Pinay Girlfriend, on student visa, who is still Married

[HACHE]

Hello Everyone,

My girlfriend of seven months, is here in the UK on a student visa that runs until August 2013. She is 30.

In fairness to her she was honest with me from the start, she told me she has a 15yr old son back home ( who stays with his father), she married his father ten years ago, but the marriage broke down soon after ( she married at 20 I believe).

So, what are the hurdles and obstacles in her way, or our way, of her ever being able to come here as a spouse?

I understand annulment is, or can be a long drawn out affair, and a costly one too....and even then there is no guarantee it will be granted.
If that is then granted, the next obstacle to overcome would be the UK visa...

Any views, any advice is really appreciated.
Thanks,
Hache

[Steve.r]

Welcome to the forum,

There are loads of threads on everything you need to know. Try using the search facility (top right) to search threads already on your subject questions

[joebloggs]

have you lived together for the 7 months?

possible if you have lived together for 2yrs akin to marriage she could apply for a unmarried partner visa.

http://www.visalogic.net/united-king...aspx?t=4&t2=24

[HACHE]

Thanks for the replies.
Yeah I have been using the search tools too, having a browse on this very comprehensive site.
Thought I'd also post a thread to invite more information.

In answer to the question, no, we haven't lived together. We've just been together for seven months, she's an hours drive from mine so our time together is a bit limited anyway..

[RickyR]

Hi Hache,

When I met my wife, she was also tied into a marriage with a husband she was no longer living with.
The annullment is a very big challenge to overcome, it's time consuming and expensive. Your girlfriend will need to find the right lawyer, as many will say they can do it, but without experience could screw up the whole process. If the husband supports the annullment in any way, then you won't get it as that treated as collusion. Crazy process, but with the right lawyer and a decent amount of cash it can be achieved in less then 12 months, but is known to take upto 3 or 4 years. Ours took nearly 2 years, although thats on part because of naviety to not paying any special contributions to the judge's holiday fund.

Once the annullment is complete, it should be fairly straightforward if you keep all the evidence of regular contact, visiting the Philippines and the ongoing strength of your relationship.

You never know, you might decide that you want to live in the Philippines after a holiday!

[HACHE]

Thanks for the reply Ricky,
Our feelings are strong for each other for sure , but we do have an awfull lot of misunderstandings, and right now, I am not sure we'll get that far anyway...guess it needs to be a very strong relationship with a lot of trust on both sides to be able to stick it out..and of course a big pile of cash.

[RickyR]

There always are misunderstandings in mixed race/nationality relationships, but by being patient with one another you can definately overcome them.

Even today, I still have challenges with my wife where she means one thing and I think another or vice versa... But love conquers all!

[tanga]

Annulment is not an easy process. It requires a lot of patience and money. That's the easy part, getting the right attorney is the difficult part.
Be sure you know what you are getting into before you start the process
Best of luck

[HACHE]

Thanks for replying.
I told her the other day that it's a big thing, sitting around in limbo waiting for something that may not happen (anulment).
At which point she told me that she had seen a solicitor here, and has been advised that she can initiate a divorce here in the UK, that will allow her to be free in this country to marry. Said that her hubby would just have to sign something.
All seems a bit odd to me. I've been used the SEARCH function and read up a fair amount of posts on this type of thing, and at present I am far from believing that it is as simple as that....

[HACHE]

Thanks for the replies.
Aparently, there is "another way".
She told me she has been advised here in the UK ( by a solicitor, and citizens advice bureau), that she can apply and get a divorce here, which will take 3-6 months, all it require is for her husband in the philippines to sign some papers. Then, she's free to marry here.
Hmm, this doesn't sound right, and surely can't be that simple.
I have actually been using the search function in the other sub-forums, and have came up with a number of opinions, but any more information that people have regarding this is most welcome, and I thank in advance any information people are willing to share..
Thanks,
Hache

[HACHE]

Hi Everyone,
My first post was about the Anulment process and what I can expect.
Firstly I would like to add, that I have used the search function before posting this question, its only fair to use that and do some work myself before asking others.
Okay, the background behind this, is that my girlfriend of seven months presently on a student visa until august 2013 ( who is still married, with her 15yr old son living with his father), has told me she has been to Citizens Advice Bureua, and also a solicitor here in the UK, and she has been told, that she can do a divorce here, all her hubby needs to do is sign some papers, and over a course of 3-6 months ( cost £2000-£3000) it should be finalised with her free to marry here in the UK. To my mind I find it hard to believe it is that simple ( if so why would so many go through the long drawn out anulment process?)
My search results come up with the fact that the "divorce" here in the UK, won't of course be recognised in the Philippines and there for in the eyes of her home country she will still be married. Then there is an issue of her being guilty of biggamy.
But regardless of this, I still cannot quite think that she would be easily free to marry here, settle here etc....
The threads and posts regarding this are a few years old so I would be very grateful if anyone knows any more on this 'complicated' issue.
My next port of call, would be a solicitor specialising in this sort of thing ( not the one who advised her)
Thanks, in advance, of any information people can share.
Regards,
Hache.

[RickyR]

It's not completely simple, but once she has been resident for at least a year in the UK some options may present themselves which would allow her to conduct the divorce there. Factors taken into account include domicile and habitual residence.

The question is though, is the divorce valid in the Philippines and would it be recognised under Philippines law? Who knows, but she would be free to remarry in the UK at least.

[RickyR]

Oh, and just one more thing. You'd be wise to do quite a bit of searching online for the correct solicitor, one that has experience in these types of cases.
I wouldn't go to a normal family solicitor, it would probably end up costing you more whilst they try to research and understand the complicated laws pertaining to it.

[grahamw48]

My Filipina ex and I divorced here but were originally married in the Phils, and then she got married to some bloke in Sweden....after she'd got her British citizenship.

That's all I know about it though.

Whether she's considered a bigamist in the Phils...who knows ?

[HACHE]

Thanks for the replies everyone.
I did read somewhere that if someone was domiciled in the UK for a period of time they could go down the path of this divorce route mentioned.
Although, I am no sure time as a student ( who's effectively here on a temporary basis ) that it would count.....
Think the next step would be for professional legal advice, and I agree with Ricky, that it's important to get such advice from an expert in this particular field.
All the replies and the time taken to do so is much appreciated, it's a great forum full of alot of good members, many posts on a variety of subjects and topics...
Regards,
Hache

[Terpe]

Hace, as others have said, generally anyone who has in effect been living here for a year can file for divorce.
Also, generally, for straightfroward cases the divorce can be done DIY for the cost of the court fees.
Again, generally, for straightfroward cases, the whole process can be completed in just a couple of months.
I believe that currently the court fees are £340 when you file the petition with the court and £45 when you apply for your final decree absolute.

Now the complexity levels begin and based on the information given it's not possible to say just how complex her case would be, nor how much it would cost.

Anyone can go to the County Court and simply request a 'divorce pack'. It's free and no questions asked or forms to complete. All the forms needed are included also some very informative booklets and step-by-step guide.
I suggest one of makes that visit and get one. You really will then understand the process and the requirements.
Alternatively you could download the forms needed.

There are a number of issue to consider.
1. The petitioner needs to prove irretrievable breakdown in one of five different ways. These are:-
- adultery
- unreasonable behaviour
- desertion for two years
- separation for two years with consent from the other party
- separation for five years where no consent is needed

2. In cases of adultery, not more than six months must have elapsed since the petitioner became aware of the adultery before the divorce petition is sent to the court.

3. In cases of unreasonable behaviour, it MAY be possible to get around this 6 month rule, if the petitioner immediately left the spouse and went to live elsewhere. However, be informed that there will come a point when the time factor over 6 months will become unacceptable. Certainly not a year.

So the catch 22 is that she must be here for 1 years but will realistically only be able to petition on separation for two years with consent from the other party or separation for five years where no consent is needed.

The situation with the 15 year old son will also need to be settled.

Finally, if she could receive a divorce in UK, then as you say this would not be recognised at all in Philippines, where she would legally still be married. If she would remarry then again in Philippines legally she would be a bigamist. Great care would be needed in any dealings with the Philippine Embassy involving documentations/passports etc.

The position of the husband in Philippines would also be very fragile. Whereas the wife (your gf) could in fact remarry here, he would actually not be free to legally remarry.

Quite a lot to think about.

[HACHE]

Thanks Terpe, for taking the time and trouble for a lengthy and very informative reply.
As we all know, legal matters can go several ways and it's never black and white, certainly not as simple as she seems to think or has been lead to believe.
Regarding her situation, she had the child at an early age of 15 ( she is now 30), then got married a few years later, after some pressure from his family, then split up ... and went off and worked in Japan for a few years ( she overstayed and was deported) .....she has said sometime ago that she doesn't want to live or stay back home in the philippines, and I am aware that this alone is a big factor in her "aspirations"..

[Terpe]

Don't forget you also have replies here in your other post:-
http://filipinaroses.com/showthread....ee-to-re-marry

[HACHE]

Sorry if I had seemed impatient by starting a new thread on the same topics I mentioned here, but my initial attempts to post those replies above failed, they didnt display for a few days ( three days I think) so I decided to Start a new thread in the other section which luckily for me went on display immediately.
Thanks
Hache

[HACHE]

If the relationship progresses in the near future, I will seek legal advice from a lawyer specialising in this field, taking into careful consideration the points raised here, including the consequenses for her if/when she wants/needs to return to the philippines.
Should I go down that road, I will happily post here and share my findings
Hache

[Arthur Little]

Sorry if I had seemed impatient by starting a new thread on the same topics I mentioned here, but *my initial attempts to post those replies above failed, they didnt display for a few days ( three days I think) so I decided to Start a new thread in the other section which luckily for me went on display immediately.
Thanks
Hache

Hache ... belated to the filipino/uk community. To explain:- It is standard practice for the posts of all newcomers to be placed in a 'moderation' queue before appearing on the main forum - *hence the apparent delay. I have since taken the liberty of merging your two threads, in order to ensure the relevant correspondence is kept intact for others to .

[HACHE]

Hache ... belated to the filipino/uk community. To explain:- It is standard practice for the posts of all newcomers to be placed in a 'moderation' queue before appearing on the main forum - *hence the apparent delay. I have since taken the liberty of merging your two threads, in order to ensure the relevant correspondence is kept intact for others to .

Thank you, much appreciated

[sm1971]

Ah, Hache, I envy you. She is already here...

How long is she allowed to stay? Long enough to apply for permanent residency? Then she could just stay longer, become a UK citizen and divorce. Becoming a UK citizen = losing PH citizenship = she would be a foreign national in the Phils. The Phils do accept divorces by foreign nationals, you'd just have to wait long enough to get UK citizenship before she can divorce.

[Terpe]

............. The Phils do accept divorces by foreign nationals.......

Who told you that sm1971?
It's just not correct.
Valid divorces filed by foreign nationals in their own country are accepted and may be quite easily processed in Philippines when necessary

Hopefully you just misunderstood something there.
No offence intended

[sm1971]

Who told you that sm1971?
It's just not correct.
Valid divorces filed by foreign nationals in their own country are accepted and may be quite easily processed in Philippines when necessary

Erm... That's what I said? If a filipina/o wants a divorce the only way to get it is to become a foreign national first, then divorce in the new country, then file the paperwork in the Phils.

[Terpe]

... The Phils do accept divorces by foreign nationals....

Erm... That's what I said? If a filipina/o wants a divorce the only way to get it is to become a foreign national first, then divorce in the new country, then file the paperwork in the Phils.

Whoops! sorry sm1971
I mis-read that to read "do not".....

[HACHE]

Ah, Hache, I envy you. She is already here...

How long is she allowed to stay? Long enough to apply for permanent residency? Then she could just stay longer, become a UK citizen and divorce. Becoming a UK citizen = losing PH citizenship = she would be a foreign national in the Phils. The Phils do accept divorces by foreign nationals, you'd just have to wait long enough to get UK citizenship before she can divorce.

Wel she was originally here until Aug 2013. Now, here college is shutting ( they didn't get the "highly trusted" status now required by the UKBA)...the students have six months, during which time they need to find another college to transfer to.
Regarding staying here long enough for permenant residency, ie appyling for Indefinate Leave to Remain, I believe her time as a student here doesn't count towards the time that entitless her to apply.

[grahamw48]

Yep, I think ILR only follows 'Settlement' type visa.