On culture shock, horror, and disgust: Some of the emotions from which I'm still reeling

[dontpushme]

Yeah, we have our own house now. It took us a while to find one we liked, but the relief has been worth it!

I appreciate the kind words, Michael. TBH, when I first joined the forum, I wasn't sure I'd stay. However, I really have enjoyed the banter, discussions, and camaraderie here.

[Dedworth]

I strongly suggest you and your husband get your own place. It can't be healthy for you living under the same roof. Even if it means a small flat, you will have control over your own lives then.

Looks like they have :-

My husband and I have been living in our own home since March

[RicIre]

With all due respect to Fred, Ric, and tiger, you're all way too old for me and the chances of us getting married had we all still been single are as close to null as you can imagine. But go ahead and keep patting yourselves on the back for being so lucky. To each his/her own, eh?

Not old according to this thread though >

http://filipinaroses.com/showthread....Age-difference

[SimonH]

Not old according to this thread though >

http://filipinaroses.com/showthread....Age-difference

Let's not turn this into a slanging match

dontpushme said "with all due respect" and that you'd be too old for her Perfectly polite and eloquent retaliation for what you initially said

I'm sure no-one is trying to cause offence

[RicIre]

Let's not turn this into a slanging match

dontpushme said "with all due respect" and that you'd be too old for her Perfectly polite and eloquent retaliation for what you initially said

I'm sure no-one is trying to cause offence

Exactly, it's silly when people start generalizing. Anyway I'll leave this thread now

[Trefor]

Looks like they have :-

My husband and I have been living in our own home since March,

I missed that

dontpushme - just create your own mini-world and ignore the in-laws.

[dontpushme]

I missed that

dontpushme - just create your own mini-world and ignore the in-laws.

That's alright! IT happens to the best of us.

Exactly, it's silly when people start generalizing. Anyway I'll leave this thread now

I was trying to address your comments without stooping to your level.

However, you give me no choice. My husband joined this forum before I did. Sadly, he has long since stopped coming back because, in his opinion, the men here don't want women they can't cow. I don't necessarily agree with him as I've had many fruitful debates and discussions with so many of the wonderful men here through the years.

Unfortunately, there are times when bad apples like you prove my husband right. You've done nothing to further the discussion on this thread, you've come in several times just to post nasty comments and personal jabs, and you've been a complete ass this whole time. Of your 39 measly forum posts since joining last year, 7 were nasty comments on this thread.

Thanks for spending about a fifth of your time on my thread. This discussion obviously means that much to you. Now I would thank you, sir, to go away and harass someone else.

[lordna]

That's alright! IT happens to the best of us.



I was trying to address your comments without stooping to your level.

However, you give me no choice. My husband joined this forum before I did. Sadly, he has long since stopped coming back because, in his opinion, the men here don't want women they can't cow. I don't necessarily agree with him as I've had many fruitful debates and discussions with so many of the wonderful men here through the years.

Unfortunately, there are times when bad apples like you prove my husband right. You've done nothing to further the discussion on this thread, you've come in several times just to post nasty comments and personal jabs, and you've been a complete ass this whole time. Of your 39 measly forum posts since joining last year, 7 were nasty comments on this thread.

Thanks for spending about a fifth of your time on my thread. This discussion obviously means that much to you. Now I would thank you, sir, to go away and harass someone else.

Well said!

[dontpushme]

To everyone else, I would like to apologise and assure you that I see nothing wrong with age gaps between loving partners. Like I said, to each his/her own. Just because my age gap limit is a maximum of five years doesn't mean there aren't myriad women out there open to much wider gaps.

[Michael Parnham]

That's alright! IT happens to the best of us.



I was trying to address your comments without stooping to your level. However, you give me no choice. My husband joined this forum before I did. Sadly, he has long since stopped coming back because, in his opinion, the men here don't want women they can't cow. I don't necessarily agree with him as I've had many fruitful debates and discussions with so many of the wonderful men here through the years. Unfortunately, there are times when bad apples like you prove my husband right. You've done nothing to further the discussion on this thread, you've come in several times just to post nasty comments and personal jabs, and you've been a complete ass this whole time. Of your 39 measly forum posts since joining last year, 7 were nasty comments on this thread. Thanks for spending about a fifth of your time on my thread. This discussion obviously means that much to you. Now I would thank you, sir, to go away and harass someone else.

Well RicIre, retire!

[SimonH]

Well RicIre, retire!

or maybe RetIre

[Arthur Little]

I've never witnessed shifting gears in my life or ever heard the words shifting gears used in that way!

Tbh, Michael ... I'd never even heard the expression used in relation to "adjusting one's privates" until I on this thread!

[dontpushme]

Tbh, Michael ... I'd never even heard the expression used in relation to "adjusting one's privates" until I on this thread!

Oh goodness! I don't blame either of you. The only times I've ever heard that term used for that action was with my high school buddies. If you think about it though, the term makes sense.

[Michael Parnham]

Oh goodness! I don't blame either of you. The only times I've ever heard that term used for that action was with my high school buddies. If you think about it though, the term makes sense.

Made me !

[FilipinaDiver]

Oh goodness! I don't blame either of you. The only times I've ever heard that term used for that action was with my high school buddies. If you think about it though, the term makes sense.

I have once used that term to a doctor colleague of mine, he is Muslim and I just got tired seeing him changing gears. I caught him at the start of a 12 hour shift and it just ruins your day so shouted at him cheekily "Doc, is that 4th gear?" Lo and behold he turned pink like a lobster.

[Arthur Little]

Oh goodness! I don't blame either of you. The only times I've ever heard that term used for that action was with my high school buddies. If you think about it though, the term makes sense.

... it does, Denise - having thought about it - !

[dontpushme]

I have once used that term to a doctor colleague of mine, he is Muslim and I just got tired seeing him changing gears. I caught him at the start of a 12 hour shift and it just ruins your day so shouted at him cheekily "Doc, is that 4th gear?" Lo and behold he turned pink like a lobster.

HAHAHAHAHA! That just cracked me up! I wish I had the gumption to try a line like that the next time someone does it in my presence.

[sars_notd_virus]

This is nothing personal and if I hit a little close to home, I'd love to hear your thoughts on why I'm justifiably wrong to feel the way I do.

I just moved to the UK in September 2013, and at the moment, I'm finding the culture shock a bit more than what I experienced when I moved to the US. I don't really know whether what I've seen so far are of the English culture, or local culture, or whatever. Forgive me for ranting, but I've been holding this all in for months, and I have been alone in this country with no one who understands where I'm coming from. I'd appreciate your input on a few topics.

1. Sanitation/hygiene (or the severe lack thereof)

Why do you use spit to 'clean' a smudge off skin or objects? No hand-washing, no regard for the millions of bacteria in each person's mouth, no regard for the millions of bacteria on the shoe that was just rubbed with spit.
Why don't people wash hands after using the toilet or before touching food, or after touching raw meat?
Why do people push crumbs or spilled food from the table directly on to the floor, disregarding how sticky the floor will get?

Why do people put shopping bags directly on the ground, then put them directly on the kitchen counters where you also directly prepare sandwiches and salads? I actually ended up in an ambulance and spending the night at the hospital because of the filthy food I've had to eat (couldn't refuse the sandwich without looking rude). I guess violently expelling everything in my GI tract was better than my baby getting deformed or even dying because of the nasty contaminated food. I've never been that sick before, despite coming from a farm (with no running water) in Bicol.

2. Speaking of hygiene, please don't "shift gears"

Why, oh why, do men constantly rearrange their junk??? It's disgusting and rude, and highly offensive. I can't believe the number of people I see doing this in public! Even my sister complained about this. Her office in Manila recently had an English visitor. Everyone treated the man warmly and he went out drinking with my sister's team, composed mainly of men, a few times. They let him pour everyone's shots, and shared their bar snacks with him. To everyone's extreme disgust, the last drinking night before he left, he reached into his pants, rearranged himself, and then sniffed his hand. My sister immediately commandeered the ice bucket so he wouldn't touch the tongs again, someone else took over the bottle of whatever alcohol they were drinking, and there were horrified looks exchanged all around the oblivious visitor. After a minute or so, the one gay person in the group managed to ask the guy to please go to the toilet next time he wanted to rearrange himself as it just wasn't acceptable in the Philippines to do it in public. The man had the gall to joke that sometimes men just needed to rearrange because they were sweaty and itchy.

The next day, at the airport, my sister just waved goodbye instead of shaking his hand.

Unfortunately for all the men in her team, they couldn't escape his handshake. As soon as the man had walked away and was out of earshot, every last one of them doused everything he had touched in rubbing alcohol. That is how revolting we Filipinos find crotch-grabbing. I know that even if the guy had rearranged himself through his clothes, everyone would still have found it disgusting because it was done in public.

When I was in High School, all the boys in my year avoided this one boy because he constantly rearranged himself.

No one ever high-fived him or shook his hand. This boy was a campus heartthrob, owing to his athletic skills, but the boys couldn't stand him and called him kamboy, short for kambiyo boy, whenever the girls were out of earshot (kambiyo means to shift gears). The girls in my year still don't know about this (it's been 15 years since we graduated), and I only know because I was one of the boys and witnessed everything myself. I can honestly say that "shifting gears" is one UK practice I will never stop being grossed out by. They're called private parts for a reason.

2. Waste and a "disposable" attitude, and what is it with the aversion to old things?

I'm sure you all know that Filipinos cook enough to have leftovers. We do this so that if someone drops by unexpectedly, we have enough food to share, and so that we can have leftovers the next day. From what I've seen here in the UK, anything that isn't eaten the first time around is thrown away. When my husband and I lived with my in-laws, it was a constant struggle to keep my food from being thrown away because "it's been on the counter for two hours". Bread was thrown away because someone accidentally microwaved it for more than 20 seconds. Any food that was getting close to its Best By date was thrown away, regardless of its actual condition. Even Spanish chorizo was thrown away because of the Best By date despite the fact that the damn sausage had been cured without refrigeration for much longer than the one week I had it in the fridge.

The waste I've seen doesn't stop at food. I had to fight tooth and nail to get my in-laws' 12-year-old leather sofas because my mother-in-law flatly refused to give them to me and insisted that they were going straight to the tip. There was absolutely nothing wrong with the sofas that leather cleaner and conditioner, and a needle wouldn't fix. Her excuse for mocking my desperate pleadings was that the sofas were old and she would never in a million years give me anything old. This still doesn't make sense as she goes to car boot sales every week and buys us junk that we neither want nor need but that she foists on us anyway. In any case, I've had to give up on her beautiful dining set that she really did take straight to the tip just because it was old. Fortunately for me and the sofas, my father-in-law spoke up for me and said I could have them. He doesn't need to know how many times I cried over the potential loss of good leather (my dad used to tan lambskin and sheepskin from our livestock, and my family has always had a thing for leather).

3. Bragging about "we invented the English language" while not being able to speak or spell the language

My in-laws, mostly the ones in the older generations, enjoy teasing me about my "American pronunciation". I usually have to hold my tongue and let them have their fun because as a Filipina, I'd feel terrible talking back to my elders. However, it really grates on me that the people who pick on me the most seem to have terrible diction, no clue about grammar, and worse pronunciation than even FOB Filipinos. It takes me one to two seconds to understand when people say things like "lickle" (little), "me moom" (my Mum), "'e were at the market" (He was at the market), "we was outdoors" (We were outdoors), "'e learned me me numbers" (He taught me my numbers), and "give it me" (Give it to me), to name a few. As annoying as the lack of proper grammar is, it's even worse when I get laughed at for not understanding people the first time.

The teasing has lessened since I decided to correct people's assumptions when they told me "aluminium" was the correct way to say the word and "aluminum" was the stupid American way. (Aluminum was the name the scientist who discovered the element gave it, but other people later decided to change the name to aluminium because aluminum didn't match the popular nomenclature trend of giving elements names that ended in -ium.) I guess it also helped that I've been passive-aggressively commenting to my in-laws about the terrible English of strangers I encounter while out and about.

4. Lack of knowledge regarding health

Twice during my pregnancy, my mother-in-law insisted that I sleep in the same bed as my sick husband. He only had a cold, but a simple cold in the Philippines is very different from a cold in the UK. Ours don't include coughs, headaches, nausea, or achy joints. When my father-in-law suggested my husband sleep on the sofa and I told my mother-in-law that a cold would make my asthma worse, she went all "over my dead body" on everyone, and told me that viruses were just one of the things families shared. I was pregnant and had just moved over, so I had no antibodies yet for the specific strains of cold viruses my husband had. Seriously, who in their right mind forces a pregnant woman to get sick?? Maybe it's just because my family is chockful of doctors, medical workers, and scientists, but I have always known that you do not play with the health of a pregnant woman. The second time she made me sleep in the same bed as my sick husband, I actually was sick for two weeks, and I almost whipped out my credit card and bought a plane ticket home. I was this close to leaving my husband because it felt like he didn't even know his responsibility to protect his wife and child from harmful lunatics. I had already been suffering from mild asthma since I moved because I wasn't used to all the carpeting, and the nasty-ass English cold (and everything that came with it) just ensured that my breathing was even more laboured. Has the UK really not learned from the numerous outbreaks and epidemics throughout the centuries that when one person is sick, you're supposed to try to keep him from infecting others?

5. "That's women's work", aka How to raise men to cling to women's apron strings

In the Philippines, our women take very good care of the men. However, this does not excuse men from learning how to cook, clean, sew, and do general housework. Some men do get teased for being "under the saya", which literally translates to "under the skirt" but figuratively means "under the woman's thumb". This jest has nothing to do with the man knowing how to do housework, but everything to do with who wears the pants in the family. Now, I have just had a conversation with my husband's Nana, who confirmed my observation that boys here are not expected to help out around the house. This leads to men having absolutely no housekeeping skills. I asked Nana what happens if a bachelor loses a shirt button or needs to have a hem fixed. She just replied that he'd get his mother or some other woman to do it for him. She gave me the same answer when I asked about laundry, ironing, cooking , cleaning, and all the other things that Filipino men are expected to learn. This really strikes me as a very backward way of thinking. Why do you, the First-Worlders, have such sexist upbringings? In my family, my brother is the best sewer and the best ironer. His stitches are small and even, and when he irons, the creases are as crisp as any military uniform's. No one ever questions his masculinity just because he's also a very good cook or because when he cleans something, he always leaves it spotless. Over here though, my husband is crap at anything in the household, and isn't afraid to admit it. He can't even hold a kitchen knife properly, and when I ask him to slice something, he either uses a chopping motion (which just squashes the veg) or saws at it (which tears the meat apart). Really, why do you raise adult boys (not men) who can't do anything for themselves and who are destined to run to a woman for every little thing? Do you like being so dependent on your mothers for everything?

6. Treating adult children as if they were minors

Back home, if a person were at uni and still had their mother come to school to handle the enrollment or clearance paperwork, or any kind of mundane uni task, he would be teased for being a big baby who couldn't handle his own affairs. Heck, from the age of 13, I was dropped off at the school with a blank check for my tuition and told to handle my enrollment myself. None of my friends ever had their mother doing it all for them either. In contrast, my husband's auntie is currently in Newcastle and she's brought a printer and a scanner with her so she can handle all the paperwork because her 21-year-old daughter is about to finish school. Is this because of a lack of trust? Is this because you really do raise all your kids to be reliant on their mothers? Where's the self-reliance they should have learned by now?

Aside from doing every little thing for your kids, why are the older generation so pushy? I'm 31 years old, have been earning and budgeting my own money since I was 7, and was raised to be self-reliant in and out of the house. I know my own opinions and I know what it takes to run a household efficiently.

Unfortunately, all my older generation female in-laws seem to think I'm 6 and have no mind. I constantly have to field unsolicited advice, and I'm really starting to hate all the pushiness. My husband and I have been living in our own home since March, and at least three days in a week, I have to endure my in-laws trying to force me to arrange my house their way or do tasks their (inefficient) way. It's just the women though. I have had absolutely no trouble from the men. They seem to be resigned to letting the women have their way all the time. What is it with the women in your country treating everyone like children, and why don't the men ever speak up??

Okay, my rant's over. I still don't get the UK. I'm not adjusting as well as I'd like to. My family back home is livid that I'm "being poisoned" and am being treated like a child. I really want to know whether all these things are a UK thing, or that I just have weird in-laws, or that these are a Northwest England thing.

Can anyone shed some light on some of the cultural differences I've just mentioned? I'm really missing home because all I can see about the people here are that they are unsanitary, cross-contaminating, wasteful, pushy, and their ideas about health are stuck in the Dark Ages. Still can't believe I'm the Third-Worlder and I'm the only one who seems to see the problem.

That's a big tar brush you've got!!

I don't agree with most of your post but then again that is your rant.

All I can say is, you should have a bit of knowledge of England before you come here. Anyway, give yourself a chance - if you still don't like it in more months to come, it's not a law to stay here or you can always try moving to a more affluent area.

[gWaPito]

Right had to speak up - I disagree with nearly all the members on here praising this post

It is well written and concise but my god, moan, moan, moan.

If I was to complain about the Philippines I would be lambasted on here and told I don't have to go, it's my choice.

I will mention a couple of things - one, the sanitation is disgusting, even the malls - having to rush to a proper loo in a well known mall, I was horrified to find no toilet paper anywhere and filipinos having a poo and not even washing their hands

The food is bloody awful most of it, chickens before they are even born, stinky fish everywhere - hey lets eat it's eyes yum yum

That's all I'm going to say as I actually love the Philippines and learnt to adapt when there. Never slagged it off!

Generalising to that extent is over the top and it sounds to me like the lady has real issues - perhaps a bit OCD - and not willing to adapt to a new country, in laws and way of life.

Absolutely ..I find this back slapping nauseating

When I first married we lived with our inlaws...big mistake, we fell out them and didn't talk to them for a couple of years. You don't live with your inlaws out of choice...if you do, you abide by their rules..if you don't like it, get out...which is what we did. Work is more plentiful now than what it was in the early 80s so there's no excuse

[Arthur Little]

• Your points about " English " grammar are well taken. *There is a counter - argument that so long as the written or spoken sentences are understood, strict grammatical rules are NOT as important as they used to be. The idiom of today is the grammar of tomorrow !

... *more's the pity!

[Arthur Little]

... there's no excuse

Whilst innumerable differences between peoples' accents (and in my own case, increasing deafness) can (and often do) [understandably] make verbal communication difficult to follow, those same excuses cannot, IMO, be applied to poorly composed grammar, spelling and/or punctuation that is either written or typed ... if those basic skills are properly taught in schools - which, believe me, they most certainly were throughout the ordinary State Primary System back
in my day!

Personally, I blame the prevailing ubiquitous use of mobile phones and the resultant reliance on 'text speak' for causing the current sloppiness!

[London_Manila]

That's alright! IT happens to the best of us.



I was trying to address your comments without stooping to your level.

However, you give me no choice. My husband joined this forum before I did. Sadly, he has long since stopped coming back because, in his opinion, the men here don't want women they can't cow. I don't necessarily agree with him as I've had many fruitful debates and discussions with so many of the wonderful men here through the years.

Unfortunately, there are times when bad apples like you prove my husband right. You've done nothing to further the discussion on this thread, you've come in several times just to post nasty comments and personal jabs, and you've been a complete ass this whole time. Of your 39 measly forum posts since joining last year, 7 were nasty comments on this thread.

Thanks for spending about a fifth of your time on my thread. This discussion obviously means that much to you. Now I would thank you, sir, to go away and harass someone else.

Love it

[dontpushme]

That's a big tar brush you've got!!

I don't agree with most of your post but then again that is your rant.

All I can say is, you should have a bit of knowledge of England before you come here. Anyway, give yourself a chance - if you still don't like it in more months to come, it's not a law to stay here or you can always try moving to a more affluent area.

I know it looks like a lot to take in, but points 1, 2, and 4 all pertain to health, hygiene, and sanitation; points 5 and 6 pertain to how the younger generation is raised or treated by the older generation; and point 3 is just about the frustration I feel being corrected when I'm not wrong and the people correcting me don't even know what's right.

I agree that it would've been better had I known more before moving, but for most of the last 6 years, the plan was for us to live in Manila. We had talked about it, and I was so sure the plan wouldn't change that when I moved back to the Philippines from the US, I gave away all my winter clothes and prepared for my husband's move. The reason I've gotten so desperate as to ask for insight from practical strangers is that out here, the only people I have are my in-laws. I'm not really going to get objective answers from them, I think.

What does money have to do with any of this?

Absolutely ..I find this back slapping nauseating

When I first married we lived with our inlaws...big mistake, we fell out them and didn't talk to them for a couple of years. You don't live with your inlaws out of choice...if you do, you abide by their rules..if you don't like it, get out...which is what we did. Work is more plentiful now than what it was in the early 80s so there's no excuse

I'm sorry you feel that way. It may be that negative comments about the Philippines aren't allowed on this forum, but I personally have never lambasted or bashed anyone for their valid comments about my country or my people, whether they be positive or negative. Maybe now's a good time to discuss why the negative comments aren't allowed here.

As regards the falling out, that's exactly why I'm here asking for help. Look at post #67 and you'll see I have no problem telling someone exactly what I think of him. Unless I care about that person, that is. I've been miserable because I adore my mother-in-law. She is a very kind, thoughtful, sweet, big-hearted, lovely, giving person, and she is beautiful inside and out. Unfortunately, she's also been a threat to my and my baby's health. The whole time I lived with my in-laws, I followed her rules to the letter, including and up to staying awake during the day even though I was pregnant and I worked nights. She insisted that it wasn't good for anyone to sleep during the day so I stayed awake for her knowing I'd be a bit braindead while working. During that time, I was sick more often than usual, but I followed her rules anyway. As for getting out, that's what we did as soon as we could.

your family is chockful ( sic )

LOL. I just noticed this. I've always been partial to the shorter version of the word, but I take it chock-full is the English spelling?

[RickyR]

I find the OPs post interesting, it certainly resonates with me.
I do get quite upset about hygiene, I think sometimes the UK in general deserves its bad reputation for crooked/yellow teeth and bad toilet habits. I cannot understand why the UK hasn't adopted bidets so much, and how many people fail to wash their hands after using the toilet...

That being said, I do get the impression that the OP is surrounded by a quiet naive and possibly 'rough' extended family.

I agree with Rosie's comment that the practices the OP has observed are certainly not widespread in my circle of friends and unlikely widespread in most of the other people on the forums family or friends.

As for the interference and rudeness from the extended family, it's time for your husband to grow up and be a man.

[purple]

Hi dontpushme!
Congratulations on your bub.

Sorry to hear your predicaments here in the UK.

Like what Rosie said, English people have different standards like the rest of the people in the world we cannot generalized them all just because one is Middle Eastern looking doesn't have to be a terrorist.

I think your husband needs to grow a back bone or you may have serious issues in the future.

One thing I know about the English is that most of them are polite which could be good and bad, depends on how you take it.

And no, my husband cooks well and does whatever he can to help me out. I was away to the Philippines for a week and he did great. My in laws are there when we need them but none of those things where they will make judgement on what I do etc.

Communicate is the key here.


But on the other hand.. being pregnant etc thus makes you hormonal and loses your proper reasoning.

Good luck!

[raynaputi]

I find the OPs post interesting, it certainly resonates with me.
I do get quite upset about hygiene, I think sometimes the UK in general deserves its bad reputation for crooked/yellow teeth and bad toilet habits. I cannot understand why the UK hasn't adopted bidets so much, and how many people fail to wash their hands after using the toilet...

That being said, I do get the impression that the OP is surrounded by a quiet naive and possibly 'rough' extended family.

I agree with Rosie's comment that the practices the OP has observed are certainly not widespread in my circle of friends and unlikely widespread in most of the other people on the forums family or friends.

As for the interference and rudeness from the extended family, it's time for your husband to grow up and be a man.

Before I arrived here in the UK, Keith installed a bidet for me. Now, he doesn't want to stay in hotels without bidets! He's a convert now..hahaha

[jane2009]

Next time before you moved to a new place do some research��������

[Michael Parnham]

Next time before you moved to a new place do some research��������

Those that do research the UK, still say it's not what they expected!

[jane2009]

Those that do research the UK, still say it's not what they expected!

That's right people always moan anyway! Lol... Why can't they try to live in Bronx New York that might be the place for them! Hahaha

[raynaputi]

That's right people always moan anyway! Lol... Why can't they try to live in Bronx New York that might be the place for them! Hahaha

Well, the OP used to live in the US so she probably knows what's like living there.

In my case, I did research before I came to UK and it wasn't also what I expected. I did moan about certain things and still moan some but that doesn't mean I can't accept my life here. Oh and I did moan A LOT about the visas and processing here in the UK, but should I live elsewhere if that's the case?

The OP has just expressed what she was experiencing and was wondering if it's the same elsewhere in the country. She did generalise about it but I think she now knows it's not the case. Mind you, just in this forum, there are plenty of moaners so you can't just single her out because of what she posted.