Greedy Doctors playing the system

[Dedworth]

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2937218/1-700-shift-doctors-quitting-time-jobs-paid-posts-locums.html#ixzz3QfvMEiix

NHS foreign doctor recruits hit 3,000

http://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/208560/NHS-foreign-doctor-recruits-hit-3-000

What's your take on this farcical situation Joe ? :smile:

[andy222]

I'm sure you would do it if you had the chance Ded. You have to blame the government for not coughing up the money to recruit people on a permanent basis - because otherwise, there would
not be any need for these locums. :wink:

[les_taxi]

Greedy .......s !

[Dedworth]

Like pilots being trained by airlines, student doctors at UK Medical schools should pay a bond which is forfeited if they don't spend x years working full time for the NHS - that might dampen their greed and urge to leg it to Australia - thereby preventing us having to employ second rate 3rd world "Doctors"

[andy222]

I agree, so why don't the government implement it?

[les_taxi]

As if your lot would Andy - I'm afraid that just won't happen whoever is in power :doh

[Dedworth]

The GPs are all getting fat and running their own out of hours and locum companies because of the crackpot 2004 Contracts given to them by Labour

[andy222]

You're straying away from your original post Ded. This is not about GPs. :wink: And if you cut salaries you won't have any doctors over here.

[Dedworth]

You're straying away from your original post Ded. This is not about GPs. :wink: And if you cut salaries you won't have any doctors over here.

You've got a point Andy the thread is hospital locums. But overpaid GP locums (even some flying in from Europe) are plugging gaps when greedy GP's are out on the Golf Course or counting the dividends from their out of hours and locum companies all thanks to the 2004 Contracts

[andy222]

A number of posts on this forum have referred to jealousy. If it was offered to you and you had the qualifications would you take the money? Of course you would. :wink: This government could have changed the Contract 4 and a half years ago but never did.

[Arthur Little]

If it was offered to you and you had the qualifications would you take the money? Of course you would. :wink:

Now many of you here might find what I'm about to say hard to believe ... :anerikke: ... but it's true!

Having never ever actually known what it's like to have a lot of money, had I been medically qualified, top priority for me would be how well I performed as a doctor ... treating the sick and saving lives - not what I earned :nono-1-1: - as long as I'd enough to feed and clothe my family.

[joebloggs]

£1,700-a-shift doctors: They're quitting full-time jobs to take well-paid posts as locums


What's a locum Dedworth ? :cwm25:

So you're telling me a FY1 Doctor who works 16 hrs as a locum is TYPICALLY earning £1,700 a shift ? :laugher::crazy::laugher:

I'll stop :icon_lol: in a bit :icon_lol: it's the way the Mail tells them :laugher:

Oh, it goes on to say that
A & E locum consultants can typically earn £110 an hour for a 16-hour shift, or £1,760. AN A & E CONSULTANT, not just any old doctor !

:biggrin:, I think, if that is true, that's what the agency charges the hospital, it's not what the Consultant gets :doh

Maybe £110 an hour is the going rate. What do solicitors - or other professionals - charge an hour ? :Erm:

What does the Daily Snail Editor earn, Dedworth ? ... oh Dacre got paid £1.85m :yikes: Surely he is not worth the pay of 7 A & E consultants working for an agency or more than 18 who work for the NHS ! :crazy:

Locum work means you can't pick and choose what days and hours you work, you can only work when they need someone ! :doh

And tell me, Dedworth - why do they need to use agencies ?? :cwm25: Maybe it's because they don't employ enough staff to cover 24/7/365 because of the Tory cut backs in funding to the NHS. Just think about how many full-time staff they could employ instead ! :doh

Reminds of the time this gov't made a lot of UBKA case workers redundant with some nice pay offs. Then, when they realised UKBA couldn't cope, they had to employ many of them again :laugher:

[Dedworth]

What's a locum, Dedworth ? :cwm25:

So you're telling me an FY1 Doctor who works 16 hrs as a locum is TYPICALLY earning £1,700 per shift ? :laugher::crazy::laugher:

I'll stop laughing in a bit, :icon_lol: it's the way the Mail tells them :laugher:

Oh, it goes on to say that's
A & E locum consultants can typically earn £110 an hour for a 16-hour shift, or £1,760

AN A & E CONSULTANT, not just any old doctor !

:biggrin:, I think if that is true that's what the agency charges the hospital, it's not what the Consultant gets :doh

Maybe £110 an hour is the going rate. What do solicitors - or other professionals - charge an hour ? :Erm:

What does the Daily Snail Editor earn, Dedworth ?... oh Dacre got paid £1.85m. :yikes: Surely he is not worth the pay of 7 A & E consultants working for an agency or more than 18 who work for the NHS ! :crazy:

Locum work means you can't pick and choose what days and hours you work, you can only work when they need someone ! :doh

And tell me, Dedworth - why do they need to use agencies ? :cwm25: Maybe it's because they don't employ enough staff to cover 24/7/365 because of the Tory cut backs in funding to the NHS. Just think about how many full-time staff they could employ instead ! :doh

Reminds me of the time this gov't made a lot of UBKA case workers redundant with some nice pay offs. Then, when they realised UKBA couldn't cope, they had to employ many of them again :laugher:


Maybe it is because further reform of the NHS is needed - replacement of the barmy 2004 Contracts, bonding of medical students and banning of Doctors having conflicts of interests, i.e. owning private companies that provide locums and out of hours service. I can't see the connection between what Dacre earns and NHS doctors. NHS Management fat cats' earnings maybe !

[andy222]

They have already wasted millions on their reform Ded,
Cameron said:


Discussing his disabled son Ivan, he said: “I am someone who has relied on the NHS and whose family knows more than most just how important it is. Who knows what it is like when you go to hospital night after night with a sick child in your arms knowing that when you get there, there are people who will love that child and care for that child just as if it was their own. How dare they suggest I would ever put that at risk for other people's children. How dare they frighten those who rely on our National Health Service.” Truth: Thanks to him, the NHS is on its .... and even his own brother-in-law says so.

[joebloggs]

Maybe it is because further reform of the NHS is needed - replacement of the barmy 2004 Contracts, bonding of medical students and banning of Doctors having conflicts of interests ie owning private companies that provide locums and out of hours service. I can't see the connection between what Dacre earns and NHS doctors. NHS management fat cats' earnings maybe !

I don't think you understand, Dedworth. There are different types of doctors and grades, and an A & E consultant is pretty high up in the pay scale because of their qualifications, experience and skills.

What's Dacre got to do with it ? If anyone is overpaid, under-skilled and does a worthless job, its him :doh

Well Dedworth, it's not long ago you were sticking up for that Tory :censored: who time-wasted the legislation about dodgy landlords. You stuck for him and his business interests outside Parliament :doh

[Dedworth]

:NEW5: Greedy Doctors Joe we know you'll defend them till the cows come home

How about the man with no shame trough feeder and fat cat extraordinaire - former Labour appointed NHS head "Sir" David Nicholson - what's the steer on him Joe ? - how many nurses and doctors could his obscene wages & expenses pay for ?

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2274699/Sir-David-Nicholson-Man-shame-NHS-chief-presided-worst-hospital-scandal-insists-ashamed-of.html#ixzz3QjQMS31O

[joebloggs]

:icon_lol: Greedy businessmen, politicians, lawyers, etc :NEW5:

At least a doctor does something positive -
unlike the leeches I've just mentioned. You're just jealous, Dedworth! :biggrin:

[Arthur Little]

:NEW5: Greedy Doctors ...

... are those the ones up at the "quack of dawn", by any chance? :Erm:

[joebloggs]

Not just greedy doctors Dedworth, Nurses too!! Does your misses do any agency work, Dedworth? :cwm25:


http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-31135809

[Dedworth]

Not just greedy doctors Dedworth, Nurses too!! Does your misses do any agency work Dedworth? :cwm25:





http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-31135809

Nope NHS Hospital full time - bank there & BUPA

[Dedworth]

More greed :mad:

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2987268/GPs-reject-150-hour-deal-open-Easter-Family-doctors-condemn-offer-say-turn-cash-quadrupled.html#ixzz3UD44G1hh

[Ako Si Jamie]

So they want £2,600 for working three hours? Are they taking the piss?

[SimonH]

Total load of rubbish story :icon_lol:

From the article:-
There are 600 practices in two regions being offered the payments which include the Birmingham, Solihull and the Black Country as well as Arden, Herefordshire and Worcestershire.
But a number of GPs took to the Pulse website to express their disgust at the size of the payments.
One wrote: ‘GPs in England work for such paltry sums it’s embarrassing.’
Another said: ‘Now they’ve established the principle of paying, tell 'em to quadruple it.’
One, a GP partner, a senior doctor in charge of a surgery, said: ‘I do not get out of bed for less than £300 per hour’ – although it was not clear from his tone whether he was joking.


So, out of the 600 practices the Mail have had 3 quotes 1 of which may be a joke and the headline is they won't turn up unless the money is quadrupled :laugher::laugher:

[Dedworth]

3 bad apples too many

[andy222]

Total load of rubbish story :icon_lol:

From the article:-
There are 600 practices in two regions being offered the payments which include the Birmingham, Solihull and the Black Country as well as Arden, Herefordshire and Worcestershire.
But a number of GPs took to the Pulse website to express their disgust at the size of the payments.
One wrote: ‘GPs in England work for such paltry sums it’s embarrassing.’
Another said: ‘Now they’ve established the principle of paying, tell 'em to quadruple it.’
One, a GP partner, a senior doctor in charge of a surgery, said: ‘I do not get out of bed for less than £300 per hour’ – although it was not clear from his tone whether he was joking.


So, out of the 600 practices the Mail have had 3 quotes 1 of which may be a joke and the headline is they won't turn up unless the money is quadrupled :laugher::laugher:

I hope you're not jealous of these professionals earning good money Simon? :wink::biggrin:

[joebloggs]

But a number of GPs have condemned the size of the payments and say they’ll only turn up if the money is 'quadrupled'.



A number Dedworth, what's that number? :cwm25: Don't say the Mail doesn't know :icon_lol:

Who wouldn't mind £150 an hour! :wink: Then in the real world ........




http://www.pulsetoday.co.uk/your-practice/practice-topics/access/gp-practices-to-be-paid-650-to-open-easter-saturday-morning/1/20009401.article?&PageNo=2&SortOrder=dateadded&PageSize=10#comments


So they want £2,600 for working three hours? Are they taking the piss?


:icon_lol: I think the Mail is :biggrin:

[SimonH]

I hope you're not jealous of these professionals earning good money Simon? :wink::biggrin:

Not at all Andy, did you actually read what I wrote :cwm25:

Personally I do not work weekends as a rule but if someone needs me on site I make it quite clear that it'll cost £1K a day, in 20+ years I've only had to work 1 Saturday :biggrin:

[andy222]

Maybe they probably get someone on site for a quarter of that. :biggrin: But in the doctor's case you have to pay the price. :wink:

[Dedworth]

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3008546/3-200-just-one-shift-E-Agency-doctors-cash-NHS-staff-shortages.html#ixzz3VJ0CD6mZ

Laughing all the way to the bank - no doubt the inept NHS Managers who engineer the staff shortages & shift rotas that cause this will pick up nice bonus cheques

[Arthur Little]

Laughing all the way to the bank - no doubt the inept NHS Managers who engineer the staff shortages & shift rotas that cause this will pick up nice bonus cheques

:yeahthat:'s true ... but then my gripe lies with the surfeit of "glorified pen pushers", because IMO, it's actually them who'll be laughing :icon_lol: all the way to the bank ... in marked contrast to the infinitely more deserving, skilled professionals whose shifts they organise. :cwm23:

[joebloggs]

Read more:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3008546/3-200-just-one-shift-E-Agency-doctors-cash-NHS-staff-shortages.html#ixzz3VJ0CD6mZ

Laughing all the way to the bank - no doubt the inept NHS Managers who engineer the staff shortages & shift rotas that cause this will pick up nice bonus cheques

An A & E consultant would be on the maximum of £100k a year after 8 yrs of experience. Roughly what's that a day Dedworth ??
Say 100k /12 months = 8k monthly

8k / say 22 working days a month is £378 a day for say 8 hrs.
They worked 24 hours so that's 3 * £378 = £1,136. Oh don't forget btw, Xmas and New Year. So you would probably want more money for that and they would have to pay tax etc

So £378 / 8 hrs is £47.50 an hour, now I wonder how many lives they would have saved in that 24 hrs Dedworth, and what price do you put on someone's life ?

Can you name another profession which is so highly skilled, where they charge\get paid less than £50 an hour before tax etc ? :Erm:

The Trust probably had no choice but to go to an agency at short notice. Maybe they couldn't find someone else to stand in the same day or next day. Maybe the A & E consultant was ill :cwm25:

Dedworth, my misses use to get calls pretty often from the Trust she worked for (misses put her name on a list of doctors that was willing to do extra work). It's capped. Can't remember the exact figure, I think £30 a hour, and they normally would want her to work the same day or the next day after she had already done or had to do her normal work.

I see the Snail only lists a few cases. Surely if there are many doctors doing locum work costing millions, then why don't they list more cases ???????? :cwm25:

Stop believing the Daily Snail hype, Dedworth. I thought you were smarter than that! :doh

[Arthur Little]

:yeahthat:'s true ... but then my gripe lies with the surfeit of "glorified pen pushers", because IMO, it's actually them who'll be laughing :icon_lol: all the way to the bank ... in marked contrast to the infinitely more deserving, skilled professionals whose shifts they organise. :cwm23:

How do I know this?

Through word of word of mouth ... in the course of a discussion :blahblah::blahblah::blahblah: I once had with a late cousin of mine - latterly a Consultant Paediatrician at Glasgow's Yorkhill Hospital - shortly before he retired.

Apparently, it was the aforementioned bods who arranged the surgical priority lists and it was they who controlled the day to day operating lists according to their discretion ... :anerikke: ... regardless of the personal and professional judgements of the surgeons involved in the care of the patients allocated to them for whatever treatment happened to be required in any given instance. :crazy:!

[grahamw48]

I could do with one to sort out this damned acid reflux and constant hiccupping I've had for the past few days ! :cwm3: hic !

[SimonH]

An A & E consultant would be on the maximum of £100k a year after 8 yrs of experience. Roughly what's that a day Dedworth ??
Say 100k /12 months = 8k monthly

8k / say 22 working days a month is £378 a day for say 8 hrs.
They worked 24 hours so that's 3 * £378 = £1,136. Oh don't forget btw, Xmas and New Year. So you would probably want more money for that and they would have to pay tax etc

So £378 / 8 hrs is £47.50 an hour, now I wonder how many lives they would have saved in that 24 hrs Dedworth, and what price do you put on someone's life ?


Purely speculative and hypothetical :cwm25:

[Dedworth]

Purely speculative and hypothetical :cwm25:

Usual defending NHS gross incompetence & 2004 Contract Doctors greed fantasy land nonsense from Joe :doh

[joebloggs]

Purely speculative and hypothetical :cwm25:


:Erm:



Consultant salaries 2014/2015

Threshold 1, years completed as a consultant 0, £75,249, period before eligibility for next threshold one year

Threshold 2, years completed as a consultant 1, £77,605, period before eligibility for next threshold one year

Threshold 3, years completed as a consultant 2, £79,961, period before eligibility for next threshold one year

Threshold 4, years completed as a consultant 3, £82,318, period before eligibility for next threshold one year

Threshold 5, years completed as a consultant 4, £84,667, period before eligibility for next threshold five years

Threshold 6, years completed as a consultant 9, £90,263, period before eligibility for next threshold five years

Threshold 7, years completed as a consultant 14, £95,860, period before eligibility for next threshold five years

Threshold 8, years completed as a consultant 19, £101,451

so tell me if they earn £100k a year what should they get paid for 24hrs :cwm25:


Usual defending NHS gross incompetence & 2004 Contract Doctors greed fantasy land nonsense from Joe :doh

so why has the snail not listed more cases ?? is that all they could find 3 cases :Erm:

unlike you, your knowledge comes from reading the snail why mine comes from the misses experience of doing locum work :doh

the trusts she works for are well organised, i've seen the spreadsheets with the shifts on that each doctor has to work that the misses gets from the trust, could be 30 or so doctors on that spreadsheet with the times and days they work, so the department is covered 24/7

as i've already told you, and its not printed in the snail because they dont know :censored: well its the snail , if someone is off ill the admin section have a list of doctors in that trust who might be willing to cover for someone who is ill, if no one on the list can cover, then they have no option but to get someone from an agency and pay their price :doh maybe that's a fact because the snail could only find 3 cases :icon_lol:

the only fantasy and nonsense is coming from you and the snail, tell me dedworth what happens where your misses works when someone is ill, does you misses ever get asked to cover for them ? or do they go straight to an agency :wink: