Quick question - regarding this minimum income, could "benefits in kind" be counted?

[Iani]

Hi

I thought this was worth asking. I got my P11 this week, and noticed that my employer pays part of my salary as "benefits in kind"

If anyone isn't familiar with what this is, it's where an employer instead of paying their staff straight wages, they may give them a subsidised loan, or a company car etc.
Most companies (of course) then just don't pay as much It's called a benefit in kind - and is treated for tax reasons as income, rightly so as this would otherwise open up a tax loophole you could drive a spaceship through, never mind a tank (Oh we won't pay you any wages, but we'll pay your mortgage, give you Sainsburys vouchers, give you a car.......you can just imagine).

Well I can't find it anywhere, but could this not be classed as income and added to salary to make this 18K?

My suspicion is it can't - maybe it would be too complicated for the poor people at UKBA to understand, and it certainly would be too complex for a politician!

Just a thought - because it's income saved and in all fairness, it should be classed as salary - but no-one ever said life was fair.

[Terpe]

Iani,
It's been some time since my connections with HMRC, but your P11/P11D benefits are actually set against tax. Means your gross income is not impacted at all. Only your net.
If your gross income was £18000 flat but your company paid for your car, your food and your accommodation it would still make no difference as your gross income would still be £18000. Even if your total tax bill was reduced to zero. Still no change to your Gross.
It was a great idea and well done for that. Please do stay positive, there are going to be some big legal challenges to come.
Don't forget to look out for some convenient part time work. Sorry mate just reminding.
I really do know how it feels to be think you are helpless under immigration rules.
But love will always find a way

[lastlid]

Funny that as I think that Dave was just talking about paying benefits in kind in an attempt to reduce benefits....

[lastlid]

Proposals outlined by Mr Cameron included:

Out-of-work benefits linked to wages rather than inflation, if wages are lower
A cap on the amount people can earn and still live in a council house
Reduce the current £20,000 housing benefit limit
Stopping the out-of-work being better off by having children
Consider paying some benefits "in kind" rather than in cash
Expecting parents on income support to prepare for work while children have free nursery care
Getting the physically able to do full-time community work after a period out of work
Sickness benefit claimants should take steps to improve their health

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-18575453

Whats good for the goose.....is good for the gander....

[Terpe]

Funny that as I think that Dave was just talking about paying benefits in kind in an attempt to reduce benefits....

How do you mean lastlid? Maybe you have an good idea in the making.
Just remember that benefits in kind only impact tax and not gross income.
Of course bonuses and similar payments are another issue. That is an actual income and can be counted.

[lastlid]

I just mean that if Dave Cameron can count benefits in kind in lieu of monetary benefit payments then the reverse ought to stand when counting what an applicant earns....IanI could then do exactly as he suggested.....

It's called a benefit in kind - and is treated for tax reasons as income, rightly so as this would otherwise open up a tax loophole you could drive a spaceship through, never mind a tank (Oh we won't pay you any wages, but we'll pay your mortgage, give you Sainsburys vouchers, give you a car.......you can just imagine).

Well I can't find it anywhere, but could this not be classed as income and added to salary to make this 18K?

Ref the BBC article...in Post #4

[lastlid]

If I or anybody were paid luncheon vouchers (do they still do them?) then I could potentially add them to my gross income.....to give a simple example.



That way of thinking...but also by way of thinking along the lines of Dave's proposed new rules...

[lastlid]

Here is some anecdotal info that I can guarantee to be true. For many many years I travelled back and forth to Aberdeen from Manchester, once a month and flew out to an oil rig for two weeks at a time. My transportation was either paid for or I paid for it and claimed it back. That included taxis, rail hire car or air and of course any petrol. During my journey I was allowed to buy food (lunch, dinner, breakfast etc or all three) and then claimed it back. I also claimed for any hotel outlay. There were some other expenses to go along with those. I never paid any tax on any of it. In addition I ate as much as I wanted at the rig site and the accomadation at the rig site including laundry etc was free. This is all quite normal and legal and above board and with the approval of HRMC. Whatever those sums came to a month, easily several hundred pounds, I never paid tax on and yet were effectively a part of my earnings. I would say that I earned considerably more, effectively than what appeared on my P60. Interestingly, in Norway the Norwegian oilworkers pay tax on the food they eat at the rig site etc so in their case those benefits are taxable.

If there is anyone who might want to include similar sums as part of their effort to beat the £18600 trap then why not go for that?! I use my own experience as an example but feel certain that some might be able to capitalise in the way you have indicated, IanI.

Might be worth a quick chat with an accountant or whatever. If it made all the difference and got me over the line as it were then I would be tempted to argue that I satisfied the £18600 requirement...

[Iani]

Thanks for that, well, I might try asking, but really - guess it's still the search for a part time job.
That isn't going so well, there's absolutely nothing in this town. I even know an 18 year old off to uni soon who has been looking for a Saturday job. He has been around every single shop, market stall and pub in town and drawn a blank.

Totally aside from my situation, this is barking. I mean - at one time, you could walk through that market and they would be pulling teens off the street to sell bananas on a Saturday. What the hell has changed! Oh well

[andy222]

Its all a bit of a grey area at the moment. I always thought income is income final.

[lastlid]

Its all a bit of a grey area at the moment. I always thought income is income final.

Well, I know what you mean. But David Cameron was only yesterday talking about payments of benefit by benefits in kind....so what is good for him should be good for the public....maybe...

Just a thought Andy...a chink of light at the end of the tunnel perhaps...maybe the case can be argued.......gross income plus benefits may not necessarily be seen the same in the visa application light as in the taxation light.

Think outside of the box.