Childs Birth Cert.

[Nathan]

Hi everyone,
My fiancee and i are about to apply for a fiancee visa at the Manila Embassy.
Ive read they require if the applicant has a child the birth cert.
My girlfriend had her son quite young and her parents have raised him for the last 6 years while she lived and worked in the city to support him.
We intend to live here in the UK and marry, she has no intention of bringing her son here. Would she still need to supply a birth certificate for him if its only her that would be travelling?
The reason i ask this, she has a birth cert for him but there appears to be a problem with it. Apparently it states her and the childs father as the married parents. This was a mistake they was never married. They did give the child the fathers surname. Do you think it would be possible to get a replacement Cert without this written on it? Where would we go to get one the NSO?
Or is this unnecessary as the child is not travelling?

I would really appreciate your advice,
Thankyou,
Nathan

[ivor&mel]

Nathan,

Are you absolutely sure they were not married? And if so, how? When did they notice the error in the Birth Certificate? And why did they not get it corrected? How old was she when she registered the birth?

[Nathan]

Hi,
Im sure they weren't married, she tells me so and i believe her also she recently got a certificate from the NSO stating she is single unmarried also it says this in her passport so ive no reason to disbelieve her as i have seen both these documents with my own eyes.
Ive no idea why she did'nt get it corrected i suppose it did'nt seem an issue for her at the time and i havent asked when the birth was registered, do you think this matters? Any advice on what i should do please?
Thanks for your time!
Nathan

[ivor&mel]

I hope someone else will advise you on this because I have no experience of it personally... just expressing some thoughts that come to mind... I don't think the British Embassy would check to see if she really had any kids if she said she had none on the application form? I'm just a little concerned about what might happen in the future if, say, she decided she wanted her son to join you in the UK...

The reason I asked about her age is that you said she was "quite young": just wondering if she was under 18 when she got the Birth Certificate i.e. below the age of marriage.

[ginapeterb]

Nathan,

A very interesting situation ? this situation with incorrect NSO Documentation is quite common in the Philippines, NSO Birth Certificates are always wrong for some reason, your GF can of course ask her local NSO Office to provide her with a shortened form of the corrected entry on SECPA and this will suffice to state that they were not married at the time of the birth.

Should you mention she has a child in any future application for entry clearance ? yes I think you should, then you are not witholding anything, as you are not making an application for the child, then its not an issue, the only thing that may happen, is that an ECO may ask your GF, who is looking after the child, while she comes to UK ? but having said that, Ivor may be right, in that they may not ask about her children, they may go for local checks anyway, just to satisfy themeselves that their is no marriage registered with NSO.

As you are not wanting to bring the child out of the Philippines, there will not be a jurisdictional problem for the Brit Emb to deal with, if there is proof that the couple were not married at the time of the childs birth, and have not subsequently married, then there is not a problem of custody issues to deal with.

There is also not a problem of visitation and removing the child from the Philippines either, so I would not worry too much about this, my suggestion is to go ahead with your GF;s application, if it asks about children, mention that she has one, but the child is accomodated with her parents.

That is all you have to do, I doubt whether this will be an issue for them or you, I hope it works out.

[mrsfrivolity]

When a child's birth is registered, it is by law that the child bears the father's surname. This means, a marriage certificate would have to be produced. UNLESS, the child's parents are not married in which case, the child will automatically bear the mother's surname.

If the unmarried mother wishes her child to carry the biological father's surname, she needs to provide:

*Affidavit of Acknowledgement by the father or;
*Admission of Paternity.

What I'm saying is, the only reason a child's birth certificate will say her parents were married was if she had provided a marriage certificate to say that it is so.

I know this for a fact because this was all explained to my ex-husband when he registered my son's birth and they didn't just take his word that we were married. He had to produce our marriage certificate.

If he hadn't, our son would've been carrying my surname!

But, knowing how incompetent government agecies can be in the PI, it could be one of those stupid mistakes committed by bored and underpaid clerks...

I'm sure if she sees a local attorney aka notary public, she will be given the proper advice she needs to get the document corrected. I would definitely "declare" my child in my visa application just in case, I change my mind and decide that I want my child to join me.

What I can't help asking now is ... are you not bothered at all that she is ready to leave her child behind?

[ivor&mel]

Some interesting points there, Mrs F...

[Pauldo]

When a child's birth is registered, it is by law that the child bears the father's surname. This means, a marriage certificate would have to be produced. UNLESS, the child's parents are not married in which case, the child will automatically bear the mother's surname.........

...........What I can't help asking now is ... are you not bothered at all that she is ready to leave her child behind?

My wife has her fathers surname, even though her mum has never been married. He was American military, and dissappeared when she was eight years old. This proves the inconsistency of rules and regulations in the PI, though that was 30 years ago.

I also find it hard to get my head around the Filipino penchant foir farming their kids out to relatives and neighbours as and when convenient. My wife was raised for several years by her aunty, while her mum was busy working, but then later on her mum was raising the aunties kid for several years, while she was working. They swap and change so often no wonder some of the paperwork gets messed up.

[Nathan]

Thanks guys,
You have all been great in helping me understand the situation a little better.
Im sure somewhere along the line there has been a mistake made with this birth cert.
As for me not being bothered at all about my GF leaving her son behind, of course i was, in fact when i first learned about her situation i was quite horrified that this could happen.
But of course this is a different culture they dont get free housing and free money from the government in the Philippines when they have a baby correct me if im wrong. She had her son under the age of 18, we all make mistakes although i know she dosent see it that way she loves her son enormously and misses him dearly. But what was she to do her parents did'nt have enough to feed another mouth so she did what she had to and left her son to be raised by her parents.
Look i found it difficult to comprehend at first but ive come to exept it, thats what we must do in a cross culture relationship exept each others backgrounds and cultures. Sorry im rambling just wanted to stick up for my GF i thinks shes made the best of a bad situation, her son has a happy life and is well looked after.
Thanks once again everybody
Nathan

[mrsfrivolity]

...she loves her son enormously and misses him dearly....

All the more for her to bring her son with her because believe me, the missing her child bit will get worse esp when she realizes he's not a bus-ride away from her anymore.

Ginapeterb and I were talking about a topic similar to this last Saturday and I said, my first year here in the UK was absolutely horrible for me. I hated the weather, I hated the fact that I didn't have friends, I couldn't drive, couldn't go anywhere, didn't have any money. If I didn't have my son Gav, I would've packed my bags and bogged off. If he had been left in Manila, I would've had a reason to go back. If I had gone back, I wouldn't have married Bill.

Gav settled in really well being a child and he was very happy. I couldn't take that away from him so I coped and eventually, I adjusted. Sometimes, one needs all the motivation they can get to stay in an alien place and mine was knowing Gavin is going to be very happy here. It's not just about me after all, it's a marriage that includes him.