Brits Can Bring Foreign Family To UK - Ruling

[Trefor]

Hello John, interesting post, B.A. accepted the booking with my wifes passport details, if they refuse to let her board then I will force the issue with arrest as BA would in fact be breaking the law.

My concern would be simply that they will not have the authority to make the decision locally in Spain, and need to speak with 'control' in the UK, who would roll out the party line and say their 'policy' is no visa no travel. Whether one is needed or not they can still have an outdated rule about who they choose to accommodate on their planes and come up with an excuse for it being there. Yes you may go to court that your wife was refused travel but their corporate legal team will probably decide it is worth sitting out.

I think I would jump in a car and drive to Calais and deal with UK Border directly.

[grahamw48]

Try Ryanair.

[johncar54]

Thanks for replying.

I will look forward to hearing that all went well.

On the arrest point. I am 100% certain that there is no power for anyone, including the police, to arrested anyone in these circumstances.

If a complaint was made to the police , they might investigate it and then submit it to their legal department for advice on how to proceed. If it was decided to go ahead I am almost 100% certain it would by way of summons. However, as I said, I very much doubt that BA refusing to allow a person to check in could possible be anything but a civil matter, in which case you would have to take any legal actions which you decided were appropriate. As McCarthy did in the ECJ. There is never any power of arrest in a civil case.

(Malolos: Having retired from the police in UK in 1988 I am admittedly a bit rusty, although I try to keep abreast of new legislation. I would advise you 'as a friend' do not do as you suggest no matter what happens. Almost certainly you would be arrested, at the very least for disorderly behaviour or maybe assault if you use any force, even like putting your hand an another person, and end up in court.


PS That BA accepted the booking does not mean they will not ask for other paperwork, say a visa, before they will let her check in. The same applies to everyone. One can book a flight and the airline will never seek to see a visa, passport etc. but on check-in, if to enter the country you are flying to, a particular document is required, they will insist you have it.

I would suggest that you check with BA before the departure date that they will not insist on a visa. Unfortunately I am pretty sure you will get the standard reply that I did, see my previous post.

[johncar54]

I have just had a friend ask me if, as a result of the ECJ finding, a Brit living in UK can take his wife to say, Spain, without having to obtain a Schengen Visa.

Any ideas/experience on this guys?

[Arthur Little]

I have just had a friend ask me if, as a result of the ECJ finding, a Brit living in UK can take his wife to say, Spain, without having to obtain a Schengen Visa?

Doubt it, John ... perhaps it's just my suspicious mind ... ... but, as is so often the case, there's bound to be a "catch" somewhere in that ruling.

Again, though ... ... I have been known to be wrong!

[Terpe]

I have just had a friend ask me if, as a result of the ECJ finding, a Brit living in UK can take his wife to say, Spain, without having to obtain a Schengen Visa.

Any ideas/experience on this guys?

As always it depends....
Anyone who is the holder of a Residence Card can travel within the EU without a Schenghen visa.

Those holders of a Spouse Visa under UK immigration rules have varying stories to tell.
Many bloggers have managed it and many have not. They seem to do these things just for making a point. Wouldn't be the kind of experience I'd want to face anyway.
I much prefer to have some security in my travel plans.

As has been stated before, to the largest extent the 'carriers' have the final say in line with their own organisational policy.
Travel by ferry appears to be offering the best chance of success.
Most 'bloggers' agree that a great deal of care and supporting documents are needed especially if crossing borders within the EU Schengen zone.

[Arthur Little]

Anyone who is the holder of a Residence Card can travel within the EU without a Schengen visa.

's true. ... fraid my earlier reply had been based on the Immigration Status of Spouse Visa holders as opposed to naturalised non~European marital partners already in possession of Residence Cards.

[johncar54]

A friend, she is the Filipino wife of a UK national (he also has Irish nationality) living with husband in Spain, she has permanent residencia.

Yesterday they went to British Consulate Madrid to get permission to travel together to UK for a holiday.

I thought they would get an EEA permit (free) but they were told she had to apply for a Visa, at cost of £110 plus courier costs when it is approved.

They asked what about the ECJ finding and were told that when/ if that ever became effective it would appear on the UK Gov web page.


I have looked at the page to apply for the EEA permit but it 'leads to' the visa application.

[Dedworth]

A friend, she is the Filipino wife of a UK national (he also has Irish nationality) living with husband in Spain, she has permanent residencia.

Yesterday they went to British Consulate Madrid to get permission to travel together to UK for a holiday.

I thought they would get an EEA permit (free) but they were told she had to apply for a Visa, at cost of £110 plus courier costs when it is approved.

They asked what about the ECJ finding and were told that when/ if that ever became effective it would appear on the UK Gov web page.


I have looked at the page to apply for the EEA permit but it 'leads to' the visa application.

These unaccountable bureaucrats are having a laugh

[johncar54]

A friend, she is the Filipino wife of a UK national (he also has Irish nationality) living with husband in Spain, she has permanent residencia.

Yesterday they went to British Consulate Madrid to get permission to travel together to UK for a holiday.

I thought they would get an EEA permit (free) but they were told she had to apply for a Visa, at cost of £110 plus courier costs when it is approved.

They asked what about the ECJ finding and were told that when/ if that ever became effective it would appear on the UK Gov web page.

They got the passport back yesterday with the visa.

[johncar54]

I asked immigration at Gibraltar Airport about this rule and their reply was my filipina wife is free to travel, we will put it to the test on January 31st.
If B.A. refuse to let her board I will force the issue by arresting them for breaking the law.
Watch this space.

7.2.15
Malolos: How did you get on ?

8.2.15 PS
I hope your 'no reply' does not mean you had 'serious problems' when booking in !!!

[johncar54]

My wife and I went to Gib yesterday. She was allowed in with her passport and Residencia, and me with my Irish PP. However, this time they took her papers to an office and apparently made a note of her visit. I was unable to establish why that was. They just said the 'system' is always changing !

PS They did not ask me if I wanted to visit Malolos !!!!!

[johncar54]

I am realy surprised there has not been a lot of posts about this. Anybody tried using the ECJ Finding, apart from Malolos (does anybody know where is ) ?

[johncar54]

Tis is an extract from:-
http://www.gov.uk/government/publica...residence-card

If you are a non-EEA national who holds a valid genuine residence card, issued to you as the family member of an EEA national who is exercising free movement rights in another EEA State (i.e. not your EEA relative’s Member State of nationality) under Article 10 of Directive 2004/38/EC (the ‘Free Movement Directive’), you may use this document for travel to the UK if you are accompanying your EEA national relative here, or joining your EEA national relative in the UK.

Has anybody used this provision ?

[johncar54]

Further.

I have just noticed the web page was updated yesterday, 11th May 2015, thus it must be the most up-to-date info.

I note that the extract I posted 3 days ago was not altered when it was up dated.

[johncar54]

This is an account of a friend who lives with his Filipino wife in Spain. She has permanent residence status.

I had sent them the copies of the advice (email) from the Border Force and from the UK Gov web page, as posted above.

He and his wife arrived in Manchester. She did have a visa as they had been advised by the British Consulate in Madrid she must have one. In an attempt to test if entry would be allowed without a visa, his wife showed her Philippines Passport photo page and her Spanish Residencia Card.

This is part of the email I just received from my friend:-

My wife needed to fill up a form with her details and then she was sent to an immigration office, the immigration officer took her fingerprints and checked her Spanish resident ID on the computer and also asked many questions about everything in the UK and about her visit and previous visits.

I ask if she need a visa to enter the UK, the immigration officer said, yes in case she gets stopped by immigration officers anywhere in the UK and he said it may depend on the border control.
.

[Dedworth]

Interesting ....

[fred]

John.. Wouldn't it be easier for long term foreign residents to apply for Spanish citizenship and become EU cits?

[johncar54]

Fred, my wife applied for Spanish Nationality but after a 3 years process she was refused.

I understand that it has become even harder now to prove that one is integrating into Spanish society, one of the requirements.

[johncar54]

error

[Dedworth]

I understand that it has become even harder now to prove that one is integrating into Spanish society, one of the requirements.

The UK has a lot to learn from Spain - here any Tom, Dick or Abdul isn't required to integrate and they don't. Look at France surrendered to Muslim ideology and now has the largest Muslim population in Europe - we are quickly following