Wife's UK Settlement VISA Refused - Husband Overdrawn :(

[benjoyce]

Hello all.

My filipina wife's UK Settlement VISA was refused recently after a 5 month wait.

We failed on paragraph 281(v) of the Immigration Rules:

"the parties will be able to maintain themselves and any dependants adaquately without any recourse to public funds;"

The reasons they gave for this were that my bank account is overdrawn and was overdrawn for the 6 month period covered by the bank statements we provided.

As you can imagine we're devastated with the decision. At no time was it ever specified asa requirement that we would need to show credit in my bank account, nor was our financial situation taken in to consideration - that I earn over £50K/year and my wife has savings in excess of $75000, and that she would also remain employed by her family business and continue to receive a salary in the UK.

In hindsight we were very naive not to consider this and since investigating our options we've discovered that by my being overdrawn we didn't stand a chance of having the visa approved.

We have been advised to write a Letter of Consideration to appeal against the decision. We plan to pay off my overdraft and put the account into credit by £2-3000 and submit a bank statement to confirm this.

We are wondering if anyone has done this and had any success? We're skeptical as this course of action, a Letter of Reconsideration, was not mentioned in the official documentation that came with the Refusal, although this action was recommended to us by an adviser at http://www.uk-visa-appeal.co.uk/

We're also considering submitting an Appeal although the timescales and costs are somewhat off-putting. However, friends have told us about similar cases where the Appeal route did work for them and we should go ahead anyway (there's no initial cost so why not, right?)

It's been mentioned that Immigration often look for reasons to refuse a visa and an initial refusal in not uncommon. Again, any thoughts on this?

Our other option (and most likely to succeed) is to re-apply from scratch. With a "fixed" bank account we can not see any reason for the visa to be refused as we "passed" all the other checks.

I am in Manila for 2 weeks; we're going to the British Embassy today to see if they can advise us on anything - although we're not getting our hopes up.

Any advice or recommendations of legal services would be appreciated.

Thanks.

Ben & Liana Joyce

[ginapeterb]

Ben

What you could do now, if you are visiting the BRITISH EMBASSY is to ask the entry clearance officer to look at your application again, put in a covering letter stating the reasons for your being overdrawn at the bank.

If you could get rid of the overdraft and bring your account back into credit, then do so, and submit a letter to his effect, your visa advisor is correct in that, you should issue a letter of re-consideration of your case asap.

Failing this, you should appeal against the decision at the AIAT at Feltham Middelsex as soon as your papers allow, I would imagine you will win your case, also, if you need the services of a good immigration lawyer, I know someone who will probably win this case for you on appeal.

His charges are reasonable, he will take the case, and also instruct a barrister to appear at your hearing, where you have the opportunity to appear personally, I have sat in on an appeal, and find that you have a much better chance of winning when you attend personally, all is not lost, I wish you well, but get that letter of re-consideration in quickly, and ask the ECO to look at your case again, tell them they have missed important information that would affect the outcome of a decision.

Best of Luck.

[joebloggs]

The reasons they gave for this were that my bank account is overdrawn and was overdrawn for the 6 month period covered by the bank statements we provided.

As you can imagine we're devastated with the decision. At no time was it ever specified asa requirement that we would need to show credit in my bank account, nor was our financial situation taken in to consideration - that I earn over £50K/year and my wife has savings in excess of $75000, and that she would also remain employed by her family business and continue to receive a salary in the UK.

the problem is, it doesn't matter what you earn, if your overdrawn and you have nothing left each month to show you can support your wife with out recourse to public funds.

did you send bank statements showing your wife has saving of $75,000 ?

send your new evidence to the ECM asking them to review your visa app, and your probably better off sending your appeal to the british embassy than to AIT.

[bystander09]

Hello all.


The reasons they gave for this were that my bank account is overdrawn and was overdrawn for the 6 month period covered by the bank statements we provided.


Ben & Liana Joyce

Hi Ben,

Sorry to hear about your troubles.. But chin up all is not lost.. Its unusual to hear of a refusal with £50K annual income and the ladies $75K savings etc..

Just how much are you overdrawn?? Most people, me included dip into thier overdrafts on a monthly basis, but clear it down at the end of each month..

You seem to be permanently overdrawn..

[benjoyce]

Hi Pete.

Thank you for your reply.

What you could do now, if you are visiting the BRITISH EMBASSY is to ask the entry clearance officer to look at your application again, put in a covering letter stating the reasons for your being overdrawn at the bank.

Ok. Do you know if they're based at the Embassy or does everything get sent to the UK? Is the application itself processed in the UK? We're going there now to ask them this. We can't submit the letter and supporting documents until early next week as we need to move some money about first.

If you could get rid of the overdraft and bring your account back into credit, then do so, and submit a letter to his effect, your visa advisor is correct in that, you should issue a letter of re-consideration of your case asap.

I think we can do this. We can also submit new payslips showing increased earnings since we applied back in April. My wife can also supply evidence showing she receives a salary from the family business and would not need to make use of public funds - this seemed to be ignored in our application - very frustrating!

Failing this, you should appeal against the decision at the AIAT at Feltham Middelsex as soon as your papers allow, I would imagine you will win your case, also, if you need the services of a good immigration lawyer, I know someone who will probably win this case for you on appeal.

Can we appeal anyway? There's no saying how long the Letter of Re-consideration will take to reach the ECO or be replied to. We have about 25 days left to submit our appeal, during we need to find legal representation - perhaps using your friend - and submit the paperwork.

His charges are reasonable, he will take the case, and also instruct a barrister to appear at your hearing, where you have the opportunity to appear personally, I have sat in on an appeal, and find that you have a much better chance of winning when you attend personally, all is not lost, I wish you well, but get that letter of re-consideration in quickly, and ask the ECO to look at your case again, tell them they have missed important information that would affect the outcome of a decision.

I would definitely appear at the hearing. I agree that they ignored or missed important information that would have strengthened our application.

Would you know if it is wise to send the Letter of Re-consideration AND Appeal at the same time?

Thanks again for your reply. This has given us some hope.

Ben & Liana Joyce

[ginapeterb]

Its up to you which course of advice you take, ultimately, you can get as many opinions as you like at this forum, but the final decision is yours, remember, no one here at this forum is an immigration solicitor, I suggest you pick out the best ingredients and follow your own gut instincts on this one.

Of course you have the right to have your case looked at again, you must go to the embassy and request at the reception for the entry clearance section that the entry clearance manager looks at your case, you have a right to ask for this within 48 hours of a refusal.

If the entry clearance manager looks at your case and then decides to uphold the decision of the entry clearance officer, then you are left with only 1 approach, and that is to file your appeal within 28 days of receiving a notice of refusal.

But I would caution you, to launch your appeal in the UK, and not via the British Embassy, it takes longer for them to send the paperwork through, whereas in UK it has been known to be quicker, you can get in touch with the AIAT at Feltham, and request the paperwork to submit an appeal for consideration in the UK.

The choices are of course yours.

[Arthur Little]

Welcome, Ben.

I am truly sorry to read about the refusal of your wife's Spousal Visa. In the circumstances, all I can suggest is that you try to clear your bank overdraft and follow the advice given to you by others more experienced than myself in such matters. Good Luck to you & Liana in your attempts to resolve the issue, my friend.

[joebloggs]

I
But I would caution you, to launch your appeal in the UK, and not via the British Embassy, it takes longer for them to send the paperwork through, whereas in UK it has been known to be quicker, you can get in touch with the AIAT at Feltham, and request the paperwork to submit an appeal for consideration in the UK.

my understanding is, if you appeal to AIT all they will do is forward it to the embassy - It can take 6 weeks to do that

http://www.ukvisas.gov.uk/en/howtoap...nf19appeals#Q2

If you lodge your appeal at the visa section where you were refused, the Entry Clearance Manager will review your case in view of any new evidence that you have supplied with your appeal form. The refusal decision may be overturned at this stage.

When the visa section at the embassy receives the notice of appeal, the first thing that happens is the original decision will be reviewed. The reviewing officer can reverse the refusal and issue the visa, refer the decision to the Home Office in London or uphold the refusal.

Also, if while awaiting the appeal you submit another application which is successful then you can withdraw the appeal.But remember, if you do apply again you must address every point raised in the refusal, otherwise they will just refuse again.

appeal could take 8 months, and the cost of a lawyer,
re-applying could take 3 months, cost is a new visa fee..

only you can decide what to do, i know nothing ,but always seek legal advice - free or paid for

[ron]

Very sorry to hear of your refusal. Im also applying very soon for my wifes visa and i realise that we must always think what the ECO may be thinking in judging our application. As joe said its now upto you, to decide now. Best of Luck Ron

[IainBusby]

Very sorry to hear of your refusal. Im also applying very soon for my wifes visa and i realise that we must always think what the ECO may be thinking in judging our application. As joe said its now upto you, to decide now. Best of Luck Ron

Very true.

[John@Roselyn]

I am completely baffled by this one..
You state that you are overdrawn, even on a salary of £50k+, and then you state your wife has savings in excess of $75000...
At the risk of stating the blindingly obvious, why on earth didnt you immediately transfer money from your wife's account in to yours?? ( I am assuming of course that your account isn't overdrawn by £46k!!)

After all, as the British sponsor, they are looking at your ability to manage your finances sensibly and support two people on your income. It seems that you had a ready-made solution staring you right in the face.

You could even have channelled the money back to your wife at a few hundred a month via Western Union or bank transfer and built a paper trail of seemingly supporting her. It is difficult for them to say you cant support your wife in the UK if you have already been doing it since you met.


I earn around the same amount and have zero savings...£50k a year is a comfortable and respectable salary, so you must have some serious money problems. I supported my wife, paid everything here, and I travelled to be with my other half five times over six months, on that same salary.
(The latter shows the ECO not only committment but a very good disposable income.Two birds with one stone!)

As an added "boost" to my account when we decided to get married, I sold my car and sold a heap of junk on Ebay, and suffered public transport for 6 months. Being with my beloved takes priority over everything!
Now I can go shopping for a new car on top of all the excitement of my wife joining me. Life is grand. I hope you get things sorted.

[joebloggs]

why on earth didnt you immediately transfer money from your wife's account in to yours?? ( I am assuming of course that your account isn't overdrawn by £46k!!)


suffered public transport for 6 months. Being with my beloved takes priority over everything!

he would need to explain and prove where the money came from in a letter of support for his wife, any large mnoey transfers could look suspicous to the case worker.

as for public transport for 6 months, i've suffered from using it for more than a year and the are on strike tomoz, monday, a week on monday and 2 wks on monday,, to them..

50k is nearly double the average wage, and some people on here successfully got a visa on a lot less than the average wage.

[John@Roselyn]

he would need to explain and prove where the money came from in a letter of support for his wife, any large money transfers could look suspicous to the case worker.

Not if he did it before the 6-months-worth of bank statements. Its all in the planning/juggling!

[inlovebutstuck]

he would need to explain and prove where the money came from in a letter of support for his wife, any large mnoey transfers could look suspicous to the case worker.

as for public transport for 6 months, i've suffered from using it for more than a year and the are on strike tomoz, monday, a week on monday and 2 wks on monday,, to them..

50k is nearly double the average wage, and some people on here successfully got a visa on a lot less than the average wage.

I dont look like i got any chance if this man is on 50k a year and i cant work?
Its not looking good for me

[IainBusby]

The reasons they gave for this were that my bank account is overdrawn and was overdrawn for the 6 month period covered by the bank statements we provided.

I dont look like i got any chance if this man is on 50k a year and i cant work?
Its not looking good for me

You don't need to earn £50k a year to get a visa, you just need to appear to be able to support a wife in the UK financially. To the ECO it looked, on paper at least, as if he was living beyond his means, or he may even have concluded that he was in serious debt, because he appeared to be permenantly overdrawn. It's no good earning £50k a year if your spending £51k a year.
Iain.

[joebloggs]

I dont look like i got any chance if this man is on 50k a year and i cant work?
Its not looking good for me

You don't need to earn £50k a year to get a visa, you just need to appear to be able to support a wife in the UK financially. It's no good earning £50k a year if your spending £51k a year.
Iain.

true Iain
inlovebutstuck, you need members of your family, friends to help you by loaning you as much money as you can get for the next 6 months, after you've got 6 bank statements showing this large amount, then apply for your visa, wait til you have your visa and then pay it back, if not have you got a credit card, transfer as much as you can to your current account, and wait 6 months, when you've got your visa pay it off, but it means your paying interest

any chance of you getting a job, sometimes you'll do more for others when you have to (for your wife and bb) then you will for yourself.

some lucky few have a got a visa for their partner while on benefits and no savings, but many more have been refused.

he that fails to plan, plans to fail

[Ady]

I dont look like i got any chance if this man is on 50k a year and i cant work?
Its not looking good for me

inlovebutstuck - A lot of people have had fiance visas accepted on the average wage and lower (i.e. £25k a year). Personally I am on a lot less than £50k a year, but our visa was accepted last February. So, don't be too down on this.

The key thing here is that the two applicants I have read recently refused have been overdrawn. That raises questions for the ECO - and, in my opinion only, they are looking at each application more with reasons to refuse than to accept. That is my cynical view but, even if I am wrong, it helps you make a stronger application. You have to think at it from the ECO's viewpoint. How would they percieve you bank statements? Do you think your bank statement raises any question? (i.e. being overdrawn in a few cases). If so, answer the potential questions in your covering letter - so it shows that you have considered this too. It can only help.

Good luck to the OP (opening poster!) in any appeal. Reading your story - it sounds like you got a bad draw on the ECO list - someone who is a bit more pedantic than others. Whatever path you choose to take now - good luck, and I am sure you will be successful.

[inlovebutstuck]

Well thanks for the advice here, it really is a great site.. good luck i sure an appeal you will win.

[belfast_dude]

this does scare me....i do not earn 50k a year...my asawa does not have $75000 in the bank.....it makes me think my application will be futile...:(,,,.....

i earn 16-18,000 a year....i do have sevings...£7,500 at the minute and rising...but i do think i will need more.....

i need to prayer more....

[joebloggs]

this does scare me....i do not earn 50k a year...my asawa does not have $75000 in the bank.....it makes me think my application will be futile...:(,,,.....

i earn 16-18,000 a year....i do have sevings...£7,500 at the minute and rising...but i do think i will need more.....

i need to prayer more....

thats enough, what you worrying for
i was made redundant, took the first job i got offered, just a bit more than you, and i had less savings.. got the visa, no problems..

[jaishann]

Hello all.

My filipina wife's UK Settlement VISA was refused recently after a 5 month wait.

We failed on paragraph 281(v) of the Immigration Rules:

"the parties will be able to maintain themselves and any dependants adaquately without any recourse to public funds;"

The reasons they gave for this were that my bank account is overdrawn and was overdrawn for the 6 month period covered by the bank statements we provided.

As you can imagine we're devastated with the decision. At no time was it ever specified asa requirement that we would need to show credit in my bank account, nor was our financial situation taken in to consideration - that I earn over £50K/year and my wife has savings in excess of $75000, and that she would also remain employed by her family business and continue to receive a salary in the UK.

In hindsight we were very naive not to consider this and since investigating our options we've discovered that by my being overdrawn we didn't stand a chance of having the visa approved.

We have been advised to write a Letter of Consideration to appeal against the decision. We plan to pay off my overdraft and put the account into credit by £2-3000 and submit a bank statement to confirm this.

We are wondering if anyone has done this and had any success? We're skeptical as this course of action, a Letter of Reconsideration, was not mentioned in the official documentation that came with the Refusal, although this action was recommended to us by an adviser at http://www.uk-visa-appeal.co.uk/

We're also considering submitting an Appeal although the timescales and costs are somewhat off-putting. However, friends have told us about similar cases where the Appeal route did work for them and we should go ahead anyway (there's no initial cost so why not, right?)

It's been mentioned that Immigration often look for reasons to refuse a visa and an initial refusal in not uncommon. Again, any thoughts on this?

Our other option (and most likely to succeed) is to re-apply from scratch. With a "fixed" bank account we can not see any reason for the visa to be refused as we "passed" all the other checks.

I am in Manila for 2 weeks; we're going to the British Embassy today to see if they can advise us on anything - although we're not getting our hopes up.

Any advice or recommendations of legal services would be appreciated.

Thanks.

Ben & Liana Joyce

Hope all things goes well.