divorce

[bttrwrth]

my filipino girlfriend, in the phils at the moment, is going thru annulment, her lawyer told her it could take until at least oct09 to complete, we want to know if she come to uk on fiancee visa and go for divorce in the uk, even though we know it only recognised in uk, could she do this, get married here, while her annulment is going through, and stay here, and when annulment complete it all be ok, is this possible, hope anyone can advise us, many thanks, as we want to be together as we could be wait for very long time for the annlment and then the visa application, hope someone can help us?

[johncar54]

I believe a person needs to be resident in UK before they can get a divorce in the UK courts. A person on a visitors visa would not be resident.

However, if person obtains a divorce in any country I can't see why it should not be legally recognised in any other country. I was divorced in UK and married in Phil !

[KeithD]

It has to be annulled in the Phil.

[johncar54]

It has to be annulled in the Phil.

My sister in law, Pinay, married in Manila, became a USA citizen and was divorced in USA. She is free to marry.

[bttrwrth]

if she came on fiancee visa, get divorced here then marry, but she go back to finalise her annulment in the phils

[johncar54]

if she came on fiancée visa, get divorced here then marry, but she go back to finalise her annulment in the phils

As I said I think she would need to be a resident to get a divorce in UK. Thus, I don't see how your idea could work

[darren-b]

if she came on fiancée visa, get divorced here then marry, but she go back to finalise her annulment in the phils

As I said I think she would need to be a resident to get a divorce in UK. Thus, I don't see how your idea could work

Especially as I don't think a fiancee visa would be granted unless the annulment was almost finalised.

[PeterB]

Hmmm, I thought you had to be available for marriage (ie. single or divorced) in order to get a fiancee visa.

[aromulus]

To the best of my knowledge, she will have to attend several court hearings in person.

Joe, Rob and Peter know more about the subject and will put you on the right path.

[vbkelly]

i don't think the home office grant her a fiancee visa and you need to submit the document of annulment.

[johncar54]

To the best of my knowledge, she will have to attend several court hearings in person.

When I got divorced in UK, neither my wife nor I attended court. So I can't imagine that one needs to.

[KeithD]

I never attended court either, and it cost me less than £100.

In order to annul a Philippine marriage to marry in this country, you would need to go to the High Court, and prove that the initial marriage is not legit.

But she will not get a visa to come here while she is married over there.

[johncar54]

In order to annul a Philippine marriage to marry in this country, you would need to go to the High Court, and prove that the initial marriage is not legit.

As you indicate there is confusion about annulment.

In Phil more often than not its really a divorce. Annulment means that the marriage never took place because of some impediment. In Law it was 'void ab initio' void from the start. For example, that one of the parties was already married, or was under age, or was tricked and did not understand. That is almost never the case. Its a pity that Phil does not call it what it is, divorce.

[aromulus]

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When I got divorced in UK, neither my wife nor I attended court. So I can't imagine that one needs to.

The lady in question is getting her anulment in the Philippines, and not in the UK.

I did get divorced from my welsh ex wife without attending court, and didn't cost me a penny.

But as far as I am aware the rules in Phil are somewhat different if not totally alien to us from the west...

My original comment was based on various posts on this forum, by ladies which are going or been through the process of anulling their marriages.
And most, if not all of them, seem to say that they are required to attend court from time to time, and every time they do, their solicitor gets a few extra bob out of them.
While some others hint that the fast track way involves bulging brown envelopes....

But as I said, some of the other guys are better versed on the subject.

[ginapeterb]

I can see there appears to be some confusion here, and one might think the Philippine family code is ambiguous, obstructive and inconvenient.

Let me set the record straight for johncar54 and anyone else who thinks there might be a quick fix to their rather unfortunate girl's predicament.

Many guys come on this forum over time and ask the same question, hoping that there is a quick fix available, they tend to run roughshod over the laws of the Philippines because in some way or other, it does not suit them.

Sorry to say, you are all going to be dissapointed big time, let me repeat what we have alway said here at the forum.

There is no such thing as a divorce proceeding in the Republic of Philippines - there is not now, there has not been, and there is unlikely to ever be one.

Firstly, let me set the record straight with regard to Philippine citizens who wish to escape inconvenient marriages which were solemnized in the Republic of Philippines.

The focus of the Philippine Family code is one of social cohesion, the break up of marriages is deemed to be devisive and will lead to a breakdown in the fragile society which holds together a rather disjointed and fragmented global moving work force, hence the reason why so many Filipina's are stuck in marriages for a lifetime, even though they have been given permission to live apart from their husband, regardless of who is at fault.

Firstly, the first stage of a breakdown in a relationship solemnized in the Philippines is the LEGAL SEPERATION.

LEGAL SEPERATION and its intended use, under the provisions of the Philippine Family code.

If you can be bothered to read the Philippine family code regarding the obligations and duties of marriage, and by the way, I have ! you will find that Philippine law is different to UK law, in that the husband and wife who are party to the marriage have certain obligations and duties which they must perform, to comply with the Philippine Family code.

1. The Husband and Wife have a duty to live together in a communal environment, and such a situation is known as a community.

2. The Husband is required and it is incumbent on him to provide for his wife and any children, financially, he must also provide suitable accomodation.

3. The Wife may work and purchase things neccessary for the running of the home, but notwitstanding larger small day to day items, she must gain the consent of the husband to purchase any property, furniture or larger items, and may not do so without his consent.

4. She must not under any circumstances commit adultery or have a sexual relationship with a man who is not her husband, if she does so, she runs the risk of being jailed for up to 7 years.

5. The Husband must refrain from concubinage, but to be proven as one who is engaged in concubinage or scandalous conduct, must have 4 witnesses proven to have witnessed him in the act, or maintaining concubines.

These are just some of the laws written into the family code.

If one or more of these rules are broken, the wife or husband, may petition the Regional trial court for a judicial seperation agreement, and if so granted by a Regional trial court judge, the couple may have permission to live seperately, however the marriage will continue, and cannot be dissolved.

A Legal Seperation in the Philippines only grants one of the parties, or the two parties to live seperately and sets out the agreements regarding the children, and the splitting and dividing up of community property to the said marriage.

It does not give one or more of the parties the right to set up in a relationship with another, i.e. a foreigner on internet, or visiting the Philippines, foreigners beware, this person is still married, and the foreigner runs the risk of being convicted of adultery with a married woman.

I specifically have brought this matter up again and again, because some of you guys are running the risk of being arrested in the Philippines, if the aggrieved party, i.e. the Filipino husband takes a dim view of his wife consorting with you the British man.

If he looses face, even after several years they have been seperated, he can legitamately go to the PNP and ask for your arrest.

If you are shortly on your way out to Philippines, BE ADVISED YOU ARE POSSIBLY COMMITTING OFFFENCES - IF YOU ARE CAUGHT, YOU CAN BE PLACED ON THE IMMIGRATION BLACKLIST, AND WILL BE PREVENTED FROM ENTERING THE PHILIPPINES IN THE FUTURE.


LEGAL ANULMENT OF A MARRIAGE SOLEMNIZED IN THE PHILIPPINES.

Filipino citizens, wherever they reside around the world, are subject to the laws of the Philippines, including the Philippine Family code, this does not apply if they have become the naturalized citizen of another country, and do not hold a Filipino Passport.

Filipino citizens, cannot as our questioner asks, come to the UK on a Fiancee visa and obtain a divorce in the UK, that one would have to be residing in the UK for 12 months, in any event, and even if they managed to pull it off, the divorce agreement in a UK court is not valid in the Philippines, for all intents and purposes, that one is still married under Philippine law.

Only the Philippine authorities have the power to annul marriages solemenized between Filipino passport holders.

Again, some think they can come to foreigner countries and obtain foreign divorces, only foreigheners can release Philippine citizens from marriages solemnized in the Philippines, as the foreigner is the one who instigated the foreign divorce i.e. in the UK.

If a British passport holder instigates a divorce in a UK court, even though the Filipina is on a Philippine passport, the divorce is legal both in the UK and the Philippines, under Philippine law, she would be free to re-marry, as she did not instigate the divorce, nor did she attempt to break up the marriage.

ONLY IN THIS RARE CIRCUMSTANCE IS SHE FREE TO RE-MARRY, UNDER PHILIPPINE LAW.

LEGAL ANULMENT FOR THE FILIPINO CITIZEN.


Only the Philippine Authorites through the judicial system can handle a case of this magnitude, it has been said, that if you have the money, things can move quicker, however, the situations which will cause an anulment to go through are time consuming and costly.

The grounds for an Anulment are complex and go through a flow chart of multiple court appearances and psychological evaluations, which can take up to 2 years, as the Philippine court system is slow and cumbersome.

One or more of the parties must be Psychologically incapable of being a party to the marriage, and must be medically proved to be either bonkers, unaware, or unable to discharge the duties of a husband or wife, or unable to have sexual intercourse, and the list of incapacities is as long as your arm.

Only after 3 evaluations, and a number of court appearances, and pre trial hearings, and final hearings, is it possible with the Judge's blessing to receive a positive anulment decision, many have obtained it, its not impossible, but money is often the key to a swift and final conclusion.

The Philippine Government is institutionally against the break up of marriages through the legal anulment process, they say such processes are only as a last resort, they say its devisive and marriage underpins all aspects of Filipino society, it holds the very fabric of life together, and makes for a richer society when couples stay together and work out their differences.

Western divorces are seen to be a quick fix and and easy way out of problems that could be easily resolved by working through the good times and bad, and that many divorces in the West are the result of adulterous relationships and scandalous conducts which have lesivious content.

To Recap, Filipina's who feel trapped in marriages in the Philippines, cannot under any circumstance get around their own laws by coming to the UK and trying to otbin foreign divorces, even if they were lucky enough to pull it off, and its doubtful if they could, they would be committing a number of serious offences, and still remain married under PHILIPPINE LAW, MAKING THEM A BIGAMIST AND THE FOREIGNER THEY SEEK TO MARRY ALSO A BIGAMIST UNDER PHILIPPINE LAW.

There are no easy ready made solutions to the laws of the Philippines which may appear to be inconvenient to your current situation.

[ginapeterb]

Any interested parties who are not satisfied with the last post should point their browsers to this link.
http://filipinaroses.com/showthread.php?t=529

[cheesewiz]

for some other people getting an annulment is easy, for some need to wait a year or more. If you really love each other so much all you can do is to wait and have more patience bec at the beginning you know that she is not free to marry you and annulment proceedings in the Phils is not that easy to get unless you are willing to spend loads of money just to fast track it like my filipina friend that cost her £5000 (lawyers fee and travel to Phils to appear in court) bec the lawyer found out that she is working here in UK

Another thing is if she is lucky to get a fiancee visa and get married here in UK once she's back in Phils her husband in the Phils can sue her of bigamy and bigamy is a criminal offense in our country.

BIGAMY - Criminal offense of having two or more wives or husbands at the same time.

So, just think about it and if you only need to wait for a year better wait than be sorry.

[joebloggs]

Especially as I don't think a fiancee visa would be granted unless the annulment was almost finalised.

your right darren, i think if you can get a letter from the judge or lawyer stating the annulment will be finalised within 6 months, you could be granted a fiancée visa

[simplelife]

Hi bttrrth,

Like your GF my annulment is on going and it took me over two years to finished all the trial hearing. I know its a pain to wait for long process of annulment here in the Philippines. I undertand you and your GF just wanted to be together while waiting for her to be free to marry you.
The possible solution for her at the moment is to apply for a visit visa.


Two years ago, after I filed my petition for annulment, I applied for a visitor visa, I honestly say to the British Embassy whats the purpose of my visit, that we just wanted to be together and to get to know each other more, I even mentioned in my interview that we wanted to be together while waiting for my annulment. I was granted a visitor visa and we live together for few months. I trusted my lawyer that he will do his best to speed up the process while I was away, but the sad thing was nothing happend to my annulment while I was not in the country.
I mean, unless your GF`s lawyer is really reliable its best for her to stay in the Philippines while the annulment is on going so that she can push the people in the court and to speed up the process.

I was adviced before, that idea of marrying my Fiance even I have not got my annulment decision , I did not listen to them as I did not want to violate any rules.

My Fiance told me that we will not do anything to violate the rules, as he did not want me to have a black mark Immigration records, he said that he loves me so much and he is willing to wait and that made me proud of him.

If you really love each other you will wait and will not do anything to jeopardise her future application.

Best wishes to both of you.

[johncar54]

Aromulus , Apologies, I understood, incorrectly, that you meant the court in UK. My wife was single when we met so I have no direct knowledge of the system in Phil.

[aromulus]

Aromulus , Apologies, I understood, incorrectly, that you meant the court in UK. My wife was single when we met so I have no direct knowledge of the system in Phil.

Walay problema.

[aromulus]

Thank you Peter.

[IanB]

Hmmm, I thought you had to be available for marriage (ie. single or divorced) in order to get a fiancee visa.

I was still married when my second wife was granted a fiancee visa, on the grounds that decree absolute with my first wife was imminent. Obviously this does not help any Philippines citizen. As set out very clearly in other posts, anulment is the only way, and anulment is not divorce. I am simply writing to calrify that sometimes it is possible to get a FV even if one party is still married.

[bttrwrth]

thanks everyone,especially simplelife, we will b patient as we luv each other so much, an she stayed here in uk for 4 months on visit visa last year, we communicate daily, we think she will visit again while annulment is on going, hope we doing the right thing?

[simplelife]

Hi bttrwrth,
You`re welcome. I hope your GF`s annulment get sorted out very soon so you can start your new life together permanently. Good luck to both of you.
Cheers!

[ljarvis]

Hello bttrwrth;103730 my advice is to call the british embassy manila and ask about your girlfriends situation ask them if its possible for her to get a fiancee visa whilst her annulment is on the way. i think she can apply the fiancee visa as long as she provide all the legal documents from her lawyer who is incharge of processing the annullement case. she have to fill the uk visa application form very carefully she have to attached a supporting document to convince the british embassy that she is telling the truth and her intention to come to the UK. you have to provide also a letter stating that you are responsible for your girlfriends needs and also let them know that you are aware of her anullement case.

[joebloggs]

the annulment would have to be finalised within 6 months to stand a chance of getting a fiancée visa - the length of a fiancée visa, as it would be near impossible for her to get an extension to stay longer if it was not finalised within the 6 months.

also there could be a problem that the UK gov/ immigration will not recognise certain types of divorce and where you got divorced !.

[jonnijon]

You need to remember that there is no guarantee that an annulment will be decreed.Psychological Incapacity is usually the only grounds for annulment.
We have our annulment just being finalized in the high court after 13 months.

[blessedlady89]

He does not to be a resident of the UK. I know someone who is illegal, divorced her spouse, this was granted, finally got married.
The problem is the divorce is not valid under Phil. law

I believe a person needs to be resident in UK before they can get a divorce in the UK courts. A person on a visitors visa would not be resident.

However, if person obtains a divorce in any country I can't see why it should not be legally recognised in any other country. I was divorced in UK and married in Phil !

[johncar54]

He does not to be a resident of the UK. I know someone who is illegal, divorced her spouse, this was granted, finally got married.

I used 'resident' in the common definition i.e. that is:- where the person lives.

The problem is the divorce is not valid under Phil. law

I cannot comment on that, other than to say, my divorce in UK (from a UK marriage) was valid in Phil.

I would think that if a divorce outside Phil is recognised then all divorces outside Phil should be recognised. After all, it is in effect the same as happens in Phil except that there it is called 'Annument' and the Gov make it difficult for people without substantial funds to to break free from a life which they find unacceptable.

However, from the way the Phil Gov restrict, what would be accepted in most civilised countries, their citizens rights, I am willing to believe almost anything.

Please don't attack me for stating the truth, I am not anti Philippines just pro Filipino !