Debit Cards, overdrafts.

[johncar54]

I always understood that with a Debit Card one could only use it, draw cash from ATMs etc, when one was in credit.

This morning, inadvertently, I withdrew 300 euros from an account with less than £100 in it, thus I was overdrawn. I do not have an overdraft facility on this account.

Some time ago I was told that it is possible to use a Debit Card as a credit card. I had not believed this to be possible but it would seem that is what I did today.

I am on the point of sending a Debit Card to my wife's cousin in Phil, to replace the CASH CARD which we have been using for some years to transfer money. (Cash cards are being withdrawn by Nationwide).

[Les_lady888]

Hello John...I work in a bank here in the Philippines and I really would like it if you can enlighten me with how your debit card works. In our bank, when you say debit card, you can use it as long as you have enough funds in your account. Every transaction you make will automatically be debited from your remaining balance thus, when your account is already insufficient to accommodate your ATM withdrawal or POS transactions then the card will be rejected by the system. The credit card on the other hand is more on a liability on your part. Whether you withdraw from the ATM or use your credit card via POS, you will always be charged and billed afterwards.

Our bank used to accommodate international debit cards over-the-counter withdrawal exceeding P30,000 but not allowed anymore for some reasons. Anyway, I'm wondering how can your bank allow you to exceed your withdrawals from your account balance. Is it more of a special facility or just a system error?

When you send money using Cash card, how much service charge do they collect from you?

[stevie c]

Hi les_lady can i ask what bank you work for

[johncar54]

Hi Les Lady:

I also understood that I could only withdraw when the account had sufficient balance. But as I said today I drew 300 euros, which put my UK bank account overdrawn by about £150.

When I checked my UK account on line, it appears that an overdraft can be arranged but none has been. That's why I was surprised. I do not have any special arrangement.

RE withdrawing cash over the counter.

I can withdraw up to at least 5,000 euros over the counter in Spain, on my UK Debit Card (I have always had sufficient funds in that account to cover it) even through my daily limit is £300.

There is no charge to withdraw cash in Spain with my UK Debit Card, either by the Spanish Bank or the UK one. This also still applies to the CASH CARD which my wife's cousin uses in Phil to draw cash from one of my UK accounts, providing he uses one displaying the 'VISA' symbol. The CASH CARD is on the point of being withdrawn by Nationwide in UK.

[rani]

yeah that's how the debit cards work here in the philippines... that's why i don't use my atm as debit card, instead i use my credit card for all of my purchases to earn points and eventually convert it to miles points for my airfare

[bornatbirth]

i think you will have a automatic overdraft on all debit card/cash card, bank accounts and you will get charged for it for being overdrawn

[JimOttley]

From Wikipedia

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Debit_card

Issues with deferred posting of offline debit
To the consumer, a debit transaction is perceived as occurring in real-time; i.e. the money is withdrawn from their account immediately following the authorization request from the merchant, which in many countries, is the case when making an online debit purchase. However, when a purchase is made using the "credit" (offline debit) option, the transaction merely places an authorization hold on the customer's account; funds are not actually withdrawn until the transaction is reconciled and hard-posted to the customer's account, usually a few days later. However, the previous sentence applies to all kinds of transaction types, at least when using a card issued by a European bank. This is in contrast to a typical credit card transaction; though it can also have a lag time of a few days before the transaction is posted to the account, it can be many days to a month or more before the consumer makes repayment with actual money.
Because of this, in the case of a benign or malicious error by the merchant or bank, a debit transaction may cause more serious problems (e.g. money not accessible; overdrawn account) than in the case of a credit card transaction (e.g. credit not accessible; over credit limit). This is especially true in the United States, where cheque fraud is a crime in every state, but exceeding your credit limit is not.

The system is not fully real time and sometimes mistakes get made.

However by some piece of magic this does not happen with cash cards.

[Les_lady888]

stevie c

Hi les_lady can i ask what bank you work for

I work with the now Number 1 Bank in the Phils.

There is no charge to withdraw cash in Spain with my UK Debit Card,....This also still applies to the CASH CARD which my wife's cousin uses in Phil to draw cash from one of my UK accounts,

I'm not sure if you are right about this.......coz whenever you use other bank's machine whether it is VISA, Mastercard, Maestro, Cirrus or Plus capable, there will always be certain charges..here in the Phils., normally banks charge US$1 for inquiry and US$3 dollars for every withdrawal.

[stevie c]

[QUOTE=Les_lady888;234269]I work with the now Number 1 Bank in the Phils.

what bank is the no1 in the phils i opened an account for my mahal with banco de oro

[Les_lady888]

that's my bank Sir! ...and Im at your service if you have any queries...

[Les_lady888]

JimOttley

From Wikipedia

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Debit_card

Issues with deferred posting of offline debit
To the consumer, a debit transaction is perceived as occurring in real-time; i.e. the money is withdrawn from their account immediately following the authorization request from the merchant, which in many countries, is the case when making an online debit purchase. However, when a purchase is made using the "credit" (offline debit) option, the transaction merely places an authorization hold on the customer's account; funds are not actually withdrawn until the transaction is reconciled and hard-posted to the customer's account, usually a few days later. However, the previous sentence applies to all kinds of transaction types, at least when using a card issued by a European bank. This is in contrast to a typical credit card transaction; though it can also have a lag time of a few days before the transaction is posted to the account, it can be many days to a month or more before the consumer makes repayment with actual money.
Because of this, in the case of a benign or malicious error by the merchant or bank, a debit transaction may cause more serious problems (e.g. money not accessible; overdrawn account) than in the case of a credit card transaction (e.g. credit not accessible; over credit limit). This is especially true in the United States, where cheque fraud is a crime in every state, but exceeding your credit limit is not.

This is the reason why our bank stops accepting debit card over-the-counter withdrawals which most of the foreigners enjoy before. We used to allow OTC withdrawals from P30K to over P100K but not to exceed P300K....We still allow credit card OTC cash advances though.

[johncar54]

I work with the now Number 1 Bank in the Phils.



I'm not sure if you are right about this.......coz whenever you use other bank's machine whether it is VISA, Mastercard, Maestro, Cirrus or Plus capable, there will always be certain charges..here in the Phils., normally banks charge US$1 for inquiry and US$3 dollars for every withdrawal.

Over the past 22 years or so, I have drawn cash in Spain,
past 7 years in Malaysia and Thailand,
past 5 years I and my wife's cousin in Philippines,

Never a charge (either in UK nor the other country) PROVIDING IT WAS A 'VISA' ATM.

This used to apply to Cirrus too, but that changed a couple of years ago.

[stevie c]

that's my bank Sir! ...and Im at your service if you have any queries...

thank you i will remember that if i need assistance

[stevie c]

where abouts r u in the phils leslady

[JimOttley]

I'm not sure if you are right about this.......coz whenever you use other bank's machine whether it is VISA, Mastercard, Maestro, Cirrus or Plus capable, there will always be certain charges..here in the Phils., normally banks charge US$1 for inquiry and US$3 dollars for every withdrawal.

John is right about this, he mentions the Nationwide bank, they are well known for providing cards that don't have fee's for oversea withdrawals.

There used to be a couple of UK credit cards that did not charge for foreign withdrawals as well, not sure if they are still offering this though.

[James Hubbard]

in the philippines, my Halifax account has a service charge of £1.50 for every transaction, and the rate is maybe 3 peso less to the £ when the rate is calculated

theiving the lot of them

[johncar54]

in the philippines, my Halifax account has a service charge of £1.50 for every transaction, and the rate is maybe 3 peso less to the £ when the rate is calculated

theiving the lot of them

James, if you are in UK, open a Nationwide account !!!

[stevie c]

[QUOTE=James Hubbard;234289]in the philippines, my Halifax account has a service charge of £1.50 for every transaction, and the rate is maybe 3 peso less to the £ when the rate is calculated

mine ias about the same with barclays

[James Hubbard]

James, if you are in UK, open a Nationwide account !!!

I think i should do that, i was planning to before i went and lived there, but i left it too late!

Cheers

[johncar54]

[QUOTE=stevie c;234292]

in the philippines, my Halifax account has a service charge of £1.50 for every transaction, and the rate is maybe 3 peso less to the £ when the rate is calculated

mine ias about the same with barclays

Stevie; if you are in UK, open a Nationwide account !!!

[Les_lady888]

Never a charge (either in UK nor the other country) PROVIDING IT WAS A 'VISA' ATM.

This used to apply to Cirrus too, but that changed a couple of years ago.

Ok....then I think VISA gives more privileges.....
I guess the bank, where your wife's cousin use the VISA ATM, earns only from the currency conversion

[stevie c]

thank you john i will take your advice

[johncar54]

Opps !

Sorry guys, maybe I did not repeat that now, the free service may only apply to CASH CARDS: I believe Nationwide have recently started charging for withdrawals on DEBIT CARDS.

CASH CARD withdrawals are still free, but they are on the point of changing the CASH CARD, so that it can be used 'at point of sale' too.

I have complained to Nationwide, as that in effect makes the Cash Card into a debit card (which already exists).

I asked that others here also complain, believing that if enough did they would rethink. I do not believe many (if any) complained.

[Les_lady888]

stevie c..thank you i will remember that if i need assistance

where abouts r u in the phils leslady

You're welcome Sir. I will be happy to do so....but I have to admit I'm not always here in the forum coz sometimes I really have a hard time accessing the site or maybe it was my pc causing it.....Anyway if you have queries and I'm not answering then you can always ask lestaxi1 to text me so I will get online and see what I can do...

I'm presently in Davao City. and we will have our Kadayawan Festival soon in |August

[stevie c]

thank you leslady thats very kind of you please call me steve

[Les_lady888]

johncar54

Opps !

Sorry guys, maybe I did not repeat that now, the free service may only apply to CASH CARDS: I believe Nationwide have recently started charging for withdrawals on DEBIT CARDS.

CASH CARD withdrawals are still free, but they are on the point of changing the CASH CARD, so that it can be used 'at point of sale' too.

so it's Cash Card and not the VISA ATM cards eh?...

We also have BDO Cash cards and this can only be transacted via ATMs and POS. I still have to confirm though if our Cash Card won't incur any service charges using other AT Machines but I am definitely sure that if you use BDO cash cards in BDO ATMs and POS, then it will be free.

[Les_lady888]

thank you leslady thats very kind of you please call me steve

ok steve...thanks too...

I have to go to bed now as it is already late
Goodnight everyone!!!

[johncar54]

In my post at #4 I said:


"There is no charge to withdraw cash in Spain with my UK Debit Card, either by the Spanish Bank or the UK one. This also still applies to the CASH CARD which my wife's cousin uses in Phil to draw cash from one of my UK accounts, providing he uses one displaying the 'VISA' symbol. The CASH CARD is on the point of being withdrawn by Nationwide in UK."

[stevie c]

so when im in the phils i cant withdraw cash over the counter with my debit card but i can with my credit card

[somebody]

Going overdrawn on your debit card seems to happen more with some banks than others... The Wife uses HSBC and she has had a few times where she has been allowed to draw more out than in her account. HerNatwest card will not let her do this...