TO APPEAL AND TO RE APPLY AT THE SAME TIME

[jenmick_hart]

Hello again everyone!!! most especially to Peter and Gina..
as my husband Mike mentioned it to me, about this two things as the options were going at the same time, to appeal and to re apply, could it be possible?!? please do need your advice, ideas, opinions, suggestions or comments to all here in the forum..looking forward it so.. Thanks and God bless us all!!!!

Jenny here in Cebu

[ginapeterb]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(jenny &#064; Jun 7 2006, 06&#58;41 PM) Quoted post</div><div class='quotemain'>
Hello again everyone&#33;&#33;&#33; most especially to Peter and Gina..
as my husband Mike mentioned it to me, about this two things as the options were going at the same time, to appeal and to re apply, could it be possible?&#33;? please do need your advice, ideas, opinions, suggestions or comments to all here in the forum..looking forward it so.. Thanks and God bless us all&#33;&#33;&#33;&#33;

Jenny here in Cebu
[/b][/quote]


Hello Jenny,


Gina and I have spoken to your husband Mike, and were delighted to make his acquaintance, Gina and I would like to express our deepest sympathies with your predicament, the first thing I want to tell you, is prepare yourself, because there is no doubt in my mind, that you will be coming to live in the United Kingdom in due course, its not a matter of &#39;IF&#39; its a matter of &#39;WHEN&#39;.

Having listened to what Mike had to say, I feel your case is very strong on appeal, and will no doubt be overturned and the British Embassy will be ordered to grant you a visa.

The Asylum and Immigrations Appeals Tribunal in the United Kingdom will hear your case if Mike files an appeal on your behalf, I have also advised him to try and get a interview with the Immigration Advisory Service here in the UK.

In answer to your question, firstly there is no reason why you cannot re-apply and make a fresh application, to the Embassy, however as I told Mike, there is always the risk that the application will be refused on the same grounds as before.

Therefore I advised Mike that you need to present the evidence of Income and expenditure in the form of a 6 month Excel worksheet detailing all income and expenses, this Excel worksheet must be accurate, the reason I am advising Mike to do this, is that this is what I was advised by professional Immigration lawyers in London, with whom I had an interview, I actually paid £100.00 for a 30 minute interview to receive exactly this information.

This will then give the Entry Clearance Officer a full birds eye of your husbands financial situation, then I would advise your husband to write a letter explaining the worksheet, this should show clear and presentable evidence that your husband can support you in the United Kingdom, without you needing recourse public funds.

This can easily be achieved by setting out a glossary in written form of how your husband will support you, with plenty of money to spare at the end of each month.

This will in my view convince the Entry Clearance officer that the previous decision was flawed, I hope that answers your questions, and yes, there is no reason why you cannot re-apply, but this time ensure there is compelling evidence along the lines I have illustrated.

The worksheet should look like this.


Mike Jennings - Sponsor to .......



Net Income for the Month.................£3000.00

Less Primary Expenses:


Mortgage/Rent £500.00

Council Tax £100.00

Water Charges £ 40.00

Electricity and Gas £ 40.00

so forth and so forth




Sub Total Expenses £1000.00 (for example)


Less : Car Loan payment £300.00 (for example)

Less: Bank Loan £200.00 (for example)

Less: Credit Cards £ xxx.00 (for example)

Less A.N. Other expenses.


Total all Fixed expenditure. £1700.00





Total Remaining Funds to sponsor the applicant wife £1300.00


Then the letter should sound along these lines.


Dear ECO ( with respect of Applicant Mrs Jennings - Application for Entry Clearance to UK)


I am writing in support of my wife...Mrs Jennings and would like to give you an overview of our relationship and my Financial situation with regards to supporting my wife in the United Kingdom and to supply such evidence to prove that my wife will not be a burden on the State.


I have visited the Republic of Philippines now no less than 6 times during the last 2 years and these trips have been financed from current Income and Salary.

As you can see from the attached spreadsheet, I am well able to support my wife from my Income without the need to recourse to public funds.

The Spreadsheet clearly shows a net disposable income of xxxxxx and this is more than enough to account for any additional expenditure in my household in support of my wife.

You may wish to consider also that my previous expenditure in financing 6 trips to the Philippines would not prevail after entry clearance has been granted, as there would be no need for my frequent visits, this would of course represent a significant saving on my household budget.

You may also wish to consider that costs of telephone calls, Texting and other communications services would reduce significantly when my wife is able to join me, naturally, there will be slight increase in council tax, a slight increase in water and electicity charges, but these would be nominal charges, and not represent any significant alterations to my budget statement before you.

I am confident of my ability to support my wife without recourse to public funds, and this assertion is supported by clearly documented evidence both from my budget statement, and from my P45 and Annual statement of Income, you may also wish to note that my Employer is Sony UK, a worldwide division of Sony World corporation, therefore my longevity within the company&#39;s current stucture is secure, as evidenced by a letter from my immediate superior at my place of work.

I am sure that when you take into account the above facts, and review the evidence placed before you, I am confident that you will grant my wife Entry Clearance to the United Kingdom, as my wife and I are anxious now to be re-united at our home in UK.

I remain sir/madam/miss your servant



Mike Jennings



This represents a summary of what I would write in your circumstances, the other question you posed, is whether it would be possible to appeal at the same time as re-applying, I see no reason why you should nto do that, A bird in the hand is worth 2 in the bush.

To appeal and be given an appeal date is a good move, in the meantime, you should proceed and re-apply, there is no harm in that.

I feel confident Jenny that when you re-submit a new application, along with a budget statement as I have suggested, and a covering letter clearly showing those **** for brains civil servant types at the British Embassy, Manila, then they will have no alternative than to grant an entry clearance visa, only a deep rooted buffoon with a brain the size of a pea will fail to see that they have no choice.

I hope this helps.


take Care Pete

[jenmick_hart]

Thanks a lot Pete and Gina, for this brilliant words on the reply, yes it is a big help to us with Mike, in this

additional information and some more papers to present for my re applying of visa as soon as

possible and for the taking into actions to appeal both at the same time.. and again would like to express

our gratitude with my husband Mike regarding this matter and im so glad we&#39;ve found this site and be an

active member on the club , as full of genuine mission and goal to help and guide others on here and in

some more to interact with the different topic and information to be discussed which i found it quite lots

interesting to me...KEEP IT ALL UP AND MORE POWER&#33;&#33;&#33;&#33;&#33;

Jenny from Cebu

[ginapeterb]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(jenny &#064; Jun 7 2006, 09&#58;51 PM) Quoted post</div><div class='quotemain'>
Thanks a lot Pete and Gina, for this brilliant words on the reply, yes it is a big help to us with Mike, in this

additional information and some more papers to present for my re applying of visa as soon as

possible and for the taking into actions to appeal both at the same time.. and again would like to express

our gratitude with my husband Mike regarding this matter and im so glad we&#39;ve found this site and be an

active member on the club , as full of genuine mission and goal to help and guide others on here and in

some more to interact with the different topic and information to be discussed which i found it quite lots

interesting to me...KEEP IT ALL UP AND MORE POWER&#33;&#33;&#33;&#33;&#33;

Jenny from Cebu
[/b][/quote]



Its not PEOPLE POWER &#33;&#33;&#33; ITS APPLICANT POWER &#33;&#33;&#33;&#33;

[baboyako]

you are not allowed to re-apply when an appeal is pending.

[img]style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/Doh.gif[/img]

[ginapeterb]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(baboyako &#064; Jun 8 2006, 08&#58;29 PM) Quoted post</div><div class='quotemain'>
you are not allowed to re-apply when an appeal is pending.

[img]style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/Doh.gif[/img]
[/b][/quote]


The apeal is not pending at the moment, as it has not been applied for, as far as Mike has made clear, he is weighing up his options at the moment, I was merely suggesting he could re-apply, with the new Documentary evidence, and at the same time he could consider appealing the original decision, with time lapses, he may get away with it.

Of course its his decision, and if you make a statement again like this, ( please back it up with a link or documentary evidence that can be read by others, so that I and others don&#39;t give out bum advice)

If your assertions are correct, I am the first one to stand corrected, however, until you place a link before us, so that we can all check it, then it makes it difficult to see if you are right in this.

Pete

[baboyako]

DSP CHAPTER 27
27.9 - Fresh application while an appeal is outstanding
There is nothing in law to prevent a person who has an appeal pending from making a fresh application for entry clearance. Therefore while it may be appropriate to invite or encourage an appeal to be withdrawn it would be wrong to require a person to withdraw an appeal before allowing a further application to be made. Note that if the appellant is given leave to enter the United Kingdom, either a result of being issued with entry clearance or not, any outstanding appeal will be deemed abandoned.

My statement was just what I have heard. I&#39;m not a lawyer, but I&#39;m sure a lawyer would say that you need to formally withdrawl an appeal. I&#39;m not going to back that up any further. I am going to apply again, I would encourage other people to re-apply, I don&#39;t know how many appeals are successful, I don&#39;t know how many reapplictions are successful. I dont know how many people look for legal advise on the internet/in a chat room.

I do know that if I were in the situation of applying & appealing I would go and visit a lawyer first.

am I off the hook now?

Just for comparison..

27.14 - Re-applications on an identical basis
The Rules set no limit on the number of applications a person may make and where appropriate each refusal carries a right of appeal. In the case of a repeat application which was subject to an earlier appeal, relevant papers may be annexed to the new explanatory statement - there is no need to repeat the whole history of the case.

I.e. Just add the bit of information that they are unbalanced (probability wise) about & its a straightforward process.

[ivor&mel]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(baboyako &#064; Jun 9 2006, 08&#58;09 PM) Quoted post</div><div class='quotemain'>DSP CHAPTER 27
[/b][/quote]Still learning - I was not aware of a DSP site - it&#39;s Diplomatic Service Procedures for anyone else as dumb as me [img]style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/Hellooo.gif[/img] Chapter (and verse) are here. Must have a good read of it sometime [img]style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile.gif[/img]

[russ01539]

Pete, I think Baboyako is correct.

I was refused and took legal advise on this very matter. On the application form for the visa application there is a question, which goes something like this. 'Have you ever previously applied for a visa, or is there any current appeals pending in regard to a similiar visa application by yourself ?

They do cross check this according to my Immigration advisor/lawyer, and if you make a false statement they fail both second application and on the appeal.

Personally we sent a bundle of documents in the form of an appeal, and also a covering letter requesting that the embassy themsleves review the new documents and then issue a visa, and if they were'nt prepared to do that they then register the new documents as part of our appeal.

Incidentally they never reviewed the new documents until 3 days before they had to reply with their evidence for refusal to the appeal court. At this point they could clearly see they were in the wrong, and issued the visa as originally requested in my covering letter. So although we were originally refused we gave the embassy in Manilla the chance to review the new evidence before appeal. It speeded things up by about 3 months.

On the other hand it is possible to appeal and re-apply, but the timing would have to be so precise I wouldnt advise doing it that way,cos the consequences are too great if your found out.

[russ01539]

I just found this out too.

If the new evidence submitted for appeal is reviewed by the embassy before appeal and a visa is issued, but at the same time a date has been set for appeal, then if the appeal date is not cancelled ( a wriiten request by the appelant/sponsor will do) and the appeal court ruled in favour of the embassy then the appeal courts' decision overules that of the issuing embassy.

Statistically this has never happened from the Manilla embassy, but it has happened before, particularly in countries where we only have Consulates. The Consulate has previously been a bit lazy, and just sent the relevant items pertaining to them issuing a refusal, but not linking the grounds for appeal, then on receipt of the appeal bundle documentation from the appelant issue a visa, but dont advise the appeal court that this has been done. I was told about this from my solicitor who was fighting case for a Trinidadian guy who was in the UK illegally without even realsing it !!!

[ginapeterb]

well it is certainly good to know the above, however its a rarety, that we see anything go this stage, but its worth knowing, sadly those seeking information rarely use the search function on this website, no doubt it will be trawled up again at some stage.

But thanks for the information.

[KeithD]

This should help them trawl Pete....