anyways gwapito! :)

Don't be confused Juvee...you are right, it's your application in your name only..sorry :doh.....I've not long woken

This is what happened with my mother in law....but, it was me filling our the application form for her from start to finish here in UK with the help of a Visa solicitor.

The ECO should of considered your in law's documents as they would of been the backbone of your Visa application :NoNo:

Goodness :NoNo::doh:doh I've read your refusal letter again...you got to appeal againt this travesty Juvee

[Terpe]

......From my understanding, it is my application.. under my name.. with my passport that they need to be stamped if I get the visa. :Erm:

Juvee, your understanding is correct. It is your application....you are the only one who can make the application.....no-one else can do it.
Gwapito made a mistake.....do not get confused......continue on the path you're on.

[grahamw48]

Unbelievable the hassle and intrusion that all the scumbag liars and overstayers in recent years have caused for ordinary decent Filipinos wanting a holiday here. :NoNo:

Personally I'd be inclined to send the in-laws some airtickets to the Phils, invest your time and money in your business and lives there, and stick two fingers up at the UKBA until you decide to put your affairs in order to be able to apply for a settlement visa sometime in the future. :cwm25:

Thank goodness the Phils BI haven't adopted 'reciprocal arrangements' !

[anvee]

Don't be confused Juvee...you are right, it's your application in your name only..sorry :doh.....I've not long woken

This is what happened with my mother in law....but, it was me filling our the application form for her from start to finish here in UK with the help of a Visa solicitor.

The ECO should of considered your in law's documents as they would of been the backbone of your Visa application :NoNo:

Goodness :NoNo::doh:doh I've read your refusal letter again...you got to appeal againt this travesty Juvee

Haha thats funny, its okay! youre forgiven but you made me worried!!!!!

Anyways, Im glad that you are now agreeing with me, ECO should consider parents-in-laws documents as much as they considered Andrew's! because they are both my sponsors in the application form! I emailed them already and will wait for 48 hours to see if they reply, and then will email them over and over again until I became pain in their a**!!! hahaha

Unfortunately, applications under family visit visa are not entitled to appeal now! But I dont wanna give up because for me the decision was UNREASONABLE. So I will keep emailing them :cwm23: because I dont wanna spend my husband's hard earned £85 just because their ECO didnt read my 3 page cover letter answering everything that he stated "his concerns" in the refusal letter!

Okay, I have to help my husband chase kittens so we can feed them! BRB

[Terpe]

...you got to appeal againt this travesty Juvee

Appeals are limited only to those I mentioned. Human rights or race discrimination grounds.

[gWaPito]

Unbelievable the hassle and intrusion that all the scumbag liars and overstayers in recent years have caused for ordinary decent Filipinos wanting a holiday here. :NoNo:

Personally I'd be inclined to send the in-laws some airtickets to the Phils, invest your time and money in your business and lives there, and stick two fingers up at the UKBA until you decide to put your affairs in order to be able to apply for a settlement visa sometime in the future. :cwm25:

Thank goodness the Phils BI don't adopt 'reciprocal arrangements' !

It's an idea Juvee:xxgrinning--00xx3:

[gWaPito]

Appeals are limited only to those I mentioned. Human rights or race discrimination grounds.

Sorry Peter, I'm getting all excited here:NoNo::doh......I meant to say, re apply

[anvee]

Unbelievable the hassle and intrusion that all the scumbag liars and overstayers in recent years have caused for ordinary decent Filipinos wanting a holiday here. :NoNo:

Personally I'd be inclined to send the in-laws some airtickets to the Phils, invest your time and money in your business and lives there, and stick two fingers up at the UKBA until you decide to put your affairs in order to be able to apply for a settlement visa sometime in the future. :cwm25:

Thank goodness the Phils BI haven't adopted 'reciprocal arrangements' !

We would like for my in-laws to be here as well, maybe in the future! But the reason why we have to go there: not only to visit in laws but to sort out Andrew's stuff so he can send them over in the Philippines (his equipments and work tools). He just left there without sorting everything out as he just wanted to visit me and not overstay here for months (dont worry he renews his visa every 2 months :icon_lol:) So even if my in laws are here, Andrew will still have to come back and he doesnt wanna come back without me! My poor asawa! He keeps saying "we're already married and we're supposed to do things together!" thats why I love him so much haha. He thinks it'll be easier if I could help him pack things here and there and help him sell some of his things he wants to get rid of because he cant do it alone!

I dont think we're gonna apply for settlement, my husband doesnt wanna live in the UK anymore :) So, we're just gonna enjoy sunshine and live happily as much as we can!

[gWaPito]

Juvee, your understanding is correct. It is your application....you are the only one who can make the application.....no-one else can do it.
Gwapito made a mistake.....do not get confused......continue on the path you're on.
Apoligies Peter.....too many cooks here...especially the odd bad cook like me...I'll shut my mouth now:icon_sorry::doh

Good Luck ya all :Wave::heartshape1:

[Terpe]

...I dont think we're gonna apply for settlement, my husband doesnt wanna live in the UK anymore :) So, we're just gonna enjoy sunshine and live happily as much as we can!

That's my plan too......coming sooooooooooon :Jump:

[gWaPito]

Haha thats funny, its okay! youre forgiven but you made me worried!!!!!

Anyways, Im glad that you are now agreeing with me, ECO should consider parents-in-laws documents as much as they considered Andrew's! because they are both my sponsors in the application form! I emailed them already and will wait for 48 hours to see if they reply, and then will email them over and over again until I became pain in their a**!!! hahaha

Unfortunately, applications under family visit visa are not entitled to appeal now! But I dont wanna give up because for me the decision was UNREASONABLE. So I will keep emailing them :cwm23: because I dont wanna spend my husband's hard earned £85 just because their ECO didnt read my 3 page cover letter answering everything that he stated "his concerns" in the refusal letter!

Okay, I have to help my husband chase kittens so we can feed them! BRB


:laugher:

[anvee]

Haha we should all get together like have a filipinouk forum members reunion! would be nice to get together like once a year or something, so we can talk about experiences!

[Michael Parnham]

'Wow' Juvee, what bad luck, the main thing is try to remain composed and very carefully compile your reapplication. You have quite a challenge ahead and I will observe your procedure with great interest and as Terpe said "Go get em" Juvee, follow what he has explained and hopefully success will follow, good luck! :xxgrinning--00xx3:

[anvee]

'Wow' Juvee, what bad luck, the main thing is try to remain composed and very carefully compile your reapplication. You have quite a challenge ahead and I will observe your procedure with great interest and as Terpe said "Go get em" Juvee, follow what he has explained and hopefully success will follow, good luck!

Thank you Michael! Im just glad I have you guys on my back! And here I am wanting to be a diplomat during my college days! Hahaha I guess I know now why I didnt! I would just hate myself!

[Plonker]

I think someone at UK immigration has got there wires crossed, the letter states you are visiting your husbands family in the UK for 6 months, but the the letter reads on "I am not satisfied that you currently would not meet the financial requirement of a UK settlement application" you are not acquiring a visa for settlement only a 6 month visiting visa right! I think you can dispute this... it's their error not yours.

Also if you have sales of assets like bike/car etc then it would be a good idea to put that money in the bank and show it on the bank statement, which should correspond to the date of the sale. If you haven't done this already.

Also state that you guys will be staying with your husbands family in their house. If this is the case £4k goes along way. If you were to rent then £4k probably isn't enough for 6 months for 2 people. You don't need to supply deeds of your parents inlaws house. I think showing their council taxes, gas and electric, phone, internet bills would be better as they can cross reference this with the local council and service companies to show that everything is legit.

One last suggestion, depending how close your inlaws are with their son, maybe they can transfer X amount say £8k to your husbands account (assuming he still has a UK bank account) wait a couple of months, apply again. Then when you get to UK transfer the money back. If immigration asks where the money has come from, say the truth from my inlaws. Then they'd have no objections to it, as it's impossible to magic £8k out of thin air. Which shows your intentions are for real. But your parents inlaw must show a bank statement that money went out and your husbands statement must show it was received, the transaction numbers must match up.

Good luck.

[anvee]

I think someone at UK immigration has got there wires crossed, the letter states you are visiting your husbands family in the UK for 6 months, but the the letter reads on "I am not satisfied that you currently would not meet the financial requirement of a UK settlement application" you are not acquiring a visa for settlement only a 6 month visiting visa right! I think you can dispute this... it's their error not yours.

Also if you have sales of assets like bike/car etc then it would be a good idea to put that money in the bank and show it on the bank statement, which should correspond to the date of the sale. If you haven't done this already.

Also state that you guys will be staying with your husbands family in their house. If this is the case £4k goes along way. If you were to rent then £4k probably isn't enough for 6 months for 2 people. You don't need to supply deeds of your parents inlaws house. I think showing their council taxes, gas and electric, phone, internet bills would be better as they can cross reference this with the local council and service companies to show that everything is legit.

One last suggestion, depending how close your inlaws are with their son, maybe they can transfer X amount say £8k to your husbands account (assuming he still has a UK bank account) wait a couple of months, apply again. Then when you get to UK transfer the money back. If immigration asks where the money has come from, say the truth from my inlaws. Then they'd have no objections to it, as it's impossible to magic £8k out of thin air. Which shows your intentions are for real. But your parents inlaw must show a bank statement that money went out and your husbands statement must show it was received, the transaction numbers must match up.

Good luck.

Thank you for the suggestion, we have in laws utility bill on top of title deed. Our deed of sale was proof of our assets now (we are the buyer in the paper and not the seller) so we can prove that we purchased a second hand car and motorbike as our ties in the Philippines.

They know we will be staying in their house if they EVEN read my in laws invitation letter stating that they will provide food and accommodation for me/us.

Yes them transferring will be okay but our target date is December 2013 as it will be Dad's Birthday and it'll be nice for us to see him because they already missed our wedding in the Philippines.


Thank you so much, we will update for anything that might come up.

[gWaPito]

Thank you for the suggestion, we have in laws utility bill on top of title deed. Our deed of sale was proof of our assets now (we are the buyer in the paper and not the seller) so we can prove that we purchased a second hand car and motorbike as our ties in the Philippines.

They know we will be staying in their house if they EVEN read my in laws invitation letter stating that they will provide food and accommodation for me/us.

Yes them transferring will be okay but our target date is December 2013 as it will be Dad's Birthday and it'll be nice for us to see him because they already missed our wedding in the Philippines.


Thank you so much, we will update for anything that might come up.

Hi Juvee....I'm not throwing doubt on your application...Just constructive advice okay:xxgrinning--00xx3:

I don't think for one moment a second hand car and a motorbike will be enough to represent ties in The Philippines :NoNo:.
You will need close family members to go with you to a solicitor and a arrange signed avidavids. This is what I was instructed to do...They will have to convince ECO why you will be coming back home on or before the end of the 6 month Visit Visa......The people doing the avidavids must have a reliabe ID

Your in-laws will be acting as sponsors so they, like me, will have to provide proof that they have to means to look after you both...........I had to provide proof of my income and outgoings in the form of 6 months bank statements and wage slips, just like as if I was applying for the visa myself.

I also had to provide details of my house...the main concern was there was enough room for you all to live under that one roof.....As I said before, I had to get a surveyor to do all that...none of this was cheap :NoNo:
ECO do not cross reference :NoNo: they will act on the information you provide

Bearing in mind I had no complications getting my mother in law here in March 2013..all very straight forward..the costs was still in excess of £700 for a £70 plus Visit Visa :NoNo: not to mention flights.

[anvee]

Hi Juvee....I'm not throwing doubt on your application...Just constructive advice okay:xxgrinning--00xx3:

I don't think for one moment a second hand car and a motorbike will be enough to represent ties in The Philippines :NoNo:.
You will need close family members to go with you to a solicitor and a arrange signed avidavids. This is what I was instructed to do...They will have to convince ECO why you will be coming back home on or before the end of the 6 month Visit Visa......The people doing the avidavids must have a reliabe ID

Your in-laws will be acting as sponsors so they, like me, will have to provide proof that they have to means to look after you both...........I had to provide proof of my income and outgoings in the form of 6 months bank statements and wage slips, just like as if I was applying for the visa myself.

I also had to provide details of my house...the main concern was there was enough room for you all to live under that one roof.....As I said before, I had to get a surveyor to do all that...none of this was cheap :NoNo:
ECO do not cross reference :NoNo: they will act on the information you provide

Bearing in mind I had no complications getting my mother in law here in March 2013..all very straight forward..the costs was still in excess of £700 for a £70 plus Visit Visa :NoNo: not to mention flights.

Wow could be really expensive then! We will wait for the reply of the ECM, the van is in restoration project that my husband is doing, it's still not finished yet (far from it), he needs his tools back in the UK to help him finish our Dodge Ram Van. Even though they're second hand, they have significant amount of value. All in all will be at least £4000.

We shall see what will their reply be, if they explained well why I was denied and not some stupid confusing letter, then I will just have to reapply again and this time do the affidavit from all family members that I can gather! Haha. See if they will reconsider or hopefully overturned the decision, if not... move on and hope for the best for the next application!

Thank you Gwapito

[anvee]

I received a reply now from the GREAT embassy... any opinions, suggestions are welcome!

Dear Ms Perez

Manila Ref: 970198

Thank you for your 2 emails concerning your visa refusal.

Please note that the visa category, Family Visitor does not attract a full right of appeal. Kindly refer to the refusal notice for your limited right of appeal.

You may re-apply anytime in the future ensuring that you have fully addressed all the reasons set out in the refusal notice. Whilst we cannot guarantee that any application would be successful, we can confirm that it would be treated on its individual merits. We would strongly recommend, however, that you refer to the Home Office website to ensure that your application is supported by the required documentary evidence, prior to submitting an application.

Yours sincerely

Ms V Lee
Entry Clearance Assistant
Correspondence Team, Manila Visa Hub
UK Visas and Immigration

Home Office
British Embassy Manila
T: +63 (0) 2 858 2200
F: +63 (0) 2 858 2305
www.ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk

[SimonH]

Morning Juvee,

I'm sure Terpe is the best person to answer this question, but if it were me I'd be starting the response:-

Dear Ms Vee,

Without prejudice I would like this to be treated as a re-submission of the original forms with supporting documentation (as supplied initially).
It would appear from your 'Refusal of Entry Clearance' letter reference MANILA\******* that the supporting documents were not taken into consideration.

Then go onto list the reasons you were refused and the documentation you supplied to contradict these reasons.

However.............. please don't do anything on my say so, wait for Terpe to give you some knowledgeable advice from his experiences.

Chin up :smile:

[sars_notd_virus]

I received a reply now from the GREAT embassy... any opinions, suggestions are welcome!

Dear Ms Perez

Manila Ref: 970198

Thank you for your 2 emails concerning your visa refusal.

Please note that the visa category, Family Visitor does not attract a full right of appeal. Kindly refer to the refusal notice for your limited right of appeal.

You may re-apply anytime in the future ensuring that you have fully addressed all the reasons set out in the refusal notice. Whilst we cannot guarantee that any application would be successful, we can confirm that it would be treated on its individual merits. We would strongly recommend, however, that you refer to the Home Office website to ensure that your application is supported by the required documentary evidence, prior to submitting an application.

Yours sincerely

Ms V Lee
Entry Clearance Assistant
Correspondence Team, Manila Visa Hub
UK Visas and Immigration

Home Office
British Embassy Manila
T: +63 (0) 2 858 2200
F: +63 (0) 2 858 2305
www.ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk

So, are you re-applying or sending off an appeal ?

[anvee]

I emailed them with the subject "Visa Refusal Concern" my email was me asking for explanations about confusing statements in the refusal letter, about "settlement application", "did not submit evidences". It was practically a request for clarifications rather than appeal. We knew that we're not allowed to appeal but it was more like a complaint letter saying they ignored some of my documents that should be taken into consideration. At the end of my email, I even said that once they've explained why they said some of the things that I think seemed wrong, then I will move on and accept the decision whole heartedly.

I cant appeal because I applied for Family Visit Visa already. I would probably re-apply after they've explained fully the "most confusing letter" I have ever read.

[anvee]

Morning Juvee,

I'm sure Terpe is the best person to answer this question, but if it were me I'd be starting the response:-

Dear Ms Vee,

Without prejudice I would like this to be treated as a re-submission of the original forms with supporting documentation (as supplied initially).
It would appear from your 'Refusal of Entry Clearance' letter reference MANILA\******* that the supporting documents were not taken into consideration.

Then go onto list the reasons you were refused and the documentation you supplied to contradict these reasons.

However.............. please don't do anything on my say so, wait for Terpe to give you some knowledgeable advise from his experiences.

Chin up :smile:

I already did that on my first 2 emails but they didn't seem to READ those AGAIN! (Im not even surprised) :thumbsdown:

Thats what their reply was. Pretty generic if you ask me. My husband was even furious after he read that and he also emailed them today say how unprofessionally they are dealing with complaints. He even emphasized that it was a complaint email and not appeal email. Asking only to clarify the raised concerns I stated.

We will wait for their reply again. We will let you know. Husband is disgusted by their customer service!

[Michael Parnham]

Wow! At least things are beginning to move Juvee!:xxgrinning--00xx3:

[anvee]

Wow! At least things are beginning to move Juvee!:xxgrinning--00xx3:


Thank you! Like I said I will be their pain their bum!!!! My parents in law don't know the decision yet because they're out camping and wont be back til weekend! And then they will feel my Mum-in-law's wrath, oohhh she is pretty scaryyyyy

[Dedworth]

What a shambles this outfit are it sounds like you are emailing a robot.

It might be an idea to get your husband and / or inlaws to forward this correspondence to their Members of Parliament. They should ask the MP to demand some speedy action to resolve the situation and also question why UK taxpayers money is being wasted employing muppets in Manila who quite clearly are unable to correctly handle applications and subsequent follow up correspondence .

[anvee]

What a shambles this outfit are it sounds like you are emailing a robot.

It might be an idea to get your husband and / or inlaws to forward this correspondence to their Members of Parliament. They should ask the MP to demand some speedy action to resolve the situation and also question why UK taxpayers money is being wasted employing muppets in Manila who quite clearly are unable to correctly handle applications and subsequent follow up correspondence .

Couldn't agree more. I have a feeling my mother in law would really do that... she's quite vicious when things dont go her way! hahaha. Why would they hire someone who cant handle such important matters like visas. My husband said that if our concerns / complaints weren't handled properly, he will continue to move up the hierarchy until this is taken seriously.

[Dedworth]

Couldn't agree more. I have a feeling my mother in law would really do that... she's quite vicious when things dont go her way! hahaha. Why would they hire someone who cant handle such important matters like visas. My husband said that if our concerns / complaints weren't handled properly, he will continue to move up the hierarchy until this is taken seriously.

I'd ramp up the pressure now to avoid any further delay and push these inept people into action

[anvee]

I'd ramp up the pressure now to avoid any further delay and push these inept people into action

Thats the plan, hopefully we get something done this week. I don't want other people to experience what we did, if they don't get sorted out with their treatment to us then more people will be treated unfairly. Good luck to us! Thank you Dedworth

[joebloggs]

pity appeals are not free anymore, i would ask them why they mention a settlement visa and about your husband doesn't met the financial requirement :NoNo:

i would be careful about transferring money to his account , any large transactions showing on bank statements would need explaining.

[anvee]

There werent any large transactions as he submitted his 6 months bank statement. We're just spending cheaply here in the Philippines. I already asked them from my last 2 emails to them and no answer was given. I even made them bold so they will read it first! Thats why my husband was irritated because we just needed answers from those confusing parts of the letter and they don't give a flying F*** !

[raynaputi]

I'm sorry to hear about your visa refusal. Based from my own experience, you really can't get definite answers and proper response from UKBA. They usually only use the same responses to whatever the inquiry is. Mind you, they didn't even get my correct details whenever they reply to my letters. :thumbsdown: I hope you get a proper response from them next time.

[sars_notd_virus]

- Proof of Ownership of our Dodge Ram Vam B250 with photos
- Proof of Ownership of our Honda XR200 with photos
- Proof of Ownership of our expensive equipments/tools with photos
- Photos of my relationship with Andrew
- Wedding Photos
- My mother and I’s relationship proofs (photos/screenshots)
- Emails/video call logs from my parents-in-law




That's why I included my mother and I's facebook status updates and even our photos to show them that we are very close family as I am her only child and she's a single parent so I included in the cover letter that "I am the only thing she has in the world."

I have read the refusal page 1 post#2..I have no doubts your parents-in-law can support you during stay in the UK but the ECO basically is not satisfied that YOU have any reason to come back the PH after your short visit...

Assets like the ''vehicles'' is not really that much to support you and husband even living in the PH,..its very low value once you sell it given that both of you is also unemployed, savings can easily be spend and its not good to rely on...have you got any land titles(named to you), is your mum living with you and Andrew at the moment (if not do you visit her often) I might be an old school but the'' facebook status updates/ screenshots'' is not enough to prove strong family ties, and reason u should come back to PH after a short stay in the UK.

[Arthur Little]

:sorry-2: also, to read your disappointing news, Juvee ... but, with the ongoing help and advice being given to you by the knowledgeable members here, hopefully the decision of the Embassy can be reversed. :xxgrinning--00xx3:

[sars_notd_virus]

I emailed them with the subject "Visa Refusal Concern" my email was me asking for explanations about confusing statements in the refusal letter, about "settlement application", "did not submit evidences". It was practically a request for clarifications rather than appeal. We knew that we're not allowed to appeal but it was more like a complaint letter saying they ignored some of my documents that should be taken into consideration. At the end of my email, I even said that once they've explained why they said some of the things that I think seemed wrong, then I will move on and accept the decision whole heartedly.

I cant appeal because I applied for Family Visit Visa already. I would probably re-apply after they've explained fully the "most confusing letter" I have ever read.

good luck and hope you get a good explanations with them soon.
I can only suggest that when you re-apply for a short visit make it really a short one like 3months, if your only purpose is to visit your parents in law and for Andrew to get his ''things'' for a planned business in the PH.

[sars_notd_virus]

pity appeals are not free anymore, i would ask them why they mention a settlement visa and about your husband doesn't met the financial requirement :NoNo:

.
yes, we can only guess why they put settlement in the refusal.
maybe because Andrew is ''British Citizen'' and is entitled of all the benefits of Britain whilst Juvee coming with him (as a wife but just to visit) and has no strong ties in the PH to go back to, thinking that the next option is settlement.

[joebloggs]

There werent any large transactions as he submitted his 6 months bank statement.

i meant future transactions, his parents putting money in his account

[anvee]

I have read the refusal page 1 post#2..I have no doubts your parents-in-law can support you during stay in the UK but the ECO basically is not satisfied that YOU have any reason to come back the PH after your short visit...

Assets like the ''vehicles'' is not really that much to support you and husband even living in the PH,..its very low value once you sell it given that both of you is also unemployed, savings can easily be spend and its not good to rely on...have you got any land titles(named to you), is your mum living with you and Andrew at the moment (if not do you visit her often) I might be an old school but the'' facebook status updates/ screenshots'' is not enough to prove strong family ties, and reason u should come back to PH after a short stay in the UK.

I always hear from dad in law that their government is being paranoid about immigration. Never really believed him until now and yes he was right! My mum lives 10 mins from me, we see each other once in a while and talk constantly on facebook (It's more than 135 pages of fb conversation with her since I have been married so didnt really included it). No land titles yet (named after me), so yes thats one of our weakest point, but even if we have land titles that wouldnt really stop us from staying in the UK right? We can sell lands as easy as selling cars/vehicles. Seriously how can we really prove that we will come back, even if one of has a job and eventually was given an employment letter or letter from our boss.. we can always quit the job if we would like to settle in the UK.. and its sickening they had to write in the letter about the "UK Settlement Application" that they were absolutely sure that I will OVERSTAY.

But thank you for your input, you have a point. I would be more than happy to be interviewed aside from the documents I submitted so I can defend them if they had any questions before they made the decision. Oh well, c'est la vie!

[anvee]

:sorry-2: also, to read your disappointing news, Juvee ... but, with the ongoing help and advice being given to you by the knowledgeable members here, hopefully the decision of the Embassy can be reversed. :xxgrinning--00xx3:

thank you so much arthur! My husband and I really do appreciate your advices here, been hugely helpful to us! Thank you all

[anvee]

good luck and hope you get a good explanations with them soon.
I can only suggest that when you re-apply for a short visit make it really a short one like 3months, if your only purpose is to visit your parents in law and for Andrew to get his ''things'' for a planned business in the PH.

Yes thats a good idea, we will see! thats a consideration, maybe they will reconsider if we stay shorter like 3 months. We will have plan B, C etc if we must!!! Nothing will make us give up of me wanting to experience my husband's culture and the awesome fish N chips!!!!!!!

[anvee]

yes, we can only guess why they put settlement in the refusal.
maybe because Andrew is ''British Citizen'' and is entitled of all the benefits of Britain whilst Juvee coming with him (as a wife but just to visit) and has no strong ties in the PH to go back to, thinking that the next option is settlement.

Yes, it is ridiculous that they condemn you are guilty and you have to prove them wrong! its sickening!!!!

[anvee]

i meant future transactions, his parents putting money in his account

Thank you joe! We will take note of that if things come to them sending us money.

[Terpe]

Hi Juvee,
That's a very disappointing response indeed from UKBA

Time for a complaint to:-

Trevor Lewis - Deputy Head of Mission

with copies to:-
Appeals and Correspondence Manager
Entry Clearance Manager
and to Mr Asif Ahmad - British Ambassador to the Philippines

State that you are not making an formal appeal, simply that you are requesting clarification and reconsideration.

State that you believe you the have the right to understand the reasons for the refusal.

That the refusal letter mentions that "..you currently would not meet the financial requirements of a UK settlement application" but that your understanding is that it is not necessary for an application for visit visa to meet the financial requirements of a UK settlement application and you need clarification on that.
Re-state that all documentary support was submitted but seems was not accurately assessed etc etc


Now Juvee,
Let me just share with you that refusal notification letters are often difficult to fully understand. The main reason is that ECO's are instructed to utilise pre-prepared templates using specific phrases and words on which to base their notification response.

As I understand your refusal notification letter, the major issue is that the ECO has concluded imigrant intentions on your part and that you will not return home before your visa expires.

Here's a few suggestions for your further application.

1. Give clear reasons for the visit
2. Give clear reasons supporting the requested duration
3. Provide an outline of visit plans
4. State that your future intentions are to return to the Philippines and build up a business.
5. Prepare carefully crafted and supportable statements showing all compelling ties to the Philippines that outweigh reasons to stay in UK

You major goal is to significantly overcome any presumption of immigrant intentions.

I understand that you believe you already submitted such evidence, but you must improve the clarity and quality of the evidence to convince the ECO.

It's a 'standard' target to include more than a single reason to refuse. The key is to support your claim that you'll return home

[anvee]

Hi Juvee,
That's a very disappointing response indeed from UKBA

Time for a complaint to:-

Trevor Lewis - Deputy Head of Mission

with copies to:-
Appeals and Correspondence Manager
Entry Clearance Manager
and to Mr Asif Ahmad - British Ambassador to the Philippines

State that you are not making an formal appeal, simply that you are requesting clarification and reconsideration.

State that you believe you the have the right to understand the reasons for the refusal.

That the refusal letter mentions that "..you currently would not meet the financial requirements of a UK settlement application" but that your understanding is that it is not necessary for an application for visit visa to meet the financial requirements of a UK settlement application and you need clarification on that.
Re-state that all documentary support was submitted but seems was not accurately assessed etc etc


Now Juvee,
Let me just share with you that refusal notification letters are often difficult to fully understand. The main reason is that ECO's are instructed to utilise pre-prepared templates using specific phrases and words on which to base their notification response.

As I understand your refusal notification letter, the major issue is that the ECO has concluded imigrant intentions on your part and that you will not return home before your visa expires.

Here's a few suggestions for your further application.

1. Give clear reasons for the visit
2. Give clear reasons supporting the requested duration
3. Provide an outline of visit plans
4. State that your future intentions are to return to the Philippines and build up a business.
5. Prepare carefully crafted and supportable statements showing all compelling ties to the Philippines that outweigh reasons to stay in UK

You major goal is to significantly overcome any presumption of immigrant intentions.

I understand that you believe you already submitted such evidence, but you must improve the clarity and quality of the evidence to convince the ECO.

It's a 'standard' target to include more than a single reason to refuse. The key is to support your claim that you'll return home


You are the best Terpe! Thank you so much, we will do what you suggested as well. I guess we have to prove them wrong 1000x for the next application.

I already did 1,2,3.. 4.5. I shall do it more clearly for the next time as I think we didnt convince them enough because of those.

we will update you of anything. Thank you so much again!

[anvee]

Please give us more details regarding the address that we need to send the formal complaints to? Thank you very much.

[SimonH]

Excellent and knowledgeable advice as usual Terpe :xxgrinning--00xx3:

There again, I'm right as well................... I said wait for you in my post #43 :icon_lol:

You'll have to wait for rep as I have to spread the love :heartshape1:

[SimonH]

Please give us more details regarding the address that we need to send the formal complaints to? Thank you very much.


Hi Juvee, I think you'll find these in post #12 :xxgrinning--00xx3:

[anvee]

Hi Juvee, I think you'll find these in post #12 :xxgrinning--00xx3:

Oh yes you were right! Okay thank you :)

[anvee]

Okay so we will wait for the response tomorrow from the visaenquiries, after that if we're not satisfied still.. we will do the formal complaint now and hopefully should be reviewed by them by Monday or Tuesday!

How come Terpe is so experienced about this? Was he in the same position before or something? Regardless, you guys are awesome!:xxgrinning--00xx3:

[raynaputi]

Terpe used to work in the UKBA..:biggrin:

[Terpe]

Terpe used to work in the UKBA..:biggrin:

Doesn't make me any kind of 'expert' though. :NoNo:

I also used to work with Inland Revenue.........never could understand what went on :cwm3:
We used letter templates there as well.

I know a little bit about trains though........Dr Terpe Train :biggrin:

Nobody here :cwm25: asks any questions about railway vehicle suspension and drive systems though

[anvee]

Terpe used to work in the UKBA..:biggrin:

Oh haha now that's funny. But hey his informations and experiences are useful and Im all in to take them!! :)

[anvee]

Doesn't make me any kind of 'expert' though. :NoNo:

I also used to work with Inland Revenue.........never could understand what went on :cwm3:

I know a little bit about trains though........Dr Terpe Train :biggrin:

Nobody here :cwm25: asks any questions about railway vehicle suspension and drive systems though

My husband likes a specific train called Thomas the Tank Engine!

[Dedworth]

I know a little bit about trains though........Dr Terpe Train :biggrin:

Nobody here :cwm25: asks any questions about railway vehicle suspension and drive systems though

http://s0.geograph.org.uk/geophotos/01/11/53/1115310_a26a8c34.jpg

Name that train !

[Terpe]

My husband likes a specific train called Thomas the Tank Engine!

Ah, I'm the fat controller :biggrin:

http://www.drusillas.co.uk/images/user/The_Fat_Controller_and_Thomas.jpg

Might be nice avatar :hubbahubba:

[anvee]

Thank you again everyone! We will have to sleep now as it is past 11pm Philippines time. We will be posting updates again tomorrow hopefully once we received any reply. Good night everyone!

[raynaputi]

Oh haha now that's funny. But hey his informations and experiences are useful and Im all in to take them!! :)

That's why the forum is very lucky to have him for all his knowledge. :xxgrinning--00xx3:

[Terpe]

http://s0.geograph.org.uk/geophotos/01/11/53/1115310_a26a8c34.jpg

Name that train !

Thomas :biggrin:

Looks a bit like a class 01 diesel shunter ............. but not sure :olddude:

Lots of these diesel shunters were equipped with epicyclic gear boxes...always great fun to design (not) :Cuckoo:

[SimonH]

Thomas :biggrin:

Looks a bit like a class 01 diesel shunter ............. but not sure :olddude:


Are you talking about my ex :Erm:

[gWaPito]

pity appeals are not free anymore, i would ask them why they mention a settlement visa and about your husband doesn't met the financial requirement :NoNo:

i would be careful about transferring money to his account , any large transactions showing on bank statements would need explaining.
Juvee hasn't said that her in laws are her sponsor. ....Therefore the application will have to show they have the financial means to support herself in the UK. .too many cooks getting involved here with ideas they haven't tried themselves. ..This could cause great cost and distress to Juvee and Andrew.

Yes, authorities made a mistake by saying settlement instead of visit visa blah blah blah but, applicant still has to show she can stand up while in UK. ....We don't actually know what and how the application was filled out. ...

[gWaPito]

Hi Juvee,
That's a very disappointing response indeed from UKBA

Time for a complaint to:-

Trevor Lewis - Deputy Head of Mission

with copies to:-
Appeals and Correspondence Manager
Entry Clearance Manager
and to Mr Asif Ahmad - British Ambassador to the Philippines

State that you are not making an formal appeal, simply that you are requesting clarification and reconsideration.

State that you believe you the have the right to understand the reasons for the refusal.

That the refusal letter mentions that "..you currently would not meet the financial requirements of a UK settlement application" but that your understanding is that it is not necessary for an application for visit visa to meet the financial requirements of a UK settlement application and you need clarification on that.
Re-state that all documentary support was submitted but seems was not accurately assessed etc etc


Now Juvee,
Let me just share with you that refusal notification letters are often difficult to fully understand. The main reason is that ECO's are instructed to utilise pre-prepared templates using specific phrases and words on which to base their notification response.

As I understand your refusal notification letter, the major issue is that the ECO has concluded imigrant intentions on your part and that you will not return home before your visa expires.

Here's a few suggestions for your further application.

1. Give clear reasons for the visit
2. Give clear reasons supporting the requested duration
3. Provide an outline of visit plans
4. State that your future intentions are to return to the Philippines and build up a business.
5. Prepare carefully crafted and supportable statements showing all compelling ties to the Philippines that outweigh reasons to stay in UK

You major goal is to significantly overcome any presumption of immigrant intentions.

I understand that you believe you already submitted such evidence, but you must improve the clarity and quality of the evidence to convince the ECO.

It's a 'standard' target to include more than a single reason to refuse. The key is to support your claim that you'll return home
You haven't mentioned money. ...she needs to explain and show evidence of adequate funds are available from the in laws as I've already stated. ..flowery empty words won't get them the Visa. ..hard financial facts will.

[Dedworth]

Thomas :biggrin:



it's Diesel - Thomas is on the left :biggrin:

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-QbVha_KuisU/UGN3nGqHaUI/AAAAAAAAOuA/nISUe6azlvg/s400/CallingAllEngines18.jpg


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=miIhbw8KSFY

[Terpe]

You haven't mentioned money. ...she needs to explain and show evidence of adequate funds are available from the in laws as I've already stated. ..flowery empty words won't get them the Visa. ..hard financial facts will.

My post number #4

Mark there are 2 'absolutes'
1. Compelling reasons to return home that outweigh reasons to stay
2. Evidence of financial maintenance and accommodation in the UK with or without assistance from family/friends living in the UK but without resource to public funding or employment.

I believe Juvee understands that but may need help in identifying the best documentary evidence.

[Terpe]

it's Diesel - Thomas is on the left :biggrin:

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-QbVha_KuisU/UGN3nGqHaUI/AAAAAAAAOuA/nISUe6azlvg/s400/CallingAllEngines18.jpg


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=miIhbw8KSFY

Well well, Class 08 Phantom built by British Railways.
Should've known that....especially having attended the Derby Railway Technical Centre so often. Whoops

[raynaputi]

You haven't mentioned money. ...she needs to explain and show evidence of adequate funds are available from the in laws as I've already stated. ..flowery empty words won't get them the Visa. ..hard financial facts will.

On Juvee's post #18, she already mentioned that she submitted her parents-in-law's bank statements along with the other documents. But Juvee needs to show evidences that she'll go back to the Philippines and won't overstay. The ECO wasn't convinced that she will return to the Philippines.

When my uncle applied for a family visit visa early last year to attend our wedding in the UK, Keith and I didn't provide any bank statements. In the application, we provided a letter of sponsorship to accommodate him and shoulder the cost of food/lodging/transpo. We just provided photos of the house & room that he'll be using, my visa details and copies of our passports. My uncle showed his bank statements, his business papers and properties. He also stated that he'll shoulder the flight costs. After 2 weeks, his visa was granted. (Although he wasn't able to go to UK for our wedding because of family emergency that time).

[Terpe]

On Juvee's post #18, she already mentioned that she submitted her parents-in-law's bank statements along with the other documents. But Juvee needs to show evidences that she'll go back to the Philippines and won't overstay. The ECO wasn't convinced that she will return to the Philippines.

Yes :xxgrinning--00xx3:

Only my personal opinion, but I think the ECO was making mention of the inability to comply with the settlement Financial Requirement to support his presumption of immigration intent. Just a thought, but these people like to build up all sorts of threads to their conclusion.
Visa decisions based on discretion always throw up heartbreaking results for genuine applicants.

[gWaPito]

On Juvee's post #18, she already mentioned that she submitted her parents-in-law's bank statements along with the other documents. But Juvee needs to show evidences that she'll go back to the Philippines and won't overstay. The ECO wasn't convinced that she will return to the Philippines.

When my uncle applied for a family visit visa early last year to attend our wedding in the UK, Keith and I didn't provide any bank statements. In the application, we provided a letter of sponsorship to accommodate him and shoulder the cost of food/lodging/transpo. We just provided photos of the house & room that he'll be using, my visa details and copies of our passports. My uncle showed his bank statements, his business papers and properties. He also stated that he'll shoulder the flight costs. After 2 weeks, his visa was granted. (Although he wasn't able to go to UK for our wedding because of family emergency that time).
Yes Rayna but Juvee didn't say who was sponsoring her. ..If it's her unemployed husband then quite possibly those financial docs of the in laws could well have well fell on deaf ears.

In my case, my mother in law was the opposite to your uncle. ..no money no job. .which is why I had to provide what I did.

The housing report was recommended by my solicitor.

Point taken Peter. ...I'm reading this at work. .Apologies

[joebloggs]

One last suggestion, depending how close your inlaws are with their son, maybe they can transfer X amount say £8k to your husbands account (assuming he still has a UK bank account) wait a couple of months, apply again. Then when you get to UK transfer the money back. If immigration asks where the money has come from, say the truth from my inlaws. Then they'd have no objections to it, as it's impossible to magic £8k out of thin air. Which shows your intentions are for real. But your parents inlaw must show a bank statement that money went out and your husbands statement must show it was received, the transaction numbers must match up.

Good luck.


Juvee hasn't said that her in laws are her sponsor. ....Therefore the application will have to show they have the financial means to support herself in the UK. .too many cooks getting involved here with ideas they haven't tried themselves. ..This could cause great cost and distress to Juvee and Andrew.



if they are not sponsoring her , why did she send these documents then :doh



I have submitted these together with my 3 page cover letter explaining important details!


Parents-in-law’s Documents:
- Passports Copies
- Invitation Letter
- Bank Statement
- Title Deed (to prove their ownership of my accommodation)
- Utility Bill

[gWaPito]

if they are not sponsoring her , why did she send these documents then :doh

I've absolutely no idea why. .because she claims she's being supported by her unemployed husband. ..I suggest you read post 2 again. ..There was no mention of her in laws which makes me suspect they are not the sponsors. ...All who was mentioned was husband and Juvee. ...she'll be about soon Joe. ..you'll be able to ask her

[anvee]

On Juvee's post #18, she already mentioned that she submitted her parents-in-law's bank statements along with the other documents. But Juvee needs to show evidences that she'll go back to the Philippines and won't overstay. The ECO wasn't convinced that she will return to the Philippines.

When my uncle applied for a family visit visa early last year to attend our wedding in the UK, Keith and I didn't provide any bank statements. In the application, we provided a letter of sponsorship to accommodate him and shoulder the cost of food/lodging/transpo. We just provided photos of the house & room that he'll be using, my visa details and copies of our passports. My uncle showed his bank statements, his business papers and properties. He also stated that he'll shoulder the flight costs. After 2 weeks, his visa was granted. (Although he wasn't able to go to UK for our wedding because of family emergency that time).

Yes, I showed bank statements and I said I will shoulder my plane ticket through my P100,000 from my savings when I used to work as a virtual assistant as well from what my husband gave to me during the course of our relationship.

I said to my application form that my sponsors were my husband & my parents-in-law. I even mentioned my parents-in-law in section "who will pay for everything if you cant pay for yourself" (something like that) section in the application form, so they should consider their documents as much as they considered Andrew's. I think they're not just convinced that I will come back to the Philippines because of small properties that we have (we're newly-weds, we can't afford the house & lot somewhere even if we want).

[anvee]

Juvee hasn't said that her in laws are her sponsor. ....Therefore the application will have to show they have the financial means to support herself in the UK. .too many cooks getting involved here with ideas they haven't tried themselves. ..This could cause great cost and distress to Juvee and Andrew.

Yes, authorities made a mistake by saying settlement instead of visit visa blah blah blah but, applicant still has to show she can stand up while in UK. ....We don't actually know what and how the application was filled out. ...

My in laws are ONE of the sponsors ie Andrew AND them. I filled up my application with "my husband & my parents-in-law" especially in the financial capability section of the application form.

[anvee]

if they are not sponsoring her , why did she send these documents then :doh

They were sponsoring me, based on the application form, cover letters, invitation letter and letter of support from my husband.

I put in the application form that they will be the one for my accommodation & food, whilst I'll do my plane ticket with my P100,000 savings and then my lil petty cash as well. my husband will have £4k to be able to support us for misc expenses as well as he mentioned he will work part-time whilst in the UK to be able to shoulder some other expenses we might have.

[anvee]

I've absolutely no idea why. .because she claims she's being supported by her unemployed husband. ..I suggest you read post 2 again. ..There was no mention of her in laws which makes me suspect they are not the sponsors. ...All who was mentioned was husband and Juvee. ...she'll be about soon Joe. ..you'll be able to ask her

I only put my "husband" as the one supporting me on monthly basis because I said that my income was "N/A" because I am a fulltime housewife. (this is on the financial section about income as such).

But for the trip to UK (who will sponsor you) this is where my parents-in-law come in. I will post screenshot of my application form so you guys will know what I am talking about. Haha

[anvee]

http://i1316.photobucket.com/albums/t606/eurix16/ScreenShot2013-10-25at090528_zps1fcdd27c.png

[anvee]

It says there #47. "You stated that you are supported by a spouse/family member.. please give details: Supported by my spouse - Andrew ..."

Then

#60: "Who will pay for your travel in the UK?": Myself (based from P100,000 cash savings I got which I answered at #63: "What is the cost to you personally of your stay in the UK?" : Plane Ticket & Pocket Money from P100,000 savings.

#61: "Who will pay for your expenses such as accommodation & food? : Spouse and my Parents-in-law"

So based on this form alone, my husband & my parents in law are technically my sponsors.. that's why they submitted their documents such as bank statements, invitation letter, and utility bills to prove that they can host me.

[gWaPito]

Oh Juvee. ...I really hope it works out for you all. ...you are right. .definitely says that your in law's are sponsoring you. ..although form is different to what I filled out. .mine was consisting of numerous pages and pages.

Fingers crossed over here for you

[anvee]

Thank you gwapito! Thats why we emailed them asking for explanations including why my parents-in-law's documents were not even mentioned or if they even considered it in first place as they werent mentioned in the refusal letter!

[andy222]

They make some crazy decisions at times. You have to look at the case workers as though they are kids and explain everything as simple as you can. Just keep at it and ask them what further evidence they want from you.

[anvee]

They make some crazy decisions at times. You have to look at the case workers as though they are kids and explain everything as simple as you can. Just keep at it and ask them what further evidence they want from you.

will do. thank you very much.

[grahamw48]

They make some crazy decisions at times. You have to look at the case workers as though they are kids and explain everything as simple as you can. Just keep at it and ask them what further evidence they want from you.

Spot-on. :xxgrinning--00xx3:

Personally I wouldn't have put the husband in as a co-sponsor either...only complicates the issue. :cwm25:

[anvee]

Spot-on. :xxgrinning--00xx3:

Personally I wouldn't have put the husband in as a co-sponsor either...only complicates the issue. :cwm25:

Yeah, maybe when we re-apply next time.. best not to tell them everything just what they want to see hahaha.

[grahamw48]

Yeah, maybe when we re-apply next time.. best not to tell them everything just what they want to see hahaha.

EXACTLY....and first think about WHAT that is. :xxgrinning--00xx3:

[anvee]

EXACTLY....and first think about WHAT that is. :xxgrinning--00xx3:

Thank you graham. You guys in this forum have been really helpful.

[Terpe]

Spot-on. :xxgrinning--00xx3:

Personally I wouldn't have put the husband in as a co-sponsor either...only complicates the issue. :cwm25:

I agree.
Might have been a significant contributor to refusal

[robbie bobby]

That's a very good idea :xxgrinning--00xx3::xxgrinning--00xx3::xxgrinning--00xx3::xxgrinning--00xx3::xxgrinning--00xx3::xxgrinning--00xx3:


Yeah, maybe when we re-apply next time.. best not to tell them everything just what they want to see hahaha.

[Michael Parnham]

You've probably given too much information Juvee!:Erm:

[gWaPito]

I agree.
Might have been a significant contributor to refusal

Which is what I suggested in the first place. ...only the ones with means should of been sponsoring. ..perhaps mention of husband clouded the issue. ....These ECOs are not investigators. ..They act on the answers to the questions. ..

[anvee]

First time applicant here, so lesson learned. :)

[gWaPito]

First time applicant here, so lesson learned. :)

Don't take it to heart Juvee :biggrin:...you are not the first this has happened to and you won't be the last. ...chin up :smile:

[anvee]

Don't take it to heart Juvee :biggrin:...you are not the first this has happened to and you won't be the last. ...chin up :smile:

Yes, thank you again. I guess time for plan B - Going to Cyprus! haha

[gWaPito]

Yes, thank you again. I guess time for plan B - Going to Cyprus! haha

Lovely :xxgrinning--00xx3:...climate much better than the UK. ...We took our annual family holidays there 8 years on the trot from 1990...many happy memories :biggrin:

[jhen1230]

Hi Anvee
Sorry for the bother but while reading your posts I have seen that you have written and get a reply from the ECM.
PLEASE CAN YOU GIVE ME AN INFORMATION ABOUT WHO YOU WRITE THE EMAIL TO?

[Terpe]

Hi Anvee
Sorry for the bother but while reading your posts I have seen that you have written and get a reply from the ECM.
PLEASE CAN YOU GIVE ME AN INFORMATION ABOUT WHO YOU WRITE THE EMAIL TO?

Hello jhen, welcome here to Filipino UK :welcomex:

There's a number of ECM's at Manila Hub.
Unless you have a specific name you may just address your communication to 'The ECM'
Or to one of the other managers.
See post #12 for address, e-mail and telephone details

Hope that helps.

[jhen1230]

thank you anvee for the reply.we did email the vfs today and enquire.my husband said that we should give them a chance to explain what is going on before we write to the ECM OR ANY UKVI OFFICERS.
Again;Thank you for your kind reply.It is well appreciated

[Terpe]

thank you anvee for the reply.we did email the vfs today and enquire.my husband said that we should give them a chance to explain what is going on before we write to the ECM OR ANY UKVI OFFICERS.
Again;Thank you for your kind reply.It is well appreciated

Depends why you believe you should contact the ECM.
Did you have a visa refusal?

I would not recommend contacting VFS as they are not immigration advisors by any means. They often get things completely wrong. Just be aware.

[Jentobeharrison]

Anvee,

I wasn't doubting the documentation you and your sponsors submitted.
It's not simply the document itself but importantly what the document states and how the ECO views that in the overall picture of the application.

The reasons given by the ECO can be countered in a subsequent application.
He is driven to refusal by his belief that, in his opinion, your intentions are unclear and he is not convinced that you have sufficient reasons to return.

In principle it would be pointless to appeal.

One option you have is to write to the ECM (Entry Clearance Manager) outlining that you have the opinion that the ECO made an error and failed to review the supporting documents you included in your application. You should clearly request the ECM to reconsider your application.
Also point out that many of those key supporting documents have not been returned and you hope that they were not lost or mislaid during the visa review process leading to the decision to refuse.

There's no guarantee it will work but it's has worked many time in the past.
I'd also suggest writing regular follow ups to the ECM as well as ALL the following:-

Regional Operations Manager
NE Asia/Australasia - International Operations and Visas
UK Border Agency
British Embassy
120 Upper McKinley Road
Taguig City 1634
Metro Manila
Philippines

Tel: +63 (0)2 858 2235
FTN: 8411 2235
Mobile: +63 (0)917 556 8120
Web: www.ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk

Appeals and Correspondence Manager, Manila Visa Hub
NE Asia/Australasia - International Operations and Visas
UK Border Agency
British Embassy
120 Upper McKinley Road
McKinley Hill
Taguig City 1634
Metro Manila, Philippines

Fax: +63 2 8582305
Email: manilvisaenquiries@fco.gov.uk
Web: www.ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk

Trevor Lewis - Deputy Head of Mission
British Embassy Manila
120 Upper McKinley Road
McKinley Hill
Taguig City 1634
Metro Manila, Philippines

Asif Ahmad - British Ambassador to the Philippines
British Embassy Manila
120 Upper McKinley Road
McKinley Hill
Taguig City 1634
Metro Manila, Philippines

You'll need to do this pretty quickly

Also, please do review the refusal and put together another application that can be submitted at a later date depending on responses from the Embassy.

Hi Terpe,

Are these contacts can help my situation?

(Just wondering)

[melovesengland]

I would suggest you to send them an email (Sir Peter provided the infos already) explaining that they might have misunderstood your application from a visit visa to settlement, another point that you have got to address that both of you havent got any intention to stay in the UK permanently since your husband is settled and happy in the philippines. By pointing to them that you have properties in the Philippines and providing invitation letter form your in-laws might help prove that you have no intention to stay permannently in the UK and only coming to visit and will return to the Philippines on or before the visa expires.

All you can do is point to them that you have provided documents that would cover all the reasons they said on the refusal letter. Ask or request for a review of your application and if possible you can address that you want your money back for your visa re-application. Appeal will take donkeys years so better to re-apply.

[sars_notd_virus]

Any updates from Anvee??