Should I be scared of the NHS??

[keithAngel]

Interestingly from my point of view no-one here has commented that pregnancy and child-birth are NOT an illness

Whilst its great to have check ups to monitor your progress creating a positive birth experience is our own responcability !!

Ive 6 kids plus a stepdaughter and have had a full range of experience of various types of birth and delivered two of them myself one at home with a great doctors active support and another because the also great mid-wife was a little tardy much to our delight.

My 3rd Daughter who was delivered by C section (she was sideways) had her first at home in a birthing pool she rented with a mid-wife and a Doula to support her and has since gone on to train and offer this service to other women.

Of course there are situations were hospital medical interventions are indicated but it doesnt need to be the norm and in my view in countries were this is routinly practiced its more about $$$ than safety women are induced to routinely not interfere with practioners weekends .

Food for thought birth can and should be a beautiful experience

[darren-b]

I wouldn't bet on that...

I wouldn't either..

But if you are talking about the quality of services that can be available through the NHS then that is different story.

Given the choice between the most prestigous hospital in the Philippines and Great Ormond Street Hospital I know where I would prefer my child if they were sick to be treated.

[Doc Alan]

Interestingly from my point of view no-one here has commented that pregnancy and child-birth are NOT an illness

No-one thinks they are
I cannot comment on EVERY single NHS maternity unit but the vast majority of pregnant women are delivered safely under NHS care It's clearly also not ethical to comment on individual cases
Caesarean sections certainly seem to need explaining
They account for 1/5 UK deliveries (probably a higher proportion in the Philippines but accurate figures are not available), and the numbers are increasing, being already more than World Health Organization recommends.
They are performed when there is potential or urgent risk to the mother or baby.
They may be PLANNED (when medical needs become apparent during pregnancy), EMERGENCY (during labour), or ELECTIVE (personal choice) , and would NEVER be refused to save money The main reasons for Caesarean section are : danger to the unborn baby, failure of labour to progress, breech (bottom or feet first presentation) , or mother has had previous Caesarean section.

[RickyR]

Doctors in the UK, the training and the facilities are some of the best in the world. Unfortunately some NHS hospitals have bad reputations, are poorly equipped and have a mix of not so good staff. If you do some searching on google, you can see the scores for hospitals, reviews and see what standards they have against the national benchmark.
Your other option is a private hospital in the UK, and I can assure you that most of the Private hospitals would very much exceed what you'll get from the best hospitals in the Philippines (St Lukes, Manila Doctors Hospital etc). Your treatment would be much less then the cost of going to the Philippines.

As for Great Ormand Street, that is one of the best (if not THE best) childrens hospital in the world with the best facilities money can buy, and the best specialists in the associated fields.

[johncar54]

you do know we have private hospital's here too, you are aware there isn't any real difference but the price?

In 1997 I was diagnosed with cancer. I live in Spain and at that time had private medical insurance. I decided I would prefer to have the op in UK, language no problem, family nearby etc.

When I saw the consultant privately he asked me whether I wanted it done NHS or private. Either way it would be done immediately. He said he would do the op in either case but in a private hosp I would have a room to myself etc. He also said, that if there were any complications doing it in the private hospital, it would be no problem because he could rush me to NHS hospital across the road.

[RickyR]

For private surgery, many of the hospitals are linked to NHS hospitals, and use the same doctors and the same theatres. However the difference tends to be the procedures, equipment and drugs. Some of the more advanced treatments and drugs are only available private.

[Arthur Little]

Some of the more advanced treatments and drugs are only available private.

Not necessarily!! Two years ago, I had occasion to undergo *carotid arterial surgery ... in order to prevent a full-blown stroke, as a result of suffering a couple of Transient Ishaemic Attacks [better known as TIAs - or mini-strokes]. *This operation is well-known to be an extremely delicate procedure ... itself giving rise to all sorts of risks, including the danger of CAUSING the very damage it is designed to lessen and/or myocardial infarction (heart attack) - even death ... and is normally only performed by a "handful" of experienced surgeons in selected Scottish NHS hospitals.

My treatment was carried out at Ninewells Hospital, Dundee. And, following 24 hours of close-monitoring in Intensive Care - during which I was wired-up to numerous tubes and other devices - I was back on my feet the next day, and discharged the day after. Three months later, I attended the Outpatient Clinic at Perth Royal Infirmary, was pronounced fully-fit by the Vascular Specialist who'd operated on me and told I didn't require any further check-ups, so long as I continued taking a nightly concoction of cholesterol-reducing medications in conjunction with aspirin each morning.

I suppose it could be argued that I was one of the 'lucky ones' (and it cannot be denied that I HAD been!). But I very much doubt if the standard of care I received would've been any better had I been treated privately! So hats off to our National Health Service!!!

[Doc Alan]

However the difference tends to be the procedures, equipment and drugs. Some of the more advanced treatments and drugs are only available private.

That's news to me ! I thought surgical operations were all standardized, based on best evidence published in reputable journals and peer-reviewed, then subject to audit of results, whether they are in NHS or private hospitals Likewise I thought most advanced treatments and drugs are only available in NHS hospitals; if drugs are only available privately they are outrageously expensive, relatively new (with side effects as yet unknown), and of limited help in treatment
Not quite sure how this helps reassure a healthy 30 year old in early pregnancy about where she should have her antenatal care and deliver her baby
Unless she wins the lottery, she is best to be reassured, as I have already done that the NHS is safe for the vast majority of healthy mums-to-be [/SIZE]

[Arthur Little]

In certain respects , though, Ricky; there ARE some cancer-treating drugs, for instance, that CAN only be obtained by private means.

[somebody]

you do know we have private hospital's here too, you are aware there isn't any real difference but the price?

From what I understand when the Private Hospitals have an emgency during a routine procedure etc you often end up back in a NHS hospital..

Many NHS hospitals have Private wards from what I have seen so you could pay the extra for a slightly smarter looking ward but of course you would still be using the NHS.

We love to moan about things in the UK but if the goverment of the day said ok we will get rid of see how large the protests would be..

Remeber when the yanks implied the NHS was not a good Idea nearly every form of media in the UK turned into a NHS fan club and quite rightly to..

[keithAngel]

What can be said though is that in 2005 there were

Phillipines 4,600 maternal deaths

UK 51

http://www.childinfo.org/maternal_mo...ountrydata.php

And infant death

Phillipnes 20.56 per 1000

UK 4.8

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of...mortality_rate

[adam&chryss]

i would not have chosen to give birth back home, the treatment i got here is excellent. everybody in the maternity ward was so supportive, i have seen how they deal with women giving birth back in the philippines when my sister in law gave birth to her baby, they tend to give you lots of unnecessary things like the dextrose and oxygen with the NHS it is staightforward you push the baby comes out, you then go have a shower, a sleep and you are off home when things are ok, i would not have it any other way.

I think Maria summed it up brilliantly!
Also as mentioned before pregnancy isnt an illness and is treated as such.
I`m not an expert but i`m led to beleive that the 1st pregnancy is generally the longest and its usual for it to last more than 24hrs.
I know they dont like to perform a CS unless its really necessary as apose to the " too posh to push " scenario!
You`ll be fine so don`t worry ok?

[Arthur Little]

Not quite sure how this helps reassure a healthy 30 year old in early pregnancy about where she should have her antenatal care and deliver her baby

Quite! ... there DOES seem to be a tendency for some threads to stray ... and I can be every bit as "guilty" as the next person in digressing from the main theme at times.

[filipina_owl]

Hi ekks and hello everyone. I find this thread very helpful especially that i am also expecting and due this month. I also have some worries because this is my first baby and will be giving birth here in uk. I just hope and pray that everything will be okay with me and my baby and that the NHS will give me the best healthcare i need. The staff at NHS were very nice, friendly and accommodating so that's a good sign. Well, let's hope for the best ekks and God is in control.

[Arthur Little]

So, ladies ... you can BOTH rest assured, everything will go "swimmingly" ... BELIEVE me!

[Ann07]

I think Maria summed it up brilliantly!
Also as mentioned before pregnancy isnt an illness and is treated as such.
I`m not an expert but i`m led to beleive that the 1st pregnancy is generally the longest and its usual for it to last more than 24hrs.
I know they dont like to perform a CS unless its really necessary as apose to the " too posh to push " scenario!
You`ll be fine so don`t worry ok?

Very true coz it happened to me. I was in labour with our first child more than 24 hrs and just few hrs with our second child

[joebloggs]

[I]
When I saw the consultant privately he asked me whether I wanted it done NHS or private. Either way it would be done immediately. He said he would do the op in either case but in a private hosp I would have a room to myself etc. He also said, that if there were any complications doing it in the private hospital, it would be no problem because he could rush me to NHS hospital across the road.

it would be if he wasn't joking

I never liked the idea of paying anything privately, they'll do things that don't need doing just for the like dentist, pay someone a set wage, so they'll do what needs doing

regarding the phils, when my stepsons g/f gave birth, my misses said they better not perform a CS, for a 19yr old i think the % rate who need a CS is well below 20%, and guess what the hospital said she did needed a CS

and the prices triples ,
and what kind of treatment you get in the phils in many cases depends on your ability to pay for it

[Kju&2]

Hi ekks and hello everyone. I find this thread very helpful especially that i am also expecting and due this month. I also have some worries because this is my first baby and will be giving birth here in uk. I just hope and pray that everything will be okay with me and my baby and that the NHS will give me the best healthcare i need. The staff at NHS were very nice, friendly and accommodating so that's a good sign. Well, let's hope for the best ekks and God is in control.

Hi filipina owl first of all I'm glad that you found this thread useful, being a newbie I was worried that the concerns I had had already been posted before and I thank everyone who has shared their views and experiences and made me feel reassured about giving birth at a NHS hospital.

Secondly congratulations in advance I really hope that you have a very easy and almost painless birthing experience. Please do let me know how it all went for you. I bet you are excited and can't wait to see and hold your new bundle of joy. I've always been told that whatever you go thru during pregnancy and the birth becomes all worth it when you see your baby finally. Are you going to have a boy or girl?

To everybody - thanks again for all your input, I'm so glad I decided to sign up and ask you guys the question that's been niggling on my mind since I found out I was expecting. Now my boyfriend doesn't have to put up with me telling him all the time that I'm scared to give birth here and I want us to go to the Philippines for it Cheers everyone!!

[RickyR]

That's news to me ! I thought surgical operations were all standardized, based on best evidence published in reputable journals and peer-reviewed, then subject to audit of results, whether they are in NHS or private hospitals Likewise I thought most advanced treatments and drugs are only available in NHS hospitals; if drugs are only available privately they are outrageously expensive, relatively new (with side effects as yet unknown), and of limited help in treatment
Not quite sure how this helps reassure a healthy 30 year old in early pregnancy about where she should have her antenatal care and deliver her baby
Unless she wins the lottery, she is best to be reassured, as I have already done that the NHS is safe for the vast majority of healthy mums-to-be [/SIZE]

In an ideal world that would be true, you'd be shocked to see the variation in standards even between different NHS Trusts and Hospitals. Take for instance that you have 60% better chance of survival of a heart attack in Greater London then elsewhere in the UK, partly because of the equipment and specialists that is only available in three hospitals in the UK (all based in London. Anyway, thread drift, my apologies.

Anyway, what it comes down to is that the OP should not fear having a baby on the NHS, you'll recieve excellent care before, during and after the pregnancy, from your local clinics, midwives and the hospital (Marvie, my other half is now 10 weeks pregnant and is receiving packs, DVD's, books, screening, tests, scans, classes etc). You however will have a choice in which hospital for the baby to born in, and you can research that choice and make the decision based on the quality of hospital, accessibility and other factors.
The only thing you might miss by having the baby here, is the support of your family who will be in the Philippines unless you can get visas for them to come here.

[Doc Alan]

Anyway, thread drift, my apologies.

Apologies accepted. 35 years as a doctor here in the UK and the Far East allows me to give informed advice, but you and anyone else are of course free to give your own opinions. I have said enough on this topic already.

[RickyR]

Alan, sorry to keep this thread going on a tangent again, I respect you're experience as a doctor and the NHS, but are you honestly telling me you believe that the NHS offers an unrivaled and standard service in the UK? And that what you get at one NHS hospital in a major city is the same chance as you'll get in another?

[Doc Alan]

I did not say that :omg
I've answered the question posed in the thread

[johncar54]

[I] Originally Posted by johncar54 View Post

When I saw the consultant privately he asked me whether I wanted it done NHS or private. Either way it would be done immediately. He said he would do the op in either case but in a private hosp I would have a room to myself etc. He also said, that if there were any complications doing it in the private hospital, it would be no problem because he could rush me to NHS hospital across the road.

it would be if he wasn't joking

I never liked the idea of paying anything privately, they'll do things that don't need doing just for the like dentist, pay someone a set wage, so they'll do what needs doing

Joebloggs. Whilst I would not disagree that those in private medicine usually not missing a chance to earn, in my case (ten years on, I am now a healthy 70 yr old) the operation saved my life. It was believed by my Spanish specialist to have been growing for about 12 years, which coincided with the UK specialist's view.

And, re his assurance that if anything went wrong I would be rushed to the NHS, that has been confirmed in another post.

[Florge]

congrats Ekks!

my midwife is very helpful.. and to think I am not pregnant yet.. hehehe... just told my GP that we are planning to get pregnant by end of the year and viola! fixed me up with appointments to dietician, midwife, and family planning nurse... now, i've been monitored very closely by my GP and nurses... hahahaha....

relax and enjoy your pregnancy...

[Kju&2]

congrats Ekks!

my midwife is very helpful.. and to think I am not pregnant yet.. hehehe... just told my GP that we are planning to get pregnant by end of the year and viola! fixed me up with appointments to dietician, midwife, and family planning nurse... now, i've been monitored very closely by my GP and nurses... hahahaha....

relax and enjoy your pregnancy...

Thanks Florge Don't forget to take your folic acid!! Only started taking it last week when I found out so I hope it still works for me

[filipina_owl]

it would be if he wasn't joking

I never liked the idea of paying anything privately, they'll do things that don't need doing just for the like dentist, pay someone a set wage, so they'll do what needs doing

regarding the phils, when my stepsons g/f gave birth, my misses said they better not perform a CS, for a 19yr old i think the % rate who need a CS is well below 20%, and guess what the hospital said she did needed a CS

and the prices triples ,
and what kind of treatment you get in the phils in many cases depends on your ability to pay for it

excuse me joebloggs but not all dentists do things that dont need to be done. The fact that i am not like that. I work as a dentist in the philippines for 6 years, i've work in the government and in private clinic after office hours. I have had foreign patients but i never take advantage of them, i do treatments which is needed and necessary and thats that. Maybe some dentist do but not me.

[keithAngel]

excuse me joebloggs but not all dentists do things that dont need to be done. The fact that i am not like that. I work as a dentist in the philippines for 6 years, i've work in the government and in private clinic after office hours. I have had foreign patients but i never take advantage of them, i do treatments which is needed and necessary and thats that. Maybe some dentist do but not me.

I think the NHS dentists may be doing the opposite doing the minimum for the highest band charge and then doing a bit more the next time for the same ,rather than one joined up treatment

[filipina_owl]

Hi filipina owl first of all I'm glad that you found this thread useful, being a newbie I was worried that the concerns I had had already been posted before and I thank everyone who has shared their views and experiences and made me feel reassured about giving birth at a NHS hospital.

Secondly congratulations in advance I really hope that you have a very easy and almost painless birthing experience. Please do let me know how it all went for you. I bet you are excited and can't wait to see and hold your new bundle of joy. I've always been told that whatever you go thru during pregnancy and the birth becomes all worth it when you see your baby finally. Are you going to have a boy or girl?

To everybody - thanks again for all your input, I'm so glad I decided to sign up and ask you guys the question that's been niggling on my mind since I found out I was expecting. Now my boyfriend doesn't have to put up with me telling him all the time that I'm scared to give birth here and I want us to go to the Philippines for it Cheers everyone!!

thanks ekks.. but im not sure though if im going to have an easy birthing experience because my midwife told me last week that my baby might weigh 8pounds and a half. Unless im going to have a cs procedure which is the last thing on my mind...

But in the long run, i dont mind really as long as my baby is safe and healthy, that's all that matters to me. Yes ekks, my husband and i are really looking forward to our baby boy... We're really excited about it... Good luck to us and i hope you will get through with the morning sickness and that you will have a safe delivery and a healthy baby...

[filipina_owl]

I think the NHS dentists may be doing the opposite doing the minimum for the highest band charge and then doing a bit more the next time for the same ,rather than one joined up treatment

yes perhaps some private and government dentists do, but not all. i thought joebloggs was referring to all dentists in general.

[Kju&2]

thanks ekks.. but im not sure though if im going to have an easy birthing experience because my midwife told me last week that my baby might weigh 8pounds and a half. Unless im going to have a cs procedure which is the last thing on my mind...

But in the long run, i dont mind really as long as my baby is safe and healthy, that's all that matters to me. Yes ekks, my husband and i are really looking forward to our baby boy... We're really excited about it... Good luck to us and i hope you will get through with the morning sickness and that you will have a safe delivery and a healthy baby...

wow!! that's one healthy baby boy!!! hey.. would you consider introducing your boy to showbizness in the philippines when he grows up? as we all know that half pinoys and half whites are such good combination! thank you for all your well wishes. i really am struggling with the sickness and nausea at the moment as it's not just in the mornings but all thru out the day so can't wait for my first trimester to be over and done with. good luck again and can't wait to see the photos you may possibly post