Arthur Little

[Arthur Little]

My name is Arthur Little. I am a 64-year-old widower residing in Perth, Scotland. I've recently returned home following a marvellous 3-weeks' vacation near Tagum, Davao del Norte, Mindanao, the sole purpose of which had been to meet - and court - a wonderful Filipina lady called Myrna with whom I'd been corresponding on a daily basis for almost 12 months.

As it happens, Myrna too, had been married and widowed many years before and, during the period I spent in her homeland, each of us more than lived up to the other's expectations. Indeed, our feelings for one another grew steadily with every passing day - to the extent that we're now at the stage where we're seriously contemplating spending the remainder of our lives together.

Well, whoever it was that quoted the age-old adage: "The course of true love never did run smoothly" (a character in a Shakespearian tragedy no doubt!) certainly knew what he was talking about. Or so it would seem, because in order to achieve our ultimate objective, we must first negotiate what appears to be a virtual "minefield" of red tape and bureaucracy - on both sides of the globe - before settling in the UK.

At this moment in time, I would venture to add that, despite our both being mature and responsible adults - Myrna having taught in a Government High School for more than 22 years - the odds are heavily stacked against us in terms of the 'Waiting Periods' (not to mention expense) entailed in processing the necessary Fiancee and/or Spousal Visas, with no firm guarantee of either being granted.

Which is why she and I (at my suggestion) have opted to apply for the infinitely more affordable Tourist version - £65 as opposed to £500 for each of the other two.

I mean, I can appreciate the logic in imposing hefty fees as a deterrent measure against illegal immigration, but surely they needn't be so high as they are for ordinary, decent, law-abiding citizens (of ANY non-EEC country) whose aim is simply to marry and live happily with his or her chosen partner.

It would be most interesting to hear the views of others who find
themselves in this particular situation.

[menchkin]

Hello and welcome to the forum!

[Alan]

Ay me! for aught that I could ever read,
Could ever hear by tale or history,
The course of true love never did run smooth;
But either it was different in blood—

Lysander - A Midsummer Night's Dream - Act 1 Scene 1

Welcome to the forum Arthur.

Al.

[jbt]

hi arthur,

welcome to the forum and all the best to you and myrna...

[aromulus]

Which is why she and I (at my suggestion) have opted to apply for the infinitely more affordable Tourist version - £65 as opposed to £500 for each of the other two.
.

Welcome aboard....

Now let me digest this paragraph of yours.......

You both are looking to get married and are trying to get out from applying for the proper Fiancee/Spouse visas..... By getting the Tourist version.....

I well understand your motives, like many others on the forum will, but am afraid it isn't the correct course of action.....
I strongly recommend, for marriage purpose, to apply for one of the other 2 options.....
Do not play around with the rules and do not try to fool the ECO at the Embassy, if found out, you can kiss any further visas goodbye..... You might even make other applicants life that little more difficult....

Besides I suspect that this site is monitored by the various officials, and if you posted your real name and surname the red flags will already be up......

Again welcome, this site is a wealth of information, use the search facility if you looking for anything in particular and you will find answers to most of your eventual questions.

[IanB]

Welcome. you have probably realised that immigrants are under attack from all parties in the UK. This means that people like us who want to marry overseas citizens suffer. Don't expect any politician to dare to stand up for your rights!

If you intend to get married then you will have to apply for the fiance or marriage visa. If not then you will have to apply for a visitors visa. Contrary to what you say, visitors visas are harder to get as your gf must PROVE that she will go home after the visit.

Good luck and welcome to this forum!

[vbkelly]

My name is Arthur Little. I am a 64-year-old widower residing in Perth, Scotland. I've recently returned home following a marvellous 3-weeks' vacation near Tagum, Davao del Norte, Mindanao, the sole purpose of which had been to meet - and court - a wonderful Filipina lady called Myrna with whom I'd been corresponding on a daily basis for almost 12 months.

As it happens, Myrna too, had been married and widowed many years before and, during the period I spent in her homeland, each of us more than lived up to the other's expectations. Indeed, our feelings for one another grew steadily with every passing day - to the extent that we're now at the stage where we're seriously contemplating spending the remainder of our lives together.

Well, whoever it was that quoted the age-old adage: "The course of true love never did run smoothly" (a character in a Shakespearian tragedy no doubt!) certainly knew what he was talking about. Or so it would seem, because in order to achieve our ultimate objective, we must first negotiate what appears to be a virtual "minefield" of red tape and bureaucracy - on both sides of the globe - before settling in the UK.

At this moment in time, I would venture to add that, despite our both being mature and responsible adults - Myrna having taught in a Government High School for more than 22 years - the odds are heavily stacked against us in terms of the 'Waiting Periods' (not to mention expense) entailed in processing the necessary Fiancee and/or Spousal Visas, with no firm guarantee of either being granted.

Which is why she and I (at my suggestion) have opted to apply for the infinitely more affordable Tourist version - £65 as opposed to £500 for each of the other two.

I mean, I can appreciate the logic in imposing hefty fees as a deterrent measure against illegal immigration, but surely they needn't be so high as they are for ordinary, decent, law-abiding citizens (of ANY non-EEC country) whose aim is simply to marry and live happily with his or her chosen partner.

It would be most interesting to hear the views of others who find
themselves in this particular situation.

welcome arthur little we're glad you enjoyed your holiday in the philippines with your gf.

[aug06_2006]

Hello Arthur welcome to the forum

[Ann07]

Hi Arthur welcome to the forum

All the best for you and Myrna.

[IainBusby]

My name is Arthur Little. I am a 64-year-old widower residing in Perth, Scotland. I've recently returned home following a marvellous 3-weeks' vacation near Tagum, Davao del Norte, Mindanao, the sole purpose of which had been to meet - and court - a wonderful Filipina lady called Myrna with whom I'd been corresponding on a daily basis for almost 12 months.

As it happens, Myrna too, had been married and widowed many years before and, during the period I spent in her homeland, each of us more than lived up to the other's expectations. Indeed, our feelings for one another grew steadily with every passing day - to the extent that we're now at the stage where we're seriously contemplating spending the remainder of our lives together.

Well, whoever it was that quoted the age-old adage: "The course of true love never did run smoothly" (a character in a Shakespearian tragedy no doubt!) certainly knew what he was talking about. Or so it would seem, because in order to achieve our ultimate objective, we must first negotiate what appears to be a virtual "minefield" of red tape and bureaucracy - on both sides of the globe - before settling in the UK.

At this moment in time, I would venture to add that, despite our both being mature and responsible adults - Myrna having taught in a Government High School for more than 22 years - the odds are heavily stacked against us in terms of the 'Waiting Periods' (not to mention expense) entailed in processing the necessary Fiancee and/or Spousal Visas, with no firm guarantee of either being granted.

Which is why she and I (at my suggestion) have opted to apply for the infinitely more affordable Tourist version - £65 as opposed to £500 for each of the other two.

I mean, I can appreciate the logic in imposing hefty fees as a deterrent measure against illegal immigration, but surely they needn't be so high as they are for ordinary, decent, law-abiding citizens (of ANY non-EEC country) whose aim is simply to marry and live happily with his or her chosen partner.

It would be most interesting to hear the views of others who find
themselves in this particular situation.

Welcome aboard....

Now let me digest this paragraph of yours.......

You both are looking to get married and are trying to get out from applying for the proper Fiancee/Spouse visas..... By getting the Tourist version.....

I well understand your motives, like many others on the forum will, but am afraid it isn't the correct course of action.....
I strongly recommend, for marriage purpose, to apply for one of the other 2 options.....
Do not play around with the rules and do not try to fool the ECO at the Embassy, if found out, you can kiss any further visas goodbye..... You might even make other applicants life that little more difficult....

Besides I suspect that this site is monitored by the various officials, and if you posted your real name and surname the red flags will already be up......

Again welcome, this site is a wealth of information, use the search facility if you looking for anything in particular and you will find answers to most of your eventual questions.

Welcome to the forum Arthur,
Like Dom says, there's no way round it and trying to circumvent the rules could land you in a lot of trouble in the future. Besides, visit visas are very hard to get and require much stronger evidence to prove that she is likely return to the Philippines when her visa expires. If you did manage to bring her here on a visit visa, you wouldn't be allowed to get married and she would have to return to the Philippines eventually and apply for either a settlement (spouse) visa or a fiancee visa.

If she was granted a visit visa and she failed to return when it expired, she would be forever looking over her shoulder or waiting for a knock on the door from the UKBA. Once caught and returned to the Philippines, she would be banned from obtaining any kind of visa for about 3 or 5 years, I can't remember the exact period.

If you are as you say, "seriously contemplating spending the remainder of our lives together" then the only way to do things is the proper way, no matter how laborious and expensive it is. It only takes a few weeks to get all the correct paperwork together and then up to three months to get the visa. When you talk about "the remainder of our lives", in the grand scheme of things, this is a very short time to wait and when that time over, she'll be here with you, all legal and above board.

Iain.

[keithAngel]

Hi Arthur and welcome your basic choices here are chance your arm with the tourist visa and if your lady gets it make a spontaneous decision to get married in an Anglican Church (still an permissible side stepping of the rules unless i am corrected ) you will still have to satisfy spouse visa rules your other possibilities are to get married in the

Phills

and then apply for the spouse visa valid for two years and then the final "indefinite leave to remain" During the fiance and initial spouse they will be looking to see that you can support your wife (positive bank account and or steady income)as she has no recourse to public funds although in the spouse period she can work.

Looking at your post you are approaching retirement age , not necessarily an obstacle but if you are not comfortably off you will have to be prepared to work at it all a bit harder without further info its hard to say more another option might be retiring to the Phil's

P.S. At least your quote was from a comedy and not a

tragedy

so keep smiling after all she is worth it right!!

[miayela]

Hello Arthur welcome to the forum..

[Ana_may365]

hiya!Arthur,welcome aboard

[PeterB]

Hello Arthur, I'm glad to see that you've joined the forum.

I strongly recommend, for marriage purpose, to apply for one of the other 2 options.....

This is what I've been trying to convince Arthur and Myrna from (almost) their first day together. I thought that I'd succeeded, only to find that, now he's arrived back home, there's been a change of plan. Perhaps I should have a chat with Myrna tomorrow!

Unfortunately, it was Douglas Paterson (Consul, and a fellow Scot) himself who suggested the Visitor Visa route, in a telephone conversation with Arthur!

[joebloggs]

Hi Arthur and welcome your basic choices here are chance your arm with the tourist visa and if your lady gets it make a spontaneous decision to get married in an Anglican Church (still an permissible side stepping of the rules unless i am corrected )

the gov will not be happy , I think that only applies for an Anglican Church in England or Wales, also the church i think has given advice to clergy about this, as some churches have seen big increases in people wanting to get married, they know what's going on

also she will still have to go back to the phils to apply for a spouse visa.

[PeterB]

the gov will not be happy , I think that only applies for an Anglican Church in England or Wales

Indeed, and since Arthur is from Church of Scotland, it won't help him - unless he is prepared to hold the wedding across the border.

also the church i think has given advice to clergy about this, as some churches have seen big increases in people wanting to get married, they know what's going on

Quite, and this 'loophole' is to be closed (at some undecided date) following a court ruling that it is 'unlawful'.

also she will still have to go back to the phils to apply for a spouse visa.

... which I pointed out to Arthur in an email yesterday.

[darren-b]

Hi Arthur and welcome your basic choices here are chance your arm with the tourist visa and if your lady gets it make a spontaneous decision to get married in an Anglican Church (still an permissible side stepping of the rules unless i am corrected ) you will still have to satisfy spouse visa rules

This loophole is still open, but I don't think it's possible to switch from a visitor visa to a spouse visa whilst in the UK so it would mean returning to the Philippines and applying from there.

[aromulus]

This is what I've been trying to convince Arthur and Myrna from (almost) their first day together. I thought that I'd succeeded, only to find that, now he's arrived back home, there's been a change of plan. Perhaps I should have a chat with Myrna tomorrow!

You definitively should have another chat, I reckon.
Some people will try to buck the system, and although unfair and wildly overpriced, it is there for a good reason.

Unfortunately, it was Douglas Paterson (Consul, and a fellow Scot) himself who suggested the Visitor Visa route, in a telephone conversation with Arthur!

I am sure that the consul must have been misquoted or maybe not in possession of all the details.... ie marriage in the UK...

[joebloggs]

This loophole is still open, but I don't think it's possible to switch from a visitor visa to a spouse visa whilst in the UK so it would mean returning to the Philippines and applying from there.

if i remember correctly, the COA was found to be unjust in court, but the gov is considering the judgement, in other words its ignoring the ruling

not sure this loophole is closing, but i think i read that illegal immigrants will not be allowed to wed.

and i think you can try and apply for a spouse visa in the uk, but the gov will leave you in 'legal limbo' for a very long time

[PeterB]

Yes, you can apply for a 'spouse visa' (ILR), while in UK, but the first requirement is that you must have been staying legally in the UK for at least two years!

[darren-b]

Yes, you can apply for a 'spouse visa' (ILR), while in UK, but the first requirement is that you must have been staying legally in the UK for at least two years!

ILR (indefinite leave to remain) has to be applied for whilst in the UK. When most people apply for a 'Spouse visa' it's not ILR.

The issue is actually switching from a visitor visa to any form of settlement visa as part of the rules for being issued with a visitor visa is that you will leave the UK at the end of your visa. If it was easy to switch there would be a lot of people claiming to have changed their intentions whilst in the UK on a visitor visa (a few will be genuine, but most wouldn't be..)

[joebloggs]

that's true, most would be refused if you applied for a visa from the uk,, unless you've just married a EU national who is exercising their treaty rights, might explain why you will see so many failed asylum seekers and other illegal immigrants marrying eu nationals to get a family permit

[aromulus]

that's true, most would be refused if you applied for a visa from the uk,, unless you've just married a EU national who is exercising their treaty rights, might explain why you will see so many failed asylum seekers and other illegal immigrants marrying eu nationals to get a family permit

I see a business opportunity here.........

A few grand cash in hand.....

A couple of quick ......

And goodbye.....

Next................!!!!!


Hope the Mrs realizes I am only kidding...........

[cruisingkerry]

Yup, Arthur Little, seems like there is no quick or easy way to get our loved ones over here to live long and happy lives together.

We have to jump through the hoops and struggle through the red tape and prove huge amounts of cash all in the name of love.

However as was pointed out in a previous post - in the scheme of things a few months is nothing compared to forever. Thats what keeps me going.....

K xx

[keithAngel]

Arthur in his post said they where considering the VV route and if they get it it "could" save £435 there would still be an unavoidable further full price Visas to pay for but it is possible whithin the system its a gamble on getting the first VV pays your money and takes your chances.

In my view as long as you stay within the current rules thats not "bucking the system" but being creative and informed rather like the difference between tax evasion which is a crime and tax avoidance and within the law Im firmly on the side of the little guy if you will excuse the pun Arthur best of luck

[joebloggs]

I see a business opportunity here.........

A few grand cash in hand.....

A couple of quick ......

And goodbye.....

Next................!!!!!


Hope the Mrs realizes I am only kidding...........

i'm sure some eastern European women have done very nicely from it

not in this case, i hope

but from a slightly right of centre website , funny how each of them is a asylum seeker, each fell in love with a non-Irish EU citizen, and each of the got wed, and each got a family permit , call my cynical , but why bother with the spouse visa & work permit route, just get yourself here and get wed

http://www.brusselsjournal.com/node/3457

This ruling came after a lawsuit started by four black men who had sought asylum in Ireland. Their application was rejected by Ireland, but in the meantime each of them had married a non-Irish EU citizen, and wanted to appeal to EU law to obtain a residence permit in Ireland. However, the Irish state ruled that the EU law did not apply because they had not stayed in another EU country before coming to Ireland. However, the European Court of Justice rejected that argument and ruled that the four men should be given a residence permit.

European court is a joke, what's the point of having an elected gov, when its the sprouts are telling elected people what they can and can't do

[andypaul]

the gov will not be happy , I think that only applies for an Anglican Church in England or Wales, also the church i think has given advice to clergy about this, as some churches have seen big increases in people wanting to get married, they know what's going on

also she will still have to go back to the phils to apply for a spouse visa.

From reading the Papers and local news many Churchs have had checks and measures put in place.
Im not sure of all details but weddings have also even been raided by the authorities

[Arthur Little]

My thanks to all contributors who welcomed me into their midst and responded sympathetically to my predicament by giving me the benefit of their advice based on their own experiences. I also include *those whose comments at first glance, smacked of cynicism but, in fact, managed to put a smile on the face of a somewhat trauchled (bedraggled, if you're not a Scotsman) "youngish" (at heart) pensioner. I would hasten to assure *them that, far from trying to 'buck the system', I am merely a decent British citizen who fell in love with an equally respectable lady who, unfortunately, happened to be living at the opposite end of our planet. As a retired public service worker, living on a modest occupational pension of maginally over £6,000 per annum, is it any wonder I opted for the "least expensive" method of bringing my intended to the UK??? ... !!!

As to Government Officials monitoring the site: Let them!!! I've nothing to hide ... (I've even divulged my total earnings, for God's sake; how many people are prepared to do that?) so why should my good lady and myself be penalised when all I'm trying to do is give her the opportunity to sample the realities of life in either the UK status quo, or a potentially independent Scotland. Besides, remarriage is a huge step at my time of life, and I am keen for her to meet my grown-up family first to alleviate their natural apprehension. In other words, I would prefer to shut the stable door BEFORE the horse bolts! Tell me, what's so wrong about exercising caution blended with long-term optimism?

[keithAngel]

European court is a joke, what's the point of having an elected gov, when its the sprouts are telling elected people what they can and can't do

Thats one side of it Joe but on the other its the last chance for justice when your own country perhaps abuses your rights on balance it may counter balance extreme political bias so I would rather have it be stupid somtimes but there when needed.... after all we vote for our euro M.P.s as well *(or not)

[aromulus]

As a retired public service worker, living on a modest occupational pension of maginally over £6,000 per annum, is it any wonder I opted for the "least expensive" method of bringing my intended to the UK??? ... !!!

Och, big man...... Nothing wrong with that if you think you can get away with it....

Only do not build your hopes too much.

I wish you good luck.