Just looking on the UK border agency web site and Im finding the rules a bit confusing to say the least..
As a British person,am I allowed to apply for Filipino citizenship and become a dual national without losing any of my rights as a British citizen?
If not,why can Filipinos that have become Brits now get away with this?
Just had a look at this site..interesting bit is in this section about the "jus sanguinis principle"
As interpreted, a child of a Filipino citizen (at the time of birth) and of a foreign citizen (e.g. British) born in Britain, who adheres to the jus sanguinis principle, is a dual citizen and is allowed to acquire both Filipino and British passports.
http://www.philippine-portal.com/dua...quisition.html
DUAL OR MULTIPLE CITIZENSHIP
Prior to the making of R.A. 9225, some Filipinos obtained dual citizenship through the Nationality Laws of the Philippines and other foreign countries.
A child born in the United States of America (USA) of Filipino parents is an American citizen under the American Law; and, is a Filipino citizen under the Philippine law. The child's American citizenship is derived from the principle of jus soli or right of place. While his Filipino citizenship is derived from the principle of jus sanguinis or right of blood. The child however, does not fully exercise his rights as a dual citizen in either country.
Consequently, the enactment of R.A. 9225 gives the child the right to obtain his parent’s citizenship or regain his ancestral citizenship, and entitles him to exercise his rights as a Filipino citizen without losing his foreign citizenship. It is, thus, possible for Filipinos to hold dual citizenship by birth.
As interpreted, a child of a Filipino citizen (at the time of birth) and of a foreign citizen (e.g. British) born in Britain, who adheres to the jus sanguinis principle, is a dual citizen and is allowed to acquire both Filipino and British passports.
Nevertheless, a child of a Filipino citizen (at the time of birth) and of a foreign citizen (e.g. Australian) whose country adheres to the jus sanguinis principle, born in a foreign country (e.g. USA) who adheres to the jus soli principle can acquire Filipino, Australian and American passports.
I am British. My mother was born in N. Ireland and I have just discovered that means I am entitled to Irish nationality (Eire).
Last week I sent off my application for Irish Nationality. I will the have dual nationality.
This will not affect anything.
Why I am I doing it?
The Irish Consulate seem to like saying yes we can help as opposed to the British Consulate who seem only to be able to say, we can't do this or that.
Example: We live in Spain. If my wife wants to go to Ireland, because I am British, we can make the application in the post and its free. UK require a trip to Madrid 500 mile round trip, an interview and 100 euros fee.
If I try to call the Brit consulate to ask about visa etc, its a premium rate call and then they (Border Control wallys) don't wanna tell you anything. Ireland, it's a free call and a real person, who gives their name, will answer questions.
'Top o' the morning boyos'
Nice oneOriginally Posted by johncar54
, my Grandad came from The Republic I might have to look and see if I'm eligible for their gravy train
Well,if it were possible for me to have Dual citizenship I cannot see any reason not to go ahead as I live here in the R.P full time and I must admit it would be nice to be able to own at least 50% of the property that we have purchased.. I am eligible to apply in another 2 years but no point if I stand to lose my rights as a UK citizen..
I cant see why a Filipino that has become British can then become a dual citizen and I cant do it the other way round??
Great if I can get an answer here BTW.
How does a foreign national become a Filipino citizen? Three ways, according to ManilaTimes.net:
The courts. Administrative proceedings apply to native-born persons of foreign parents; judicial proceedings are for foreigners who immigrated to the Philippines and have married a Filipino.
The Office of the Solicitor General. The OSG has the authority to review petitions for naturalization, and to approve or disapprove them. A unanimous vote on either action is required.The processing fee is P40,000. The petition also declares that the applicant shall not be a public charge, that he is serious about getting Filipino citizenship and shall renounce loyalty to the country he was a former subject of.
An act of Congress. Immigrants who have made significant contributions to Philippine society may also be sponsored by a congressman or senator for naturalization.
and more info's here
http://www.filipinasoul.com/2008/07/...itizen-part-2/
Don't make promises when you are in JOY. Don't reply when you are SAD.
Don't take decisions when you are ANGRY. Think twice, Act wise. BE happy.
On the point of renouncing one's UK nationality.
As the UK have no objection to dual nationality, you do not have any obligation in UK to denounce you British Nationality (that is even if you can do it). Thus, as far as UK is concerned you remain British and thus lose nothing.
Addition:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_nationality_law#Renunciation_and_resumption_of_British_nationality
Renunciation and resumption of British nationality
All categories of British nationality can be renounced by a declaration made to the Home Secretary. A person ceases to be a British national on the date that the declaration of renunciation is registered by the Home Secretary. If a declaration is registered in the expectation of acquiring another citizenship, but one is not acquired within six months of the registration, it does not take effect and the person is considered to have remained a British national.
Renunciations made to other authorities are invalid: e.g., a general renunciation made upon taking up U.S. citizenship. The forms must be sent through the UK Border Agency's citizenship renunciation process.
There are provisions for the resumption of British citizenship or British overseas territories citizenship renounced for the purpose of gaining or retaining another citizenship. This can generally only be done once as a matter of entitlement. Further opportunities to resume British citizenship are discretionary.
British subjects, British Overseas citizens and British Nationals (Overseas) cannot under any circumstances resume their British nationality after renunciation.
How do the Indians and Koreans get around it? I can think of many who own businesses in Phill?
Possibly the not holding Dual citizenship is to stop Foreigners coming in and taking over then leaving the mintue things take a turn for the worse
With Laws changing so rapidly I guess you would need to read the latest rules as I know a lot of Indians who live in the Uk back in the noughties were given the right to become dual citzens where before one of a couple who came to the UK would be a Brit while the other would just have ILR and retain Indian nationalship. I think further changes have been brought in for those offspring etc who were just British and mixed couples but cant say I know much about..
So you may find that things are changing if not surely people need to start making a lot of noise about. With a sizable amount of Phills both in mixed marriages and OFW families who stay in the UK will there be a time when slowly those who look and are at least part Filipino may start to find they have to choose to be British or Phill?
I know its one reason why I would never live in Phill full time as the country still has highly bigoted rules on certain subjects which need reforming or do the want to be rude? Funny how for a race of people who are known for their warm welcome are so as a Nation rude to those who want to contribute and join in. While us Brits who are thought of as cold and unwelcoming race in comprassion by many are as a nation the opposite
Oh lord why did you make so many clothes and shoe shops
So possibly you could say I renounce my British citizenship and never say nothing to the British Authorities
Oh lord why did you make so many clothes and shoe shops
As I said: The UK is not concerned about whether their citizens (by birth of otherwise) hold more that one nationality. I am sure that most, if not all the Filipinos, who have British Nationality, also retained their Filipino Nationality.
I am in the process of acquiring Irish Nationality; I will then have joint British and Irish nationalities (two passports).
i dont know how the koreans get round it, but i know that a lot of filipinos would like them to go back to were they come from..How do the Indians and Koreans get around it? I can think of many who own businesses in Phill?
Possibly the not holding Dual citizenship is to stop Foreigners coming in and taking over then leaving the mintue things take a turn for the worse
With Laws changing so rapidly I guess you would need to read the latest rules as I know a lot of Indians who live in the Uk back in the noughties were given the right to become dual citzens where before one of a couple who came to the UK would be a Brit while the other would just have ILR and retain Indian nationalship. I think further changes have been brought in for those offspring etc who were just British and mixed couples but cant say I know much about..
So you may find that things are changing if not surely people need to start making a lot of noise about. With a sizable amount of Phills both in mixed marriages and OFW families who stay in the UK will there be a time when slowly those who look and are at least part Filipino may start to find they have to choose to be British or Phill?
I know its one reason why I would never live in Phill full time as the country still has highly bigoted rules on certain subjects which need reforming or do the want to be rude? Funny how for a race of people who are known for their warm welcome are so as a Nation rude to those who want to contribute and join in. While us Brits who are thought of as cold and unwelcoming race in comprassion by many are as a nation the opposite
Snap regarding having dual nationalship all ready have but chose not to use in anger yet but handy if i get held hostage and always goes down with the phills
The problem is if the Phills when you go to apply for Filipino citzenship, if they ask to see proof that you are renouncing your citzenship with Britain. This may for some be a big stumbling block.
For a Phill all they have to do is fill in a form pay a few quid swear an oath and all rights are back intact it seems for the average Phill.
Oh lord why did you make so many clothes and shoe shops
Thanks for the replies..Encouraging!!
I was just reading the UK border agency site and this is what it says there.. I can usually read and understand plain English but in this case I think I need a translation!!
If you are a British subject otherwise than by connection with the Republic of Ireland you will lose that status on acquiring any other nationality or citizenship. If you are a British protected person you will lose that status on acquiring any other nationality or citizenship.
Also,spot the contradiction here..
And yet on the UK border site it says this..
(from Johncar`s source)
British subjects, British Overseas citizens and British Nationals (Overseas) cannot under any circumstances resume their British nationality after renunciation.
Resuming your citizenship after giving it up
If you give up British citizenship or British overseas territories citizenship, you are allowed (only once) to resume that citizenship if it was necessary for you to give it up so that you could keep or gain some other citizenship. For details of how to do this, see resuming citizenship.
If you give up British citizenship more than once, or for another reason, the Home Secretary may allow you to resume your citizenship, depending on the circumstances.
If you give up British overseas territories citizenship more than once, or for another reason, the Governor of the British overseas territory concerned may allow you to resume your citizenship, depending on the circumstances.
If you give up British overseas citizenship, British subject status or British national (overseas) status, you cannot resume it.
Yes.. it would be a big stumbling block..The problem is if the Phills when you go to apply for Filipino citzenship, if they ask to see proof that you are renouncing your citzenship with Britain. This may for some be a big stumbling block.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_nationality_law#Renunciation_and_resumption_of_British_nationality
Also says :-
Since the British Nationality Act of 1948, there is in general no restriction, in United Kingdom law, on a British national being a citizen of another country as well. So, if a British national acquires another nationality, they will not automatically lose British nationality. Similarly, a person does not need to give up any other nationality when they become British.
Different rules apply in the cases of British protected persons and certain British subjects
The thing which confuses the issue is the status of the 'British Person' (British citizen, British protected person, British subject, Citizen of the United Kingdom and Colonies, etc). Thus 'British, born and bred' no problems.
Thank you John..
Its all academic now as obviously I have NO intention of chucking in my Brit status,re R.P requirements.
High time the EU demanded parity with these mickey mouse nations IMO..
Whats good for the goose ect..
Fred, I thought I had made the point, although you say to RP that you have denounced your British nationality as far as UK is concerned you are still British.
Its the same in Spain, except for former Spanish colonies, including RP, ones not allowed to have dual nationality, but many people do.
The USA and probably many countries are the same, dual nationality is not allowed, so its not RP that's Mickey Mouse it's the UK that is different !
John..I would expect that the R.P would ask for evidence of my renunciation of British citizenship as part of their requirements to prove my serious intentions of becoming a Filipino..If I still hold a Brit passport then I must surely have gotten my new citizenship under false pretences??Fred, I thought I had made the point, although you say to RP that you have denounced your British nationality as far as UK is concerned you are still British.
In over 30 years I have yet to meet ONE expat in R.P that has done so..Its the same in Spain, except for former Spanish colonies, including RP, ones not allowed to have dual nationality, but many people do.
Has to be a fundamental reason for this!
You may say that but it is for Filipino`s!! Most Filams now have dual nationality!!The USA and probably many countries are the same, dual nationality is not allowed,
Well this thread is not about USA (I deviated) however, I copy this from the web:-
A U.S. citizen may acquire foreign citizenship by marriage, or a person naturalized as a U.S. citizen may not lose the citizenship of the country of birth.U.S. law does not mention dual nationality or require a person to choose one citizenship or another. Also, a person who is automatically granted another citizenship does not risk losing U.S. citizenship. However, a person who acquires a foreign citizenship by applying for it may lose U.S. citizenship. In order to lose U.S. citizenship, the law requires that the person must apply for the foreign citizenship voluntarily, by free choice, and with the intention to give up U.S. citizenship.
Like with phills in the Uk once they become Brits its a bit of a grey area from previous threads on here but technically from what I understand the Phill is no longer a Phill citzen and needs to take an oath fill in a form and hand over cash
Now many phills carry on using their Phill passport after getting their British citzenship and from what i can see there is no way for the typical offcial on the ground to tell. But legally the Phill is not a phill untill they repledge the oath to Phill again and get a new passport. But even if they dont get a new passport and pledge an oath they have certain rights better than a person who ahs never been a phill citzen!!
It all sounds like ways round citzenship issues but I guess if propety and law courts may have some reason to get involved into looking to your nationality I would be very careful.
Oh lord why did you make so many clothes and shoe shops
I know this is way off thread but please forgive me.
If a Filipino say living in UK were to take British Nationality it would seem that they are 'no longer Filipinos.' Thus if they were to divorce and then resume Filipino Nationality, would they be legally free to marry again in RP ?
I must say that I find this post very interesting.
This may end up being a rather long post
On the subject of dual citizenship I wish it were possible to clearly state a definitive successful strategy, but it’s not. Eventually there are just too many gray areas to consider
There is however a recognized legal process to apply for naturalization in the Philippines.
The major qualifications include:-
Must not be less than 21 yrs of age
10 years continuous residence (5 years if married to Phil citizen)
Must be of good moral character and believe in the principles underlying the Philippine Constitution, and must have conducted themselves in a proper and irreproachable manner during the entire period of residence in the Philippines in his relation with the constituted government as well as with the community in which he is living.
Ability to read and write English or Spanish AND any one of the principal Philippine languages
Must have enrolled minor children of school age, in any of the public schools or private schools recognized by the Office of Private Education of the Philippines, where the Philippine history, government and civics are taught or prescribed as part of the school curriculum, during the entire period of the residence in the Philippines required of them prior to the hearing of the petition for naturalization as Philippine citizen.
Always remember it is a judge reviewing all of your qualifications that makes the final decision. Whether you meet all the requirements or not, the judge makes the decision. You might meet all the official requirements but because the judge doesn’t think you've integrated enough into the local Philippine culture, he turns you down. The same is true the other way; you might not speak a major Philippine dialect fluently, but you brought solid upstanding Filipino citizens as character witnesses who speak glorious words about your contributions and character and the judge lets you have citizenship.
Additionally, there are some costs/fees involved. I do not know how much these would likely be at the end.
Timescales are about 3 years (initial application 1 year before petition, final decision not less than 2 years after filing petition)
It is not necessarily the case that you give up British Citizenship.
British nationality can be renounced by a declaration made to the Home Secretary. A person ceases to be a British national on the date that the declaration of renunciation is registered by the Home Secretary. If a declaration is registered in the expectation of acquiring another citizenship, but one is not acquired within six months of the registration, it does not take effect and the person is considered to have remained a British national.
Renunciations made to other authorities are invalid.
Prior to receiving the Philippine naturalisation certificate you must declare in open court that you renounce absolutely and forever all allegiance and fidelity to any foreign prince, potentate, state or sovereignty.
Under international law, the Master Nationality Rule says that a State may not give diplomatic protection to one of its nationals in a country whose citizenship that person also holds. For example, if a person is both British national and Philippine national, he cannot be given diplomatic help by a British Consul in the Philippines.
Furthermore, the state issuing naturalisation also has the legal power of cancellation.
Anyone obtaining naturalisation fraudulently will be subject to a fine or imprisonment or both and cancellation of naturalisation. (probably after the term of imprisonment so that any other diplomatic service cannot help you)
By the way I’m not an expert or a lawyer if anyone knows something is incorrect please share.
Terpe
What a great Post Terpe.
As you mention due to a Judge being involved in the decision it does sound like there is room both ways for a favourable or not so favourable outcome. Sadly from my limited experience of Phill Judges I think it should not be hard to if its one you know to be ok regardless of your actual worthiness
Oh lord why did you make so many clothes and shoe shops
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