Ebay problems

[subseastu]

I've sold a high end camera lens for my dad recently on ebay. This lens worked perfectly well, in fact my dad has exhibited some pictures he took using that very lens. Anyway about 18 days after a successful sale on which I was left feedback that said "well packaged, as described" etc. I've just received an email from the chap complaining that picture quality isn't very good. He says he's taken it into a shop and the bloke has found some fungus and dust (not that uncommon) in the lens. He is now saying that it was recieved in a condition not as descriped and wants a full refund!! My dad and me looked at the lens for dust as we knew this can be a common problem and we couldn't see any when we sent it.

Now my problem is all the feedback has been done, positive by both parties and he's now bringing this up over 2 weeks after the event. Does anyone have any experience or suggestions with this sort of thing?

[stevewool]

sorry mate cant help you on that one , but surely once brought and like you say feedback is sent its over, i think someone on here knows someone that works on ebay

[lastlid]

My experience with ebay is that in the UK, these days, the buyer has rights and if he can prove that the item isn't as described in the listings then he is entitled to a full refund upon return of the purchased item. Having said that, I am not certain what happens if he has already given positive feedback. (That is the reason why I wait before I give feedback on a purchase on ebay). And I believe if the purchase is made with PAYPAL then the buyers rights are even more strictly enforced.

Personally I have found, unlike the early days with ebay, that the buyers rights are quite heavily protected on ebay in the UK now.

I will be interested to know how you get on. Good luck. I know very little about cameras.....is it possible for the buyer to just clean the lens or is that a silly question?

I believe you can reach a compromise through negotiation and / or the buyer has the option to have the matter settled by ebay / PAYPAL.

The buyer has 45 days from the payment date in which to register a claim, as far as I know.

[hawk]

i bet this guy doing like some buy items use them then take them back to were they buy them from this guy said it was recived in good condition that should have been that hes trying it on if you contact ebay and tell them as them what can be done sure they will help i dont agree with what happens good luck

[KeithD]

The feedback is irrelevant in law it is just a means to give someone credibility on Ebay.

You are within your rights to ask for proof of this problem, and once you have that you either need to pay for it to be cleaned or offer a full refund. Look at it from the customers point of view you wouldn't be happy with the problem.

When you are selling things the buyer has a lot of legal power, which is the way it should be, and selling some products at a loss for the seller is all part of normal business when their is a problem.

When I sold on Ebay for a couple of years I'd correct any problems whether they were caused by me, the post or the seller at my own expense as this results in more sales in the future.

[lastlid]

I sold an expensive plate on ebay a couple of years ago and it was damaged in the postal system. The buyer had paid through PAYPAL with a credit card. PAYPAL deducted the purchase price from my PAYPAL account pending a decision. Ultimately the decision went against me anyway and I lost the plate and the money (the plate was irrepairable and the postal system does not insure against damaged ceramics evidently).

[sim&lil]

This sounds like buyers remorse to me. As a seller you are pretty much screwed. Ebay will always side with the buyer sadly. Email the buyer and ask him to supply a letter from the camera shop which told him the lens was faulty, if he does just issue a full refund on return of the lens. You can always sell it again if it is ok.

Being a seller on ebay is becoming a real pain these days. If a buyer doesn't pay I can't leave negative feedback, but a buyer can leave negative for any reason they want.

Do not give him a partial refund and let him keep the item.

[lastlid]

Yes, it used to be a case of once the item is sold then thats it, but not anymore. That changed a few years ago. Same for the feedback - seller used to be able to give negative feedback.

But I found some sellers abused the negative feedback privlidge when they had it.

[KeithD]

Being a seller on ebay is becoming a real pain these days. If a buyer doesn't pay I can't leave negative feedback, but a buyer can leave negative for any reason they want.

Seller negative feedback removal was a good thing as it prevented slanging matches across accounts, especially when it is the seller who is supposed to offer A1 customer service. A seller can still comment on negative comments and have them removed if Ebay agree to it.

Yes, it used to be a case of once the item is sold then thats it, but not anymore. That changed a few years ago.

Actually the law changed well before Ebay existed, it just wasn't implemented by Ebay as they left any problems for the buyer/seller to sort out between themselves. This changed after pressure from the EU.

[subseastu]

Thing is myself and my dad examined the lens very carefully and found no faults with it at all. My dad has used this lens alot and displayed pictures in art exibition that used this particular lens. If there was anything wrong I'd have listed it in the decription. I'm very honest on ebay as I've been done before when buying stuff myself and found it to be "not as decribed" when I receive it. The problem here is, is this guy has has it for nearly 3 weeks and this is the first time he's contacted me about it since saying on the feedback and a email afterwards that he was happy with it and it was AS DESCRIBED.

I'm thinking of ignoring it for a few days and see what he does as I honestly believe either he has buyer remorse or it is infact him that has damaged the lens. Alot can happen in 2-3 weeks after all. I would never knowingly sell any faulty / damaged goods due to some of my past experiences.

[lastlid]

Hi Stu. I know what you mean. He could have simply had second thoughts or could have damaged it himself. I have never been in that position, that I know of, as a buyer or seller, except once when my ex wife changed her mind on a handbag that we bought and then we got a full refund.

My other understanding is that the buyer is entitled to exchange the item for a refund if he simply has a change of mind. No doubt Keith will know more on the legal side of this. But what would happen if the buyer has caused some damage in the interim is an interesting one.....

[imagine]

Thing is myself and my dad examined the lens very carefully and found no faults with it at all. My dad has used this lens alot and displayed pictures in art exibition that used this particular lens. If there was anything wrong I'd have listed it in the decription. I'm very honest on ebay as I've been done before when buying stuff myself and found it to be "not as decribed" when I receive it. The problem here is, is this guy has has it for nearly 3 weeks and this is the first time he's contacted me about it since saying on the feedback and a email afterwards that he was happy with it and it was AS DESCRIBED.

I'm thinking of ignoring it for a few days and see what he does as I honestly believe either he has buyer remorse or it is infact him that has damaged the lens. Alot can happen in 2-3 weeks after all. I would never knowingly sell any faulty / damaged goods due to some of my past experiences.

it might be his own old lense thats damaged, trying to pull a fast one

[sim&lil]

Seller negative feedback removal was a good thing as it prevented slanging matches across accounts, especially when it is the seller who is supposed to offer A1 customer service. A seller can still comment on negative comments and have them removed if Ebay agree to it.

Getting ebay to remove negative feedback is a real pain, they hardly ever do it and you need some serious proof that the buyer has conned you. Removing sellers negative feedback was unfair. I sell a lot on ebay and pride myself on good service, but what annoys me is buyers who win the item and then take days to pay and then moan that it took more than three days for them to recieve their item. If you win it pay for it asap. Has anyone here been held to ransom over feedback?

[lastlid]

Has anyone here been held to ransom over feedback?

I used to find with the old neg feedback for sellers that some would give a negative whenever the buyer expressed a genuine grievance, which is also wrong. Removing the neg option, by ebay, wasn't really the best solution to that but that is what was done...

[lastlid]

I sell a lot on ebay and pride myself on good service, but what annoys me is buyers who win the item and then take days to pay and then moan that it took more than three days for them to recieve their item.

Sometimes I have been a bit slow about payment but I would never give negative feedback if the item was slow to arrive as a result of my laziness. But there is always some that do.....

[RickyR]

it would be reasonable to send a politely worded e-mail asking for proof of the alleged problem, and whether the shop he visited could e-mail you directly with what the feel is the problem. Also reaffirm that the item was thoroughly checked prior to shipping and at the time of shipping had no sign of damage, defects or dirt.

[grahamw48]

I've only sold cars on ebay. (3)

My disclaimers have always been scary enough to deter all but the most enthusiastic and knowledgeable of buyers.

They of course are also the least likely to complain, and it worked, because never heard a thing (perhaps because they all died from their injuries on the drive home ? ).

[Terpe]

I've only sold cars on ebay. (3)

My disclaimers have always been scary enough to deter all but the most enthusiastic and knowledgeable of buyers.

They of course are also the least likely to complain, and it worked, because never heard a thing (perhaps because they all died from their injuries on the drive home ? ).

Or perhaps they were satisfied with their purchase

[Terpe]

it would be reasonable to send a politely worded e-mail asking for proof of the alleged problem, and whether the shop he visited could e-mail you directly with what the feel is the problem. Also reaffirm that the item was thoroughly checked prior to shipping and at the time of shipping had no sign of damage, defects or dirt.

I agree with also.
Stu, do you have any serial numbers for the camera and lens?
If yes, then any request for the report of 'damage' should include a request for those.

[grahamw48]

Or perhaps they were satisfied with their purchase

But of course.

They bought from ME.

[stevewool]

3 weeks after the sale , is to me to long to complain, when i buy things its opened and tested straight away,but also remember here, what you pay for the item, if its cheap well you have a bargin, if its to cheap watchout, and if its to dear dont buy, buy it from the shops with a full refund availible, just my thoughts, anyway what did you sell it for

[subseastu]

Thanks for the responses. I've now written a response to the guy but not sent it yet, I think I'm going to wait and see if I get anything else from him. I've asked for a copy of a report from a registared cannon dealer etc. Hopefully it'll scare him off as and when I send it. If it comes down to it I'll just shut everything down. I'm getting fed up with the cost involved in the whole ebay process to be honest.

[South-east boy]

I agree with also.
Stu, do you have any serial numbers for the camera and lens?
If yes, then any request for the report of 'damage' should include a request for those.

Was thinking that too.

How old is the lens Stu? Maybe ask for some of his example pics that are affected by the 'dust and fungus'? I've never had any pics that have been affected by that in many years of owning SLR's and various lens, but I have had lens that I've been a bit disappointed with the resulting pics. It could be that he's not so keen on the actual lens or seen another one etc and is just making excuses to get his money back

[subseastu]

3 weeks after the sale , is to me to long to complain, when i buy things its opened and tested straight away,but also remember here, what you pay for the item, if its cheap well you have a bargin, if its to cheap watchout, and if its to dear dont buy, buy it from the shops with a full refund availible, just my thoughts, anyway what did you sell it for

More than a pound, less than a grand

[subseastu]

Was thinking that too.

How old is the lens Stu? Maybe ask for some of his example pics that are affected by the 'dust and fungus'? I've never had any pics that have been affected by that in many years of owning SLR's and various lens, but I have had lens that I've been a bit disappointed with the resulting pics. It could be that he's not so keen on the actual lens or seen another one etc and is just making excuses to get his money back

The lense I sold was about 3 or 4 years old and a Canon EF 100 - 400 mm F/4.5-5.6 L IS USM Lens with Hoya UV(O) filter

[Dedworth]

Sounds like the buyer is trying it on - that's a good counter ploy by you asking for a report from a Cannon dealer

[subseastu]

Well I've still not heard again from the bloke so I'm hoping he's given up, though he maybe gearing up to contact ebay about it in their resolution centre. We'll have to see

[RickyR]

At the end of the day Stu, you're taking the right steps. You're offering a reasonable course of action, and that would show up in any subsequent investigation if it did happen.
At the moment, I don't see what else you could do.

[subseastu]

True ricky. As yet I've not replied to him and just ignoring it to see what he does next. I've prepared a response ready if he contacts me again. I believe though that if the seller (me) doesn't respond within 3 days he can open a case against me. But I think the has to be within 7 days of recieving the goods.

[lastlid]

From the murky depths of the eBay blurb......

"If the seller hasn't made things right, contact us so that we can help. You can open a case 3 days after the estimated delivery date of an item or 7 days after of making payment if you weren't given an estimated delivery date. A case has to be submitted within 45 days from the date of payment."