Financial requirements, interesting query.

[Paulypoos1973]

Hi Folks,

Hope you can advise on this query, its impossible to get ANY advice/clarification from the UKBA and Im at my wits end...here is a cut and paste of the clarification I need, taken from an email, all comment/advice gratefully received.

-----


Dear Sir/Madam

I am requesting clarification of some rules relating to the UK spouse visa financial requirements regulations.

I understand that as of July 2012 I must be earning £18,600 to bring my Filipino wife to the UK to join me but its the process of how to prove I meet the criteria that confuses me. I believe that I submit 6 payslips, you take the one with the lowest pay on it (gross) and multiply that by 12 to get my yearly income. The problem is that like most folk I DONT GET PAID MONTHLY, I get paid every 28 DAYS, meaning I get 13 payments a year. Surely then multiplying by 12 gives an inaccurate representation of my yearly wage, what is the rule regarding this then as Im sure most folk applying will be affected. Do I submit 7 payslips and request that one is divided into 12 and a twelfth of it added onto each of the other 6 payslips?

It also worrys me that you take the LOWEST of 6 as the vast majority of my overtime is earned in the 3 or 4 months around the Christmas period. It could be the case that I do exceed £18,600 but NOT ACCORDING to your calculation, do you advise that in such circumstances I submit my P60 in April/May detailing my complete wage for the previous year as testament of my income? I believe that even WITH a P60 you STILL do the 6 month check so again it could be the case you have, on one hand, a P60 accurately stating I earn over £18,600 whilst on the other a bizarre, unreliable and inaccurate calculation saying I don't....on the basis of which you may unfairly reject a visa application.
---------------

I was married in May, had to fly back to the UK on the EVENING of our wedding day and not seeing my beloved wife till Feb :-(

These new rules have made my life HELL, I dont claim a thing, Im working many many hours (have no life outside of work) and its so depressing. I can honestly say that if I were face to face with Cameron or May I would spit in their faces.

[Steve.r]

Paul,
I cannot tell you the answer, but your questions are well formed and should receive an accurate answer. But knowing our systems I am sure you will get pushed from pillar to post before the UKBA give a direct answer.

Maybe Terpe can shine some light on your question.

[Paulypoos1973]

Thanks Steve,
Yes the UKBA website is a maze and seems deliberately complex, leading you around in circles without actually getting you anywhere. Oh its very simple to find links to shop suspected illegal immigrants or to get advice if your a student or employer but things are suspiciously complex for a spouse. After much searching Ive ended up sending the query to a number of people/departments/email addresses in the UKBA, direct to the immigration minister, to Theresa May but Im continually coming up against a brick wall. This disgusts me as Im just after clarification/advice, I pay these penpushers wages and they cant even answer a query. I suspect the buggers dont know the answer themselves or are under instructions to withhold any advice in an attempt to deter applications.

The last straw will be to contact my MP and ask her to contact UKBA for me, she is utterly useless and doesnt even reply to emails now.

[joebloggs]

£18,600/12 = £1550 a month, as you've posted, if any are less than this they will use that figure, if any are less than £1,550 a month you'll probably be refused as I believe there is no discretion on the figure.

unless you've got savings to make up the shortfall

[andy222]

Sorry mate you will get the same response (if you get one) as I did. If you dont earn the money required your wife cant come. Whether you are legally married or not they dont give a monkeys .

[ericthatcher]

hi paul, same problem with me. shortfall i only earned 16000 annual year, but hopely will change the rules next year haha i wish!

[bigmarco]

Hi Paul I understand your point as I get paid 4 weekly and like you have 13 pay days per year.
Wait to see what our experts say but I would be tempted to submit 7 payslips 6 months bank statements but also if possible a letter from your employer detailing your income and showing that you meet the financial requirement.

[Paulypoos1973]

Joebloggs/Andy .... you don't seem to grasp the point Im making and its similar to the UKBAs misunderstanding I believe, I DO earn over £1550 a month if you divide my yearly pay by the 13 times I get paid annually (every 28 days) but they want to disregard 1 months pay in the equation, essentially multiplying one payslip amount (1/13 of annual income) by 12 INSTEAD of 13. This isnt about my not earning enough, its about the UKBA using an incorrect procedure with those of us paid 13 times a year. Bigmarco, glad to see you understand the grey area here and Im sure you'll agree it will affect many people and needs verification. Looking forward to hearing from the experts.

[lastlid]

Hi Folks,

Hope you can advise on this query, its impossible to get ANY advice/clarification from the UKBA and Im at my wits end...here is a cut and paste of the clarification I need, taken from an email, all comment/advice gratefully received.

-----


Dear Sir/Madam

I am requesting clarification of some rules relating to the UK spouse visa financial requirements regulations.

I understand that as of July 2012 I must be earning £18,600 to bring my Filipino wife to the UK to join me but its the process of how to prove I meet the criteria that confuses me. I believe that I submit 6 payslips, you take the one with the lowest pay on it (gross) and multiply that by 12 to get my yearly income. The problem is that like most folk I DONT GET PAID MONTHLY, I get paid every 28 DAYS, meaning I get 13 payments a year. Surely then multiplying by 12 gives an inaccurate representation of my yearly wage, what is the rule regarding this then as Im sure most folk applying will be affected. Do I submit 7 payslips and request that one is divided into 12 and a twelfth of it added onto each of the other 6 payslips?

It also worrys me that you take the LOWEST of 6 as the vast majority of my overtime is earned in the 3 or 4 months around the Christmas period. It could be the case that I do exceed £18,600 but NOT ACCORDING to your calculation, do you advise that in such circumstances I submit my P60 in April/May detailing my complete wage for the previous year as testament of my income? I believe that even WITH a P60 you STILL do the 6 month check so again it could be the case you have, on one hand, a P60 accurately stating I earn over £18,600 whilst on the other a bizarre, unreliable and inaccurate calculation saying I don't....on the basis of which you may unfairly reject a visa application.
---------------

I was married in May, had to fly back to the UK on the EVENING of our wedding day and not seeing my beloved wife till Feb :-(

These new rules have made my life HELL, I dont claim a thing, Im working many many hours (have no life outside of work) and its so depressing. I can honestly say that if I were face to face with Cameron or May I would spit in their faces.

It looks like again, they haven't taken into account that some peoples pay doesn't follow perceived convention.

I used to earn an irregular income and always topped £18600 per annum by a country mile, but occasionally on one month in a year I might easily earn less than £1550. There are a lot of people out there like that.

I would be interested to see how you get on. It is a shame that they have not been a little more flexible in setting these new rules as someone who earns, say £40,000 in a year yet only £1500 in one month would get refused as the sponsor.

How absurd.

[Paulypoos1973]

£18,600/12 = £1550 a month, as you've posted, if any are less than this they will use that figure, if any are less than £1,550 a month you'll probably be refused as I believe there is no discretion on the figure.

unless you've got savings to make up the shortfall

They shouldnt be dividing by 12 but by 13 as each of my payslips represent 1/13 of a yearly wage.

[lastlid]

They shouldnt be dividing by 12 but by 13 as each of my payslips represent 1/13 of a yearly wage.

Like I said, the rules reflect a perceived convention and not reality.

[Paulypoos1973]

Agreed lastlid, clearly all of these sneaky measures are there to make as many folk unable to get a visa as possible.

[lastlid]

Agreed lastlid, clearly all of these sneaky measures are there to make as many folk unable to get a visa as possible.

Paul. Give a few immigration advisors a ring. See what they say. It may just be that your wife's application can be succesfully progressed under the spirit of the regs, if not to the letter. Some will give away a limited amount of free info to get the business. It will cost only the price of the phone calls.



I wonder how the HRMC will tax you for the year? You can be sure it will be on your gross yearly income and not on your minimum monthly income multiplied by 12 or by 13. I know that the HRMC and the UKBA aren't exactly one and the same but they are both government departments, are they not?

[lastlid]

Mind you, that is a strange one, 13 payslips each year, paid every 28 days. A bit like a bakers dozen.

[Paulypoos1973]

Exactly lastlid, at the end of the day they want to see a yearly income equal to or exceeding £18,600....if I have a years worth of payslips AND a P60 showing I meet the criteria I can't see how they could argue I don't earn enough, should they refuse my wife clearly my basis for an appeal would leave them with barely an argument to rely on.

[lastlid]

Exactly lastlid, at the end of the day they want to see a yearly income equal to or exceeding £18,600....if I have a years worth of payslips AND a P60 showing I meet the criteria I can't see how they could argue I don't earn enough, should they refuse my wife clearly my basis for an appeal would leave them with barely an argument to rely on.

I would like to think so. But of course its the extra time, hassle, agony and stress of an appeal that is out of order.

[Michael Parnham]

If I were you Paul, when applying for the 'visa' explain in your sponsers letter about your income, after all they have to read it and it can't do any harm!!

[Paulypoos1973]

Thanks Michael, certainly will be explaining it all to them....just trying to get OFFICIAL word from UKBA on their view of the situation.

Being paid every 28 days is very common in the UK, people call it monthly but its not...its every 28 days.

[lastlid]

This guy would no doubt make the UKBA regs heaps more easier to understand.



Stanley Unwin on settlement visa regulations would be a real gem. My number one choice for a solicitor.

[joebloggs]

Joebloggs/Andy .... you don't seem to grasp the point Im making and its similar to the UKBAs misunderstanding I believe, I DO earn over £1550 a month if you divide my yearly pay by the 13 times I get paid annually (every 28 days) but they want to disregard 1 months pay in the equation, essentially multiplying one payslip amount (1/13 of annual income) by 12 INSTEAD of 13. This isnt about my not earning enough, its about the UKBA using an incorrect procedure with those of us paid 13 times a year. Bigmarco, glad to see you understand the grey area here and Im sure you'll agree it will affect many people and needs verification. Looking forward to hearing from the experts.

i do see your point, but i dont make the rules, as unfair as they are,until some challenges them in court.

[mendoza82]

hi paul,me and my husband are in the same situation he get paid every 4 weeks 13 times a year,his monthly earning is less than 1550 but his p60 is more tha`t the minimum wage require,did u submit your p60 and a letter from your job stating how u get paid?coz im also very worried regarding this matter,i asked my husband to request a letter from his job explain how he get paid,hope it will work...anyway goodluck.

[lastlid]

i do see your point, but i dont make the rules, as unfair as they are,until some challenges them in court.

Or send Andy over with his baseball bat.

[lastlid]

Thanks Michael, certainly will be explaining it all to them....just trying to get OFFICIAL word from UKBA on their view of the situation.

Being paid every 28 days is very common in the UK, people call it monthly but its not...its every 28 days.

I have always been paid every calendar month. But don't disbelieve you.

That being the case, yes, the regs are infinitesimally daft.

[Paulypoos1973]

hi paul,me and my husband are in the same situation he get paid every 4 weeks 13 times a year,his monthly earning is less than 1550 but his p60 is more tha`t the minimum wage require,did u submit your p60 and a letter from your job stating how u get paid?coz im also very worried regarding this matter,i asked my husband to request a letter from his job explain how he get paid,hope it will work...anyway goodluck.

No, not submitting visa app for a month or two yet hence my trying to clarify this matter before then. As we are both in the same situation it will be interesting to keep track of each others progress, good luck.

[Paulypoos1973]

i do see your point, but i dont make the rules, as unfair as they are,until some challenges them in court.

I know you dont make the rules and I know the rules are unfair, this is about clarification of how the UKBA deals with a situation where someone isnt paid STRICTLY monthly.

[lastlid]

I know you dont make the rules and I know the rules are unfair, this is about clarification of how the UKBA deals with a situation where someone isnt paid STRICTLY monthly.

Clarification? Thats easy. As far as the UKBA are concerned such people that are paid every 28 days don't exist. :big grin:

Same for those on an irregular income. They never heard of 'em.

[rusty]

Unfortunatly it's a "one size fits all" when it comes to some of the requirements and application forms.

They have tried to cover most types of payment, such as, employed and self employed but looks like they missed some.

[bigmac]

I can honestly say that if I were face to face with Cameron or May I would spit in their faces.

hmmm well--yes--i fully sympathise with you and understand your anger----but to put that in your email? you may well find the reader earns less than you do---and let his finger touch the delete button.

[mendoza82]

No, not submitting visa app for a month or two yet hence my trying to clarify this matter before then. As we are both in the same situation it will be interesting to keep track of each others progress, good luck.

yup sure,we are also planning to submit same target time as yours.by the way from where here in the phil your wife coming from?im in manila but originally from cebu..hope to chat with your wife..

[rusty]

I believe that I submit 6 payslips, you take the one with the lowest pay on it (gross) and multiply that by 12 to get my yearly income.

I have not fully read all of the requirements so where does it say that in the requirements?

Taken from Appendix FM-SE - Family members - specified evidence

http://www.ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk/policyandlaw/immigrationlaw/immigrationrules/appendix-fmse/

2. In respect of salaried employment in the UK, all of the following evidence must be provided:

(b) The P60 for the relevant period or periods of employment relied upon (if issued).

(c) Wage slips covering:
(i) a period of 6 months prior to the date of application if the applicant has been employed by their current employer for at least 6 months; or
(ii) any period of salaried employment in the period of 12 months prior to the date of application if the applicant has been employed by their current employer for less than 6 months.

(d) A letter from the employer(s) who issued the wage slips at paragraph 2(c) confirming:

(i) the person's employment and gross annual salary;
(ii) the length of their employment;
(iii) the period over which they have been or were paid the level of salary relied upon in the application; and
(iv) the type of employment (permanent, fixed-term contract or agency).
(e) A signed contract of employment for employment currently held.
(f) Monthly personal bank statements corresponding to the same period(s) as the wage slips at paragraph 2(c), showing that the salary has been paid into an account in the name of the person or in the name of the person and their partner jointly.


As long as you supply the evidence above, backed up with you letter of support detailing you salary arrangements, then I cannot see any grounds for refusal.