Snowstorm In A Teacup?

[Arthur Little]

It is that time of year again ... a time when the Nation pays homage to those who lost their lives in two World Wars - and numerous more recent, albeit no less poignant, conflicts. In the midst of it all, Channel 4 newscaster, Jon Snow has now been castigated by former Labour Cabinet Minister - turned freelance journalist - Roy [now, Lord] Hattersley for (it looks like) declining ... rather than refusing ... to wear a poppy when appearing before the cameras each weekday evening, lately.

Normally, I tend to tune into the Ten o'clock News on either BBC or ITV. But the *other evening I happened to watch the hour-long - and more in-depth - Bulletin on C4 and, to be honest, never even noticed the veteran presenter's apparent "lack of respect" for our 'fallen heroes and (in these days of political correctness) heroines' ... being more drawn to which of his famed multi-coloured ties he happened to be sporting on that particular *occasion.

It's fair to say, that none of us here (myself included) are of an age to remember anything at all about the events that took place during the years between 1939 & 45. And neither, of course, is the 63-yr-old, Snow. So what do others think? Is he being remiss?

[Arthur Little]

Come on all you would-be patriots ... I'd've expected at least some response before now!

Personally, I'd be more inclined to take issue with those under-dressed announcers, show hosts, comperes and/or judges - like that insufferably smug, self-satisfied prat, Simon Cowell of 'X' Factor infamy - who consistently turn-up onscreen, minus a tie ... imagining they look trendy and "with it" ... when, in reality, they just appear decidedly scruffy and unkempt!

[Terpe]

Two reasons I personally did not respond to this earlier.
Firstly I was fast asleep in bed when you originally posted.
Secondly, I wanted to think very carefully about how I wanted to respond.

The Royal British Legion's charity work is largely funded through the Poppy Appeal.
Originally intended to recall the end of world war I at the 11th hour of the 11th day of the 11th month of 1918 (with the German signing of the Armistice) and to Remember, Respect and honour all those who lost their lives and did not have a choice.

Those who do, or do not, wear a poppy have their own reasons and understandings.

As for me I wear a poppy for my own reasons.

I do not wear a poppy either as a fashion accessory, or a political statement or symbol.

I can understand Jon Snow’s position.
Nobody should be obligated to wear a poppy
Don't forget he has always taken this view and every year he is attacked for it.

How many people wearing a poppy really understand why?
How many people selling the poppy really understand why?

Jeremy Paxman wrote a very interesting and poignant article:-

"Wear a poppy ... for the lions killed in war, not the donkeys who send them there"In this article he writes:-

Many of us may profoundly disagree with the ambitions and distrust the motivations
of the politicians who send soldiers, sailors and air crew to do jobs they could
not do themselves.

What we're taking part in is an act of respect, not for warfare but for the poor sods
whose task it was to carry guns and who did not return to grow old, as the rest of us grow old.

So, let us silence the offensive claim that by honouring the dead we condone war.

I shall wear a poppy not because I believe the gun is the best way of settling disputes, still less because I admire the pretence, ambition, folly, vanity or desperation of the politicians who make the fateful decisions.

I shall wear a poppy because an act of remembrance once a year is the very least
that those of us who have not been asked to risk our lives can offer those who did
not have our choice.

[mikey73]

I shall wear a poppy because an act of remembrance once a year is the very least
that those of us who have not been asked to risk our lives can offer those who did
not have our choice.[/B]

i agree, i get a poppy every year out of respect of what the earlier generations did for us. they sacrificed so much.
i think its up to the individual if they want to wear a poppy or not.

[johncar54]

Am I correct in thinking that the number of presenters wearing a poppy on TV has increased over the years ?

It seems now that 'it's part of the obligatory uniform.' I cannot recall that years ago it was such. How do others remember this?

Maybe since the Government made the stupid (illegal) decisions to send troops into the sovereign countries of Iraq and Afghanistan (invade them) the desire to recognise those who who have been killed and maimed unnecessarily, has become more prominent.

[mickcant]

I also wear a poppy, and always go to watch our local parade.
Mick.

[KeithD]

I imagine on the Beeb they HAVE to wear one.

[Dedworth]

i agree, i get a poppy every year out of respect of what the earlier generations did for us. they sacrificed so much.
i think its up to the individual if they want to wear a poppy or not.

Seconded

[les_taxi]

i always wear a poppy ,everyone should remember the sacrafice's given in the past.

I queried how many of my fellow taxi drivers had got one yesterday and it seems not many,I will encourage or ******* them to get one asap

[Doc Alan]

The poppy is not bought, it's offered in return for a donation to the Royal British Legion. I choose not to wear a poppy, but equally I don't wear a badge saying I donated to Typhoon Ondoy relief, cancer research, or this forum ! I chose not to wear a tie when working in hospital because it's a source of cross-infection, not because I admire Simon Cowell ! Respect for - and from - others is earned through consistent behaviour, including humility because we all make mistakes.
I share your disappointment at the lack of response, Arthur, it's a serious thread, and the few replies so far deserve reading. However, since this is a filipinouk forum, we should also remember that during the two years of Japanese occupation of the Philippines in World War II, at least 10,000 Filipinos and Americans died before General MacArthur carried out his promise "I shall return". Jose Rizal is a national hero. "All Saints' Day" - November 1 - is the day when filipinos honour their dead....but I've been told you don't pay your respects in the Philippines by being miserable !

[sars_notd_virus]

''11th hour of the 11th day of the 11th month'' as a respect we usually just keep in silence...

[les_taxi]

I feel patriotic and proud wearing my poppy and to be honest seeing people not wearing them disapoints me,but it's personal choice so nothing I can do.

[KeithD]

I don't wear a poppy. My grandad was shot dead in WW2 leaving my nan and her 3 kids on their own. I prefer to remember him and others that died in the way I choose and the day I choose, which is multiple times a year, in my own way.

[les_taxi]

Yes of course Keith I can understand that,but for me it's just a bit of our patriotic past slipping away.
In years to come no-one will bother or give a **** who sacrificed for their future.

I remember a parking attendent (sorry ****) I mean issuing tickets to dozens of cars who were attending the rememberence day service somewhere in england,upon being challenged the 24 year old said what is rememberence sunday? "i thought i heard some music".

I know where i would have stuck my poppy

At least if future generations see us wearing poppys they may just ask why and learn something.

[grahamw48]

Normally I'm a tight-fisted miserable old git, but I always buy a poppy, even if sometimes I forget to wear it.

The vast majority of those young people who died in the world wars were conscripts, sadly deprived of a full and happy life.

I feel very fortunate not to have been put in their position.

My dad volunteered, and spent 30 years in the Royal Navy, taking in the whole of WW2.
He lost a lot of good friends who were doing their best to help protect their loved ones back home.

The British Legion does very good work in helping war veterans and their families, and I for one am happy to contribute a little towards that, and at the same time giving some thought to those who lost their lives in defense of their country.

[Doc Alan]

I'm happy you have had a few more responses Arthur But I understand completely how you feel when members choose either not to read - or respond to - a sincere and honest thread.

[Terpe]

I'm happy you have had a few more responses Arthur But I understand completely how you feel when members choose either not to read - or respond to - a sincere and honest thread.

Looking at the timing listed I believe Arthur posted at around midnight. I don't know how many members were on line at that time.

[les_taxi]

Sometimes I miss posts too if a newer thread had been started I may not look in that section if the most recent post holds no interest.

[bornatbirth]

didnt all they are give their lives for democracy so we can choose to wear a poppy or not and wont we all be wearing a poppy all year round thus losing its appeal

[Arthur Little]

wont we all be wearing a poppy *all year round thus losing its appeal

... so ... do you think it's just a load of old "poppycock"?

[bornatbirth]

... so ... do you think it's just a load of old "poppycock"?

not really, why not just wear it on the day intended

[KeithD]

The younger generation probably associate the poppy with drugs.

[Arthur Little]

not really, why not just wear it *on the day intended

... *that's what I normally do.

[Arthur Little]

The younger generation probably associate the poppy with drugs.

Sadly, ... I have to agree.

[Doc Alan]

Looking at the timing listed I believe Arthur posted at around midnight. I don't know how many members were on line at that time.

You made an excellent and well considered response Terpe .
Midnight is early for Arthur's posts ! Would be good also to get responses from our filipino friends who either live in UK (like Mari, always worth reading) or have their own views about heroes, martyrs and deceased loved ones in the Philippines. World War II certainly affected both our countries.

[Arthur Little]

You made an excellent and well considered response Terpe .
Midnight is early for Arthur's posts !

... it has to be said, I also concur with both gentlemens' observations.

[purple]

Hi,
I was wondering why that flower like "poppy" on the BBC anchors when I watched the news. Also your PM and rest of people wearing ties and poppy. Now I understand why. It is symbolic and another form of heroic act of present day people by commemorating to the chaos that once happened to the world.

Just an opinion, with ongoing bomb threats and alerts around Europe. I think that it is good to wear it to remind everyone that terrorism should not be encouraged. For the people to be reminded that many died for the freedom that most people are having in these generation, for having a job to work on and keep our lifestyle and tummy filled.
For the idealism that was fought for many years back when our fore parents dreamily hoping for this and for us to breathe and live, the present generations to have this democracy.
Basically, by wearing it shows other people that they care and will have the same impact.
As for me, I am saddened because the new generations now doesn't even remember the idealism of Jose Rizal and how the it made Emilio Aguinaldo became the first president when infact it was Andres Bonificio who fought and acted for the Philippine's Indepence.
Just an opinion...

[Arthur Little]

Hi,
I was wondering why that flower like "poppy" on the BBC anchors when I watched the news. Also your PM and rest of people wearing ties and poppy. Now I understand why. It is symbolic and another form of heroic act of present day people by commemorating to the chaos that once happened to the world.

Just an opinion, with ongoing bomb threats and alerts around Europe. I think that it is good to wear it to remind everyone that terrorism should not be encouraged. For the people to be reminded that many died for the freedom that most people are having in these generation, for having a job to work on and keep our lifestyle and tummy filled.
For the idealism that was fought for many years back when our fore parents dreamily hoping for this and for us to breathe and live, the present generations to have this democracy.
Basically, by wearing it shows other people that they care and will have the same impact.
As for me, I am saddened because the new generations now doesn't even remember the idealism of Jose Rizal and how the it made Emilio Aguinaldo became the first president when infact it was Andres Bonificio who fought and acted for the Philippine's Indepence.
Just an opinion...

... and a very sensible and perceptive opinion - that remains as valid in today's world as ever it was - Rohany. for your thoughtful insight.

[alanp]

I do and always will buy a poppy i seen to buy one a day as i keep lossing them and then get stabbed with the pin
i always attend the rememberance parades

[Doc Alan]

... and a very sensible and perceptive opinion - that remains as valid in today's world as ever it was - Rohany. for your thoughtful insight.

Agree ! It's great to have such a post from a young filipina